How do you open lock gates ?

[Hudds Lad]

41 minutes ago, booke23 said:

Is anyone still using the working boat method of bashing into the bottom gate and leaving the boat in gear while you open the paddles and stand there until the boat opens the gates and enters all by itself? Ditto as you then fill the lock......(Asking for a friend) 

We met a chap at Hillmorton as we were coming down the top lock, he approached the opposite lock to come up and was shouting "Is it empty?", J told him not really as it had about a foot or so in, he then mumbled something incoherent and proceeded to ram his way in.  

[system 4-50]

I find it more effective to push the beam from the correct side rather than the other side.  This is based on the experience of several occasions.  I worked this out all by myself, without any volockies telling me.

[dogless]

I do whatever I choose to and it's got nothing to do with volunteers.

 

Rog

[blackrose]

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Using your back allows the use of the strongest muscles in your body - your thighs

 

That's the reason I use my back against the beam - your arms are weaker than your legs. But I wouldn't tell anyone else how they should do it unless specifically asked. 

[ditchcrawler]

How about this, it was after he had been sitting on the beam with it against his ear.

 

[magnetman]

I always breasted gates open when I was traveling in my narrow Boat. No need to strike anything. Pirelli P6000 tyre wrapped around the stem so nothing can get caught. 

 

There was a geyser at Hanwell flight once who berated me and informed me that they would take away my licence. He then proceeded to tie his Boat to the egress ladder top rails while descending. I did have to politely point out that tying a heavy Boat to key clamp railings is never wise and the egress ladder is a safety feature in case people fall in the chamber. Break off the top rail and it is very difficult to use. Loosen the top rail and someone is going to hold it and end up in the water with it on top of them. And the idiot was telling me off for gently breasting a gate open !! 

Edited July 25 by magnetman
edited massively important error the likes of which are rarely encountered

[Midnight]

Bum against the beam for me but wouldn't be happy with a vlockie insisting I did it that way.

[magnetman]

23 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

That's the reason I use my back against the beam - your arms are weaker than your legs. But I wouldn't tell anyone else how they should do it unless specifically asked. 

 

there is a risk associated with pushing backwards onto a balance beam. If one were to slip the spine is quite exposed. Do the wrong thing with the spine and it could turn out nasty. One reason to never put your windlass in the back of the belt. 

 

I always push balance beams with the bum and legs and also hold on so if the feet do slip it is not serious. 

[Stilllearning]

5 hours ago, Stroudwater1 said:

Coming up Braunston locks the other week a vlockie was most insistent that we opened the top gates using our backs against the gates. 

 

We tend to open locks pushing foreward with arms stretched out and body  low to the ground, pushing as far to the end as safe and possible. This seems to give a  mechanical advantage, and allows us to sometimes open gates sooner than just leaning as the vlockie advised. A number of times around the network we wouldn’t have opened gates using the back against the lockgate way of pushing. 

 

Other advantages of pushing forewards - you can keep an eye on your boat, check no one’s pulling the lock open and about to fall in and see what’s ahead of you so get your feet on the steps where there are any and avoid “stuff” on the ground where there is some. 
Opening the gate earlier will conserve fractionally more water as the whole lock exit occurs a little faster. 
 

The vlockie told all of us around it was better for our backs to push from behind. I’m not aware of this, and if as can happen the gate opens rapidly or you trip going backwards you could fall backwards. What was troubling is this is being taken as Gospel by others on the flight. On the way back down we were reprimanded by another boater for daring to open the gate without using our backs. 
 

The fact that you can’t start to close most gates using the Vlockies preferred posture wasn’t considered at the time. 
 

Is this new vlockie training, is it how others open locks? 

I'm with you on the benefits of using arms and stretching out and pushing, but not always, it does depend on the lock.

[ditchcrawler]

As someone who suffers with their back I would always put my bum against it and use the strength in my legs.

[1st ade]

I use my backside on the Balance Beam - with my knees very slightly bent... The biggest advantage (to me) is that when the gate starts to move, you push about two inches and your knee naturally locks - while the lock makes a proper level. Other techniques mean you start to open the gate, then the rush of water slams it shut again.

[Tacet]

54 minutes ago, 1st ade said:

I use my backside on the Balance Beam - with my knees very slightly bent... The biggest advantage (to me) is that when the gate starts to move, you push about two inches and your knee naturally locks - while the lock makes a proper level. Other techniques mean you start to open the gate, then the rush of water slams it shut again.

The first step following the straightening the knees to crack the gates can have you forced back, particularly on single top gate locks where the arc of the masonry does not allow much water through.

 

Like most others, I mostly push with legs.  An exception can be closing bottom gates on single locks.  As you have to start with a pull anyway it is not always worth moving to the other side of the beam.  But if the next stage in the process is to leap the gap to the far gate, you need to be on the push-to-close side anyway, so moving round the beam to push is a fair option.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

As someone who suffers with their back I would always put my bum against it and use the strength in my legs.

that reminds me,

I had a friend come visit and they had a bad lower back,

after making sure they were still happy to do locks I suggested they keep their back straight while pushing with their arse/lower back and using their legs. 
They went home in a much better state after exercising properly. 
Tardebigge flight too. 

[IanD]

3 hours ago, magnetman said:

 

there is a risk associated with pushing backwards onto a balance beam. If one were to slip the spine is quite exposed. Do the wrong thing with the spine and it could turn out nasty. One reason to never put your windlass in the back of the belt. 

 

I always push balance beams with the bum and legs and also hold on so if the feet do slip it is not serious. 

 

All you normally need to do is put your elbows or arms behind you on top of the beam, so they hold you up if your feet slip. Assuming the beam is at the right height, obviously... 😉 

[Pluto]

On the L&LC in the 1970s, the method depended upon how the balance beams had been fitted, often incorrectly for the canal. The first two photos show balance beams fitted too low, both wood and iron. The L&LC balance beams were built from two sections, the outer, on which you shoved, being fitted on top of the inner, which former the top of the gate. For several years, no one seemed to notice that the gates were built incorrectly. The opposite happened with some steel gates, with the balance beam being almost at head height! When a proper set of gates were set correctly, you just had to lean on the beam watching your boat ascend/descend until you felt a slight 'relaxing' of the gate, telling you the levels were equal, and it was then a simple and easy matter to open and close the gates. A few badly set gates were difficult to move, particularly on Wigan flight, where the subsidence had made balancing the gates a problem. If there are so many problems with difficult to move gates today, I would suggest it is something those hanging the gates ought to sort out. Perhaps they don't know how to do it today, but the canal-trained carpenters I used to know certainly did.

 

To open gates, you have to pull the gates out of the gate recess for both top and bottom gates, and this should be the most strenuous part of opening or closing gates if the levels are correct. It can only be done by pulling using your arms. The L&LC provided iron staples on the lock side next to the end of the beam to hold your feet whilst doing this. Once out of the gate recess, the weight of your body should be enough to complete opening or closing, and could be done from either side of the beam, with your back or belly.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

3 minutes ago, Pluto said:

To open gates, you have to pull the gates out of the gate recess for both top and bottom gates, and this should be the most strenuous part of opening or closing gates if the levels are correct. It can only be done by pulling using your arms.

Coming up farmers bridge recently I did the last half dozen gates by pulling on them like I was on a rowing 

machine, step back and pull again step back and pull again,

it was quite a proper little work out but the beams are at an ideal height for me to do that. 
Would have been much easier to step around and use me bum but like I say it was a good little workout on some very weak muscles. 
I nearly said to some bloke with his gym bag “‘ere this’d save you a few quid”. 

[system 4-50]

I made a stave? of wood to fit into the metal loop found on some beams to give myself an extra few feet of leverage.  I stopped using it but I can't remember why.  It may have been that it wasn't worth the weight of carrying it.  Or it may have been that it encouraged taking a step over the edge of the stonework!

[robtheplod]

I'm not sure I'll have to ask the missus!

[Ken X]

30 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

I made a stave? of wood to fit into the metal loop found on some beams to give myself an extra few feet of leverage.  I stopped using it but I can't remember why.  It may have been that it wasn't worth the weight of carrying it.  Or it may have been that it encouraged taking a step over the edge of the stonework!

They have something similar on the top gate balance beams at Evesham lock on the Avon. There are sliding extensions which you can pull out of the end of the balance beam to give extra leverage. Around three feet long Iong IIRC.

[ditchcrawler]

37 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

I made a stave? of wood to fit into the metal loop found on some beams to give myself an extra few feet of leverage.  I stopped using it but I can't remember why.  It may have been that it wasn't worth the weight of carrying it.  Or it may have been that it encouraged taking a step over the edge of the stonework!

Handy down the bottom of the S Stratford, one or them is a real pig to move 

[TheBiscuits]

 

I'm a bum pusher.

 

If we're allowed to say that these days!

 

But so's my wife!

 

If we're allowed to say that these days too!

 

I did used to be a rugby forward if that excuses me ... 

 

🛶 🍻 😁

 

 

[magnetman]

I did see someone open a lock gate with a mini digger once. 

 

Effortless at least thats how it looked. 

 

Being on the River these days I open the gates by pressing a button. Terribly arduous really. 

 

 

[cuthound]

4 minutes ago, magnetman said:

I did see someone open a lock gate with a mini digger once. 

 

Effortless at least thats how it looked. 

 

Being on the River these days I open the gates by pressing a button. Terribly arduous really. 

 

 

 

Sounds like an essential bit of canalling kit, especially with the reduced maintenance these days. It could also be used for a bit of spot dredging should you run aground.

 

I foresee an increase in tug style boats so that the mini digger can be readily accommodated.

[Ronaldo47]

On narrow canals with single top gates where the beam has to rotate through 90°, when the gate is in the open position to allow transit of a boat, there is nothing solid to stand on to push from, so pulling is your only realistic option to get the gate moving.

[Jerra]

9 hours ago, IanD said:

 

How, before the boater has even opened a paddle or gate? I've seen plenty of people who look like experienced old boaters -- some even wearing neckerchiefs/waistcoats/flat caps -- who don't seem to have much of a clue, so you obviously can't go by appearance. Maybe volockies are supposed to be clairvoyant? 😉 

They can't be or they would know I want them to keep away from the lock and let me get on with it.