Jerra

Democracy: a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives. By that definition IMO a referendum is democratic or of course we could just let parliament decided we should stay in which would be equally democratic.

But as we have been told countless times Bexiteers those who don't cast their vote don't count and shouldn't be considered. Are you now changing your view?

You do realise that that would make it even easier for the vote to be remain? I would be delighted, if we are lucky enough to get a second referendum I will encourage all the Brexiteers I know to join your campaign.

I haven't found any reference which suggests the second half of yours which dictionary did you get it from?

If any dictionary had ever heard of xenophily I might be able to answer. If perchance you mean xenophile then I would have said very possibly as it would mean a person who likes strangers.

Perhaps not for you but read back over thread. See how often words to the effect of we don't want told what to do by Johnie Foreigner" are used. The distrust of Germany because we once or twice had a war with them. We have had wars with France but not quite the same distrust. There is a definite dislike of those who come here under the freedom of movement and so it goes on. It may be complete nonsense as far as you are concerned but sadly that is how it comes over both here and in the general everyday living. I would also suggest that a person can be xenophobic about foreigners and still be happy to travel to their country.

I suspect xenophobia with regard to continental countries is the real reason many Brexiteers vote leave.

Why should they? Farage said before the referendum 52% remain would be unfinished business. Why should that be acceptable for leave but not for remain?

A bit of a sweeping statement Mike. Tongue in cheek? I live in an area of virtually no immigration and house prices are high.

Freedom of movement to the vast majority of people (as you well know, see my comment above about Brexiteers trying to twist what you say) means being able to move to another country to live and work, which is what immigration is. Which is exactly why it was brought in you however in typical Brexit fashion are choosing to try to pretend I implied I was against all immigration because I happened to use the colloquialism.

A classic example of a Brexiteer. Sees a post they don't like so pretends to misunderstand and tries to make it seem you said what you actually didn't. As we didn't sign Shengen this wonderful sovereign government you are so keen on could have prevented immigration had they wanted to. What makes you so sure they will prevent it if we ever leave the EU?

The problem is that 52% of those who voted thought it was to their advantage currently we don't know how many still think that. The thought of an Brexiteers only continue to try to denigrate those who want to remain as they don't have the logical arguments to undermine the opposing position. They think if they publicly denigrate remaining if we are ever lucky enough to get a vote on what is on offer some will vote leave because they don't want to be classed as cowards. There is another possible reason: They are naturally nasty bullying people.

This is without doubt true. The trick however is to only change when things are going to be to your advantage not change for changes sake.

SO NATO is spending money on an army you say they don't have. Interesting if however your are merely talking about the "club" HQ there is no reason why the HQ for an EU army couldn't be the already existing infra structure. The gulf war pragmatically used a command structure already in place and as in my model they have already when they set up the structure there would be no problem the structure would already exist. Does it already exist in NATO operations? Why do we need an army? Well if we are part of NATO to provide personnel for any action they may take, if we were part of an EU army would we really need one other than our contribution to the EU military. We could easily have a small force of some sort in UK for dealing with emergencies etc. Do you realistically envisage the UK ever again taking unilateral military action?

Firstly look back at my posts I suggest the command structure will be worked out in the decision to set up the army... I doubt anybody is daft enough to set out to form an army with no command structure. Incidentally where does the command structure for any joint military operation NATO or as in the Gulf War, it has either been decided in advance (as I suggest) or is decided as and when needed. I don't see it weakening NATO unless of course NATO keeps a command structure in place and operational even when they have no troops on the ground. I assume perhaps wrongly that when NATO needs command structure it draws military from the nationals taking part - including officers. The same could happen still but the troops would be European not from a range of countries. Why wouldn't the EU be prepared to work with NATO? Individual countries do now. Does NATO currently maintain all this "real estate" for its officers etc? If the EU had an army the individual countries could ease back on their "real estate" reducing your worry about duplication. Come to think of it why would individual countries need their own armies.