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Stephen Sugg

Jam 'Ole Run

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7 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

My security blocks this site for some reason.

OK.

One short - altering course to starboard

Two short - altering course to port [gave this to a big plastic hire boat in a Thames lock cut. Didn't stop them panicking and diving for the bank (wrong side)]

Three short - engine(s) astern

Four short, then one short - about to turn around to starboard

Four short - about to turn around to port

 

Not ones I ever heard:

Five short - I do not understand your intentions - keep clear!

One long (4 - 6 seconds) [a good lungfull on a trumpet!] - I am about to get under way / am entering a fairway [a bit yachty!] / am entering a blind bend.

One long, two short - am unable to manoeuvre / not under command

Two long one short - am about to overtake on your starboard side

Two long, two short - am about to overtake on your port side

One long, one short, one long, one short - I agree to be overtaken

 

I presume if the last is not responded to it's time to load canon.

 

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2 hours ago, Derek R. said:

OK.

One short - altering course to starboard

Two short - altering course to port [gave this to a big plastic hire boat in a Thames lock cut. Didn't stop them panicking and diving for the bank (wrong side)]

Three short - engine(s) astern

Four short, then one short - about to turn around to starboard

Four short - about to turn around to port

 

Not ones I ever heard:

Five short - I do not understand your intentions - keep clear!

One long (4 - 6 seconds) [a good lungfull on a trumpet!] - I am about to get under way / am entering a fairway [a bit yachty!] / am entering a blind bend.

One long, two short - am unable to manoeuvre / not under command

Two long one short - am about to overtake on your starboard side

Two long, two short - am about to overtake on your port side

One long, one short, one long, one short - I agree to be overtaken

 

I presume if the last is not responded to it's time to load canon.

 

I always had difficulty remembering which was "I am going to overtake" and which was "I agree to be overtaken" until again I thought of it in Morse code.

 

Long, long, short is letter G for "Going to overtake" 

Long, short, long, short is letter C for "Come on then" 

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5 hours ago, Derek R. said:

One long, one short, one long, one short - I agree to be overtaken

 

I presume if the last is not responded to it's time to load canon.

The overtaking craft often gets as far as your bow wave and can't get any further.  Particularly if you wind it on a bit.  Of course, you have your back to him and take no notice of his screaming engine.

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6 hours ago, Derek R. said:

One long, one short, one long, one short - I agree to be overtaken

 

I presume if the last is not responded to it's time to load canon.

What, so you can take the other vessels photo with a Japanese camera?  :giggles:

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8 hours ago, Derek R. said:

 

Not ones I ever heard:

 

One long (4 - 6 seconds) [a good lungfull on a trumpet!] - I am about to get under way / am entering a fairway [a bit yachty!] / am entering a blind bend.

 

 

I presume if the last is not responded to it's time to load canon.

 

Salters use that on the Thames

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1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

Salters use that on the Thames

In the old days the steamers blew approaching every lock, so the lockies could give them priority.  Not P.C. nowadays, of course.  Commercial craft no longer have priority, not even coalboats! 

I believe brown envelopes at Christmas came into it.

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58 minutes ago, Chris Williams said:

In the old days the steamers blew approaching every lock, so the lockies could give them priority.  Not P.C. nowadays, of course.  Commercial craft no longer have priority, not even coalboats! 

I believe brown envelopes at Christmas came into it.

He he. Did they not used to fund the xmas "do" for the lockies?

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7 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

In the old days the steamers blew approaching every lock, so the lockies could give them priority.  Not P.C. nowadays, of course.  Commercial craft no longer have priority, not even coalboats! 

I believe brown envelopes at Christmas came into it.

Indeed, I've been on a number of runs on the Thames on coal boats in recent years, and we expect to wait our turn in order of arrival. However it depends of course on what there's room left for as a lock fills up with boats, you get a wide variety of different sized craft on the Thames, and the lock keepers are pretty good at judging whether someone can safely fit into a remaining gap. We don't run to such a tight schedule as Salters, and the lock keepers will sometimes ask other boats to let them go first because they need the whole lock to themselves and are trying to follow a timetable. Generally a bit of polite negotiation goes a long way, and Salters or anyone else in a particular hurry is allowed to overtake. The same applies on the canals; most people will let through a hire boat that's late getting back to base if they don't get off on the wrong foot.

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Indeed politeness goes a long way.  Unfortunately some people just get uptight.

I once had a Summer Assistant lockie tell me to turn off my engine, so I made a great show of going into the engine 'ole and shutting down the diesel.  When the lock was empty, I again went into the engine 'ole.  It took several attempts to re-start, strangely.

The proper lockie arrived and told the assistant "Don't ever ask a monkey boat to turn off his engine".   The same applies to Salters and other trip boats.  Some boaters get annoyed about that. 

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On 07/02/2019 at 12:56, Chris Williams said:

Sorry, didn't realise it was that old!  Perhaps threads should be put into an Archive folder once replies have stopped.

I found it interesting looking back at some of the old stuff. I'd not seen the 1995 Jam 'ole film before. We'd taken our beurtschip Friesland to France just before that, but it brought back memories seeing our bantam and other boats outside the Toll House at Bulls Bridge. When we were running grain from Tilbury to Weybrige there was never any question that we'd turn the motors off in Thames locks. Nor when we were delivering their winter supplies of coal to all the lock-keepers, other than when we were actually off loading it (but that was back in the 70s too).

 

Tam

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That assistant lockie was the only time I was ever asked to turn off the engine.

The fire risk with a diesel is when you are starting it with a dam great electric starter.

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6 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

Indeed politeness goes a long way.  Unfortunately some people just get uptight.

I once had a Summer Assistant lockie tell me to turn off my engine, so I made a great show of going into the engine 'ole and shutting down the diesel.  When the lock was empty, I again went into the engine 'ole.  It took several attempts to re-start, strangely.

The proper lockie arrived and told the assistant "Don't ever ask a monkey boat to turn off his engine".   The same applies to Salters and other trip boats.  Some boaters get annoyed about that. 

Yes I had the same once on the Thames. When I asked "why? " I was told that it was fire haxzaard to leave my engine running in a lock, which demonstrates how much attention he had been giving on his trainng course. I refused to do as he requested and he called for the full time Lock Keeper,who confirmed that the actual reason was that captains may not hear the Lock Keeper's instructions if they wwere drowned out by a noisy engine, but as I was single handing and already on the lockside, holding the boat on two ropes, the need to turn the engine off was irrelevant.

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8 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

Indeed politeness goes a long way.  Unfortunately some people just get uptight.

I once had a Summer Assistant lockie tell me to turn off my engine, so I made a great show of going into the engine 'ole and shutting down the diesel.  When the lock was empty, I again went into the engine 'ole.  It took several attempts to re-start, strangely.

The proper lockie arrived and told the assistant "Don't ever ask a monkey boat to turn off his engine".   The same applies to Salters and other trip boats.  Some boaters get annoyed about that. 

Yes ive done the same

’are you sure?’

ok

 

on restart into engine room bang crash, fiddle check oil go for a pee . Then fiddle with engine starts badly smoke everywhere. Goes out on retun to counter..

back to engine room bang crash pop. Starts with huge bang clouds of smoke etc

 

exit lock.  Past seething Q of uphill white plastic. Strangely dont get asked again.

 

those old listers...with a starter.

 

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I appreciate the problem with a noisy engine, but you could hardly hear that Lister on tick-over, with the tall pipe on.  Not sure how the kid knew it was still running.

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I was told to turn my HA2 off once when going up The Thames.

I asked why, and was told, because I told you to.

I replied that I'd travelled through half a dozen or so locks and nobody had wanted the engine off before. It was a hand start and could be tricky when hot.

He advised me that was my problem and he wasn't operating the lock until I had.  I looked around at the other boats in the lock and everyone was staring at me.

 

So I jumped into the engine 'ole and switched off the fuel pump.  In 20 seconds she'd stopped spinning, and I climbed out to watch the other boats leaving the now full lock.

Come on I was told with an impatient wave of the lock keepers arm.  

No can do, like I said it'll need to cool down before I attempt starting it, we're staying here.

He was narked, pull it out then! He shouted.

I answered "It weighs over 20 tons, you pull it out" He declined, actually he ignored me.

We sat on the front and rode up and down three times.  Nobody asked us again, nor on the return trip.

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18 minutes ago, zenataomm said:

I was told to turn my HA2 off once when going up The Thames.

I asked why, and was told, because I told you to.

I replied that I'd travelled through half a dozen or so locks and nobody had wanted the engine off before. It was a hand start and could be tricky when hot.

He advised me that was my problem and he wasn't operating the lock until I had.  I looked around at the other boats in the lock and everyone was staring at me.

 

So I jumped into the engine 'ole and switched off the fuel pump.  In 20 seconds she'd stopped spinning, and I climbed out to watch the other boats leaving the now full lock.

Come on I was told with an impatient wave of the lock keepers arm.  

No can do, like I said it'll need to cool down before I attempt starting it, we're staying here.

He was narked, pull it out then! He shouted.

I answered "It weighs over 20 tons, you pull it out" He declined, actually he ignored me.

We sat on the front and rode up and down three times.  Nobody asked us again, nor on the return trip.

I can't claim any of the glory of an ancient or venerable engine, mine is only a Beta 43 but it is cocooned in a forward position in a 70' boat. I've been from Oxford to Brentford without anyone asking me to turn it off - they can't hear it so aren't troubled by it. I'm sure I could run it for 24 hours on a visitor mooring without complaint.

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Last time this happened a load of boats came speeding past late at night, woke everyone up on our mooring, and tore peoples mooring pins out of the ground, not to mention abusing the locks , slamming gates, and dropping paddle gears.

 

They have no right to do that. 

 

 

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Regarding locks, in my copy of the Thames Conservancy Launch Digest (1973) it does say, "stop your engine."

Has it been up dated?

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On 08/02/2019 at 18:22, Chris Williams said:

In the old days the steamers blew approaching every lock, so the lockies could give them priority.  Not P.C. nowadays, of course.  Commercial craft no longer have priority, not even coalboats! 

I believe brown envelopes at Christmas came into it.

I don't know if you are referring to long distance commercial boats with the brown envelope s? but in my carrying days not that I would have wanted to but with the rates paid no way could I have afforded it

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5 minutes ago, X Alan W said:

I don't know if you are referring to long distance commercial boats with the brown envelope s? but in my carrying days not that I would have wanted to but with the rates paid no way could I have afforded it

I vaguely remember David Blagrove book hinting that Salters sponsored the lockies do.

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12 hours ago, CompairHolman said:

Last time this happened a load of boats came speeding past late at night, woke everyone up on our mooring, and tore peoples mooring pins out of the ground, not to mention abusing the locks , slamming gates, and dropping paddle gears.

 

They have no right to do that. 

 

 

You cant say that about historic boats on the Jam Hole run, you will have half the members here up in arms.  :ninja:?

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1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

You cant say that about historic boats on the Jam Hole run, you will have half the members here up in arms.  :ninja:?

Not from me.  I have never been on it but IMO the idea is to commemorate the last commercial carrying NOT to match its timings.

 

Sadly some boaters do the latter and do (ex)working boats and boaters no favours.

 

Having said that, the virtual continuous line of continuous moorers now encountered down south would try the patience of a saint!

 

George

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On ‎08‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 17:22, Chris Williams said:

In the old days the steamers blew approaching every lock, so the lockies could give them priority.  Not P.C. nowadays, of course.  Commercial craft no longer have priority, not even coalboats! 

I believe brown envelopes at Christmas came into it.

I was referring to Salters steamers with the brown envelopes, not monkey boats.  

As I said before - how long before the whole system becomes a linear boat mooring?

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1 hour ago, Chris Williams said:

I was referring to Salters steamers with the brown envelopes, not monkey boats.  

As I said before - how long before the whole system becomes a linear boat mooring?

A few years ago I organised a weekend away for our IWA group that included going down to Henley on a Salters Steamer, Chatting to the skipper while waiting for a lock he told me he would have priority if it was his Timetabled run but as it was charter he had to wait his turn. 

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2 hours ago, furnessvale said:

Not from me.  I have never been on it but IMO the idea is to commemorate the last commercial carrying NOT to match its timings.

 

Sadly some boaters do the latter and do (ex)working boats and boaters no favours.

 

Having said that, the virtual continuous line of continuous moorers now encountered down south would try the patience of a saint!

 

George

You could have a canal system without any on line moorings like the ye  olde  days  , and the boats left could cut about the system at 4 mph non stop, you could reenact deliveries to long gone jam factories as much as you want, however you will have to pay the share of all the licences of the boats you get rid of. Good luck with your £10,000 per year licence. 

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