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Cratch and Cover


TomIre

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Thinking of doing away with cratch board and cover.  Here's my thinking. I will have a full pram cover on my cruiser stern. So I will have a large sheltered space for muddy boots, wet dogs on bad weather days. Doing away with the cratch and cover means access on and off the bow will be easier.  I suspect if I have a cover I'd just end up using it for "junk storage".

Am I missing anything?

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24 minutes ago, TomIre said:

Thinking of doing away with cratch board and cover.  Here's my thinking. I will have a full pram cover on my cruiser stern. So I will have a large sheltered space for muddy boots, wet dogs on bad weather days. Doing away with the cratch and cover means access on and off the bow will be easier.  I suspect if I have a cover I'd just end up using it for "junk storage".

Am I missing anything?

 

Yes, possibly. How is rain falling in the foredeck dealt with, once you get rid of the cover?

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A front cratch cover means you have somewhere dry to store logs, coal etc. rather on the roof or inside the boat. Unless it is raining heavily, when we are boating the cratch cover at the towpath side is open and thrown back over the cratch board allowing easy access to the front deck.

 

hagis

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25 minutes ago, TomIre said:

Should drain via scuppers unless they get blocked by leaf/debris. 

 

Should? Where does it say that?

 

On one of my boats the foredeck is lower than water level, so any scuppers would let water in, not out. This means the cratch always needs to be on, unless I fancy relying on the forward bilge pump.

 

 

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2 hours ago, TomIre said:

Thinking of doing away with cratch board and cover.  Here's my thinking. I will have a full pram cover on my cruiser stern. So I will have a large sheltered space for muddy boots, wet dogs on bad weather days. Doing away with the cratch and cover means access on and off the bow will be easier.  I suspect if I have a cover I'd just end up using it for "junk storage".

Am I missing anything?

 

When we had crew on the boat with us they used to love riding in the front well deck, if it was raining they would part open the cover but keep dry sitting on the opposite side. Perhaps a minor consideration though.

 

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12 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

When we had crew on the boat with us they used to love riding in the front well deck, if it was raining they would part open the cover but keep dry sitting on the opposite side. Perhaps a minor consideration though.

 

Not really a minor consideration imho, someone once described it to me as the nearest thing to feeling like you are on a flying carpet....the cover at the side shielded the engine noise as to be almost non existent.   

 

Why take it away?  you can roll up the sides and fasten if you mostly want to use it as an entrance way. The comfort for your passengers will be appreciated. 

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3 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Should? Where does it say that?

 

On one of my boats the foredeck is lower than water level, so any scuppers would let water in, not out. This means the cratch always needs to be on, unless I fancy relying on the forward bilge pump.

 

 

 

Sounds like a poor design to me. You're relying on a canvas cover or a pump to stop it filling up with water and potentially sinking. Plenty of boats have decks or holds lower than the water level of course, but given the choice a bow well deck that's below the water level is definitely an inferior design to an above the waterline self-draining deck.

 

6 hours ago, TomIre said:

Thinking of doing away with cratch board and cover.  Here's my thinking. I will have a full pram cover on my cruiser stern. So I will have a large sheltered space for muddy boots, wet dogs on bad weather days. Doing away with the cratch and cover means access on and off the bow will be easier.  I suspect if I have a cover I'd just end up using it for "junk storage".

Am I missing anything?

 

Is this a new boat (to you)?

 

If so live with the cover for a while and see what you think. If you end up taking the cover off leave the cratch boards there so you can easily change back if you want to.

Edited by blackrose
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1 minute ago, blackrose said:

 

Sounds like a poor design to me. You're relying on a canvas cover or a pump to stop it filling up with water and potentially sinking. Plenty of boats have decks or holds lower than the water level of course, but given the choice a bow well deck that's below the water level is definitely an inferior design to an above the waterline self-draining deck.

Sagar,, a well respected hull builder, would not agree with you.

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It's a bonkers design.

 

The vast majority of Ownerships early shared vessels built by Pat Buckle had a well deck with a drain in it. Unfortunately autumn leaves tend to block the drain hles resulting in a corroded foredeck.. The drain, as designed had an enclosed channel under the floor all the way to the rear bilge.

 

A time bomb that has become costly to fix on some of the older boats where it has corroded through.  

 

Some of the boats have had the drain welded up and a pump put in to clear the well deck 

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32 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Sagar,, a well respected hull builder, would not agree with you.

 

Well they're entitled to their opinion too. But the vast majority of canal boat builders choose the self draining deck design because it makes more sense.

Edited by blackrose
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  52 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

Sounds like a poor design to me. You're relying on a canvas cover or a pump to stop it filling up with water and potentially sinking. Plenty of boats have decks or holds lower than the water level of course, but given the choice a bow well deck that's below the water level is definitely an inferior design to an above the waterline self-draining deck.

Sagar,, a well respected hull builder, would not agree with you.

 

Neither probably would Graham Reeves.

 

Our boat has a deep well deck like MTB's, with drain tubes running the length of the boat to the blige. 

A cratch cover is essential for us.

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3 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Sagar,, a well respected hull builder, would not agree with you.

 

Sagar, they built that wonderfully bonkers boat "EDITH" with all the wonderful victorian 'stonemasonry' style detailing.

 

Sold in the end to some pillockj who changed the name to "Belly Button". 

 

Gross and tasteless.

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15 hours ago, blackrose said:

but given the choice a bow well deck that's below the water level is definitely an inferior design to an above the waterline self-draining deck.

Well that rather depends on your design criteria.

A well deck a little above water level with self draining (leaves permitting) scuppers combined with a low threshold on the cabin doors doesn't provide much resilience against sinking. Neither does it provide standing headroom under the cratch cover, and seats on either side don't have a back you can lean against. There's quite a lot to be said for a lower well deck, albeit that it has to be drained either back to the stern bilge or provided with a separate bilge pump.

Edited by David Mack
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14 hours ago, Cheshire cat said:

It's a bonkers design.

 

The vast majority of Ownerships early shared vessels built by Pat Buckle had a well deck with a drain in it. Unfortunately autumn leaves tend to block the drain hles resulting in a corroded foredeck.. The drain, as designed had an enclosed channel under the floor all the way to the rear bilge.

 

A time bomb that has become costly to fix on some of the older boats where it has corroded through.  

 

Some of the boats have had the drain welded up and a pump put in to clear the well deck 

Yup, ours had the mod some years back, tiny drain holes on each side that need poking clear on a regular basis now feed into a central bilge with auto pump rather than all the way to the back of the boat.

 

The plus side however is you have a well deck that is easily accessible to those who don’t like steps and has a more “patio” feel with the big doors open (just ignore the MiL and offspring)

 

 

01CA59A1-FF42-465C-95D3-60669AC2B5F9.jpeg

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12 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Sagar, they built that wonderfully bonkers boat "EDITH" with all the wonderful victorian 'stonemasonry' style detailing.

 

Sold in the end to some pillockj who changed the name to "Belly Button". 

 

Gross and tasteless.

"Belly Button" haha that's made my Monday at work a little bit better! 

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30 minutes ago, Baldy1976 said:

"Belly Button" haha that's made my Monday at work a little bit better! 

 

I can see the appeal of that name, but its an insult to the care and craftsmanship put into that amazing steelwork. "EDITH" was such a graceful and appropriate name for this particular boat.

 

Mind you, I didn't buy it at the time as the Ruston installation in the back was a right fiasco, starting off with it being where the back cabin ought to be....

 

 

Edited by MtB
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1 minute ago, MtB said:

 

I can see the appeal of that name, but its an insult to the care and craftsmanship put into all that amazing decorative steelwork. 

 

Mind you, I didn't buy it at the time as the Ruston installation in the back was a right fiasco, starting off with it being where the back cabin ought to be....

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

I can see the appeal of that name, but its an insult to the care and craftsmanship put into that amazing steelwork. "EDITH" was such a graceful and appropriate name for this particular boat.

 

Mind you, I didn't buy it at the time as the Ruston installation in the back was a right fiasco, starting off with it being where the back cabin ought to be....

 

 

 

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Sitting in the well deck, when there is a storm, is great, rain battering down, wind bashing you about, thunderstorms, lightening, all can be enjoyed in peace from the bow, fantastic, to be in the weather, but shielded from it. There are lots of other practicable, afore mentioned, but without my cratch and cratch cover, I would sell the boat, and buy one that had one. In just normal rain, you would go inside, instead of enjoying the view.

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On 22/08/2021 at 19:47, Cheshire cat said:

It's a bonkers design.

 

The vast majority of Ownerships early shared vessels built by Pat Buckle had a well deck with a drain in it. Unfortunately autumn leaves tend to block the drain hles resulting in a corroded foredeck.. The drain, as designed had an enclosed channel under the floor all the way to the rear bilge.

 

A time bomb that has become costly to fix on some of the older boats where it has corroded through.  

 

Some of the boats have had the drain welded up and a pump put in to clear the well deck 

 

The early Ownerships boat by Pat Buckle had a conventional well deck and scuppers.

 

The second generation Ownerships boats were built by Graham Reeves and had the lower well deck with drainage tubes to the rear bilge.

 

We had one of each in our 23 years with Ownerships.

 

Not sure what the third generation Polish built hulls had in the way of well deck drainage.

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On 22/08/2021 at 23:26, MtB said:

 

Sagar, they built that wonderfully bonkers boat "EDITH" with all the wonderful victorian 'stonemasonry' style detailing.

 

Sold in the end to some pillockj who changed the name to "Belly Button". 

 

Gross and tasteless.

Could have been worse

 

Belly Button Fluff

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On 24/08/2021 at 15:40, cuthound said:

 

The early Ownerships boat by Pat Buckle had a conventional well deck and scuppers.

 

The second generation Ownerships boats were built by Graham Reeves and had the lower well deck with drainage tubes to the rear bilge.

 

We had one of each in our 23 years with Ownerships.

 

Not sure what the third generation Polish built hulls had in the way of well deck drainage.

Our first boat was a Pat Buckle/Floating homes '92 build, and that had a daft deck drain set up. It had a length of 1/2" box section behind the two corner gas lockers, already half blocked by welding residue that blocked constantly.

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