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rustynewbery

MIcrosoft v LINUX

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There is a way to beat the Microsoft stranglehold on our PC's laptops and other devices. Apart from Chromebooks, nearly all manufacturers sell their machines with Windows operating system[OS] as standard. The latest incarnation, Windows10 is a behemoth; consumes a lot of memory and computer time, constantly downloads updates when you don't want them, and removes support for previous versions, especially the much loved XP, which was the de facto standalone version of NT.  Along with this "free" OS, there comes Office 365 which is carries an annual subscription.

 

Many of you here have preferred to keep XP [or before] and so long as there is no internet connection, it cannot become infected with malware or viruses unless someone pokes a memory stick or CD into it.

 

Linux is an open source suite of software that is an alternative to Windows, particularly if you only use your device for emails, internet and other online applications.  There are several versions - Mint and Ubuntu are 2.  They can be loaded instead of Windows or exist on the same hard disk with a "dual boot" option if you have applications that will only run on Windows and do not have alternative apps on the Linux platform.  It claims to rejuvenate old computers as it uses less RAM [memory] and disk space.

 

If you use Office 365 programs such as Word, Excel, Power Point and Access, there is an open source alternative called Libre Office which does not require an annual subscription.  System security is much improved.  For more information just Google "why is Linux better".  A whole new MS free world awaits

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I tried Linux, (Ubuntu I think), a few years ago and couldn't understand how to make it work. Decided life is too short and carried on with W7 then 10. I use Classic Shell to make it look like older versions.

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8 minutes ago, Glynn said:

Or just use a Mac.

I use a Mac book pro but find it gets hot (and the fan runs very noisy as a result) on many sites. This forum was one until someone here told me how to change the site presentation.

 

I don't think it's a machine fault as I had it rebuilt (£1,400 on insurance) when I spilt water on it early this year.

 

So, though they are very good, they do have issues.

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2 hours ago, rustynewbery said:

There is a way to beat the Microsoft stranglehold on our PC's laptops and other devices. Apart from Chromebooks, nearly all manufacturers sell their machines with Windows operating system[OS] as standard. The latest incarnation, Windows10 is a behemoth; consumes a lot of memory and computer time, constantly downloads updates when you don't want them, and removes support for previous versions, especially the much loved XP, which was the de facto standalone version of NT.  Along with this "free" OS, there comes Office 365 which is carries an annual subscription.

 

Many of you here have preferred to keep XP [or before] and so long as there is no internet connection, it cannot become infected with malware or viruses unless someone pokes a memory stick or CD into it.

 

Linux is an open source suite of software that is an alternative to Windows, particularly if you only use your device for emails, internet and other online applications.  There are several versions - Mint and Ubuntu are 2.  They can be loaded instead of Windows or exist on the same hard disk with a "dual boot" option if you have applications that will only run on Windows and do not have alternative apps on the Linux platform.  It claims to rejuvenate old computers as it uses less RAM [memory] and disk space.

 

If you use Office 365 programs such as Word, Excel, Power Point and Access, there is an open source alternative called Libre Office which does not require an annual subscription.  System security is much improved.  For more information just Google "why is Linux better".  A whole new MS free world awaits

What's this got to do with boating?

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31 minutes ago, Glynn said:

Or just use a Mac.

Mac = Apple = Locked in. BUT - out of the box, a MAC outperformed Windows machines and the choice of many universities and scientific institutions back in the day.

 

Android is built on the Linux "kernel" 

 

And nope Seadog, I'm not on commission?

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1 hour ago, Glynn said:

Or just use a Mac.

So really you mean use a different version of Linux.
 

OK, Mac OS is based on UNIX, and Linux is a clone of UNIX, but you get the principle.

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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA     "use a Mac"      HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA    Sometimes you people on this forum just crease me up.

 

I do use Linux a lot, BUT unfortunately, whether we like it or not the rest of the world uses Windows. Windows isn't as bad as the OP makes out but it isn't Linux that's for sure and it isn't free. Open Office and Libre Office are both free and available for Windows. I wouldn't pay a monthly fee for Office 365, which is what comes with Windows 10. I'm still using Office 2010 which is now reasonably cheap on Ebay and is a one off payment. There are limitations with Open Office and Libra Office if you use them with Windows. Dunno about with Linux as I don't use either of them for my Linux usage. All the correspondence that I get requires Microsoft Office. Also don't forget that whilst the OP is quite possibly a Linux aficionado you do have to be a be a  bit of a nerd to use it at it's fullest.

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No, not an aficionado, and agreed it is possibly geeky/nerdy/techie.  I've dipped my toe into Ubuntu a few years ago before I got this machine and the "front end" GUI interface is now a lot better so you're not totally dependent on the command line unless you want to be a nerd.  I really only need Windows for the Serif DTP application but good to enable debate on the pros/cons of MS.  Now setting up a Virtual Machine running Windows 10 under Ubuntu - that'll keep me off the beer for months??. Though my machine will run faster [they say?]

 

Now where's my backup...….

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I use Linux Mint for all my work including running MS Office 97 and a few other Windows graphics applications that I need because of proprietary file formats, for this is use a Linux application called Wine that runs a lot of Windows programs under LInux. Nowadays it seem to work straight off the CD/DVD and install.

 

I used to run Powerpoint 97 under WIne but find that bar one small glitch Impress from Libra Office s fins and will run Powerpoint 97 files. The glitch that may have been cured now is that its more difficult to run animations in Impress.

 

The Libra Office apps all seem to be capable of saving files in a number of MSOffice formats including the latest ones so that is no bar to running LInux - at least the editor has not moaned about receiving MS .DOC  files created in LIbra Writer and they contain graphics. All my Excel accounts are in the normal Excel 97 format and open perfectly in Libra Calc.

 

There is a major problem with support because the most frequent posters on the Mint (and I suspect other versions) forums are all too ready to tell you that whatever you want help with its you that is wrong because it not how you do it in Linux   or you don't need to do that in Linux. They also seem to have a block with graphical interface things so expect you to use the command like (remember that from DOS days?)

 

Support aside I know Linux is a perfectly usable operating system for individuals and either Mint or Ubuntu would be good start points. I will take a short time to get to know your way around the system but then so do some of the new Windows versions. A day should be ample.

 

Incidently I think that you will find the Mac OS is built on Linux, in fact printing from Linux has got a lot easier in the last few years since Mac provided and maintained the CUPS Linux printing system.

 

 

Edited by Tony Brooks
  • Greenie 1

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2 hours ago, Glynn said:

Or just use a Mac.

Major downside to a Mac, apart from the price. Is that they are a pain to work on when doing a repair. Replacing a keyboard on a laptop 15 to 30 minuites depending on make and model. MacBook on average 2 hours, as to get to the keyboard you have to remove everything to get to it and then remove 68 tiny screws. With the Macbook Air even long as the keyboard is held in with rivets which have to be drilled out and the holes tapped. The real pain for new owners is that Macbooks built after 2017 can only be repaired by Apple.    

1 hour ago, rustynewbery said:

Mac = Apple = Locked in. BUT - out of the box, a MAC outperformed Windows machines and the choice of many universities and scientific institutions back in the day.

 

Android is built on the Linux "kernel" 

 

And nope Seadog, I'm not on commission?

But you wish you were!

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I've never had the need to move off Windows and refuse to buy in to Apple. If it wasn't for Microsoft I wouldn't have anything to do all day.

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1 hour ago, Rob-M said:

I've never had the need to move off Windows and refuse to buy in to Apple. If it wasn't for Microsoft I wouldn't have anything to do all day.

true, windows 10 is pretty solid, and most windows laptops are much cheaper than mac ones. Mojave interface looks uglier than windows 10 but that just my opinion. Only issue is one need to be careful about viruses when using windows as most virus makers target windows OS. One should consider ubuntu only if running win xp or win 7 on old hardware like OP suggests.

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Probably not for everyone but I can say without hesitation the Linux is a good OS and can serve most people well.

 

I got totally annoyed with MS about two years ago and decided to get serious about Linux.I have numerous computers and some are old but used only for specific task and win10 just created a lot of issues and was very annoying in my situation. Plus I didn't want to buy numerous licenses for all my computers either. I had looked at Linux for a long time and decided to give it a serious look.

 

This time did I a lot of reading and I settled on Mint version as it is similar to Windows layout so pretty easy to adapt to it.  After well over a year of using it I will never go back to MS as my main OS.  Even so I will say that Linux is not for everyone. There are some things that were pretty simple in Windows and that can be a real pain in the butt in Linux as a new user. But the average user wouldn't deal with what I did either.  Like network file sharing among multiple computers, multiple networked printers, file sharing with Windows and Linux machines.

 

I still have to use Windows for a couple of things. So I keep an old laptop with windows & just for printing and scanning.  I have an old scanner I use 3-4 times a year that I can't get drivers for. I don't need a scanner enough to buy a new one that works with Linux but there are plenty. I have a HP 42" wide plotter that there are no drivers available for Linux which has been my biggest surprise.  

 

I also have a dual boot set up on my main computer so I can shut down and reboot  into Windows 7.  I have two pieces of boat design software that I need and these are Windows only. (No they will not run in Wine on Linux)

 

Otherwise I find Linux does 98% of what I need and it doesn't crash, doesn't lock up, it just works like it should.  Unless you area a bit of geek like me and want to dig into it it really easy.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Kudzucraft said:

I have an old scanner I use 3-4 times a year that I can't get drivers for. I don't need a scanner enough to buy a new one that works with Linux but there are plenty.

I also have only occasional use for a scanner. Recently, I found a free android phone app (Notebloc as it happens, others are available) which allows me to scan documents, drawings, etc, by simply taking a photo. The app converts it, sends it to my networked printer (or pc to be saved as a pdf or whatever) and the job's a good 'un. Really quick and easy to use. The scanner is heading for the British Heart Foundation this week! 

No reason for me to promote this or similar apps other than it might help someone. :)

 

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7 hours ago, Kudzucraft said:

I have a HP 42" wide plotter that there are no drivers available for Linux which has been my biggest surprise.  

It should be able to run as a generic hpgl device.

 

7 hours ago, Kudzucraft said:

I have two pieces of boat design software that I need and these are Windows only. (No they will not run in Wine on Linux)

Try crossover.

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10 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

It should be able to run as a generic hpgl device.

 

Try crossover.

Crumbs, you have some good stuff tucked away in your cracker barrel! Is there anything you don't know about?!  ;)

 

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17 hours ago, Richard10002 said:

I tried Linux, (Ubuntu I think), a few years ago and couldn't understand how to make it work. Decided life is too short and carried on with W7 then 10. I use Classic Shell to make it look like older versions.

 

Me too. 

 

When I lost patience with Windows I gave Linux ONE DAY of my time to see if I could get it to work properly in that time. 

 

I failed miserably. Really basic problems like getting the printer or scanner to work, IIRC.

 

I binned it along with Windows and bought three Macs.

 

Bliss.

 

 

 

 

 

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Anything you're not used to is hard to get in to and seems weird and problematic for the first few days. Give any change a chance. I've used various forms of linux for twenty years (yikes!) for home, after having some exposure to unix at work. Back then it was hard work to get it to do what you wanted. These days, for most things, it just works out of the box. Current OS is Xubuntu. For work, I still have to use windows and each new version needs a few days to find where things have been moved to and what has stopped working and how, or if it can be fixed. I managed to avoid windows Vista, 8 and 8.1 fortunately. Generally, the same hardware will run faster on linux. Installations and updates take minutes, rather than hours and with only a reboot needed if the kernel is upgraded. When you get problems, windows "help" never ever does! You are then down to forums and generally, the linux ones are more likely to get you out of trouble. You can actually understand what the fix is going to do, rather than just "run this black box bit of software, downloaded from god's know where and it might fix it", which tends to be the windows approach.

 

I set up my Mum's laptop with Linux, as she only uses it for email, web browsing and a bit of word processing. I can make sure that after each upgrade, including an entire new laptop, each icon is in the exact same place and does the same thing. Much easier for her as she does not share my geek approach to life. I don't have to worry about viruses, or tech support phone scams as they mostly only target windows.

 

Jen

 

You are probably using Linux already. Your TV set top box, or smart TV will be running it, as will your wifi router.

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So using a bastardised LInux then Mike :)

 

I would urge anyone without exotic printer type devoices to give Linux a try, Since Mac introduced the cups printing system to Linux (and maintains it) as long a printer are connected and turned on during the install printer problems are now a thing of the past but I must admit Linux printing for some reason seems slower than Windows for some tasks.

 

Be aware that if you try what is called a "live CD" without installing the system will run far slower than with a properly installed on and it takes an age to boot a live CD into whatever Linux version.

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I started using Linux when a laptop hard drive failed and i didn't have a spare windows install disc - about six years ago.  Downloaded ubuntu and let it install.  Took less time and hassle than windows.  Since then I've converted the other laptop, acquired some raspberry pi's (one to run osmc as a media centre, one as a time-lapse camera) and loaded GalliumOS onto a new Cromebook - which was much cheaper than equivalent laptops running windows.

 

Now thinking about more pi's to monitor the solar/battery controllers and the BMC1500....

 

I do maintain one old pc with windows 7 only to ensure I can fix issues with ntfs formatted hard drives.  I have a hp laser printer that does wifi and 'just works' with the linux machines...

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I got bored with Windoze some time in 2011 and moved to Android, it was clunky to start with but now flies. It doesn't matter which device I pick up (Tablet, TV controller, phone) its all the same. I still have a win10 laptop but can't remember the last time I used it.

I use a keyboard with the tablet if I am typing  a lot but generally tend to use the on screen Hackers keyboard., for doc processing I use WPS office, scanning is done over wifi from an old Epson scanner, and printing the same way to a Samsung laser. I ran my business on a tablet for 7 years so it can be done.

Would I go back not a chance.

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