Tragic event at Leigh near Wigan

[nealeST]

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/man-carer-trying-help-him-28200168

 

The low temperature in the canal seems to have been the cause of loss of two lives in this news item from Tuesday.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, nealeST said:

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/man-carer-trying-help-him-28200168

 

The low temperature in the canal seems to have been the cause of loss of two lives in this news item from Tuesday.

 

Another example of why there should be barriers installed along the canal, between the water and the towpath.

[LadyG]

8 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Another example of why there should be barriers installed along the canal, between the water and the towpath.

What, for 2,200 miles?

I think a barrier would make my boat handlng and locking more difficult, more hazardous for me. More likely I would be pushed closer to the lock edge.

 

 

Edited November 30, 2023 by LadyG

[nealeST]

Canals, beautiful but dangerous and perhaps more so to none boaters. 

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, LadyG said:

More likely I would be pushed closer to the lick edge.

 

In this cold weather be careful your tongue doesn't stick to it.

[LadyG]

3 minutes ago, nealeST said:

Canals, beautiful but dangerous and perhaps more so to none boaters. 

It always amazes me that CRT have not used their blue signs to point this out. I think it's related to H&S, and our litigious society. If they put up even more notices they might need to be hazard type, accepting that there are dangers, and this could be used in Court 

[Mad Harold]

Cold water shock causes muscles to seize up.

On a warm day, there would be little difficulty scrambling out, but in the cold even the slightest effort can be well nigh impossible.

A couple of years ago a friend of mine fell in the cut one freezing February night while getting on his boat.He managed to get aboard but a neighbour found him in the cockpit unconcious a couple of days later.

He'd had a stroke and also had to have a foot amputated due to frostbite.

Now is in a care home and of course no more boating.

[Tony1]

 

Every time I read one of these tragedies I always comment about installing some kind of rope ladder on the stern.

Then there's a 20-page discussion about the best type of ladder, and even the best technique for using a rope ladder (one foot in front, and one behind, allegedly), and I end up forgetting about the ladder idea.

If I perish in a freezing water accident I'm going to hold you responsible- all of you. 

 

[LadyG]

I waited till after lunch to move the boat yesterday, there was still a bit of frost about, I had my autolifejacket, with crotch strap, plus padded gilet, padded trousers and winter coat, bobble hat, padded hood, mittens: toasty, but felt a bit like Michelin Man.

I was hanging on to the fence at the very rickety bramwith swing bridge landings it's amazing it's not been condemned!

Edited November 30, 2023 by LadyG

[nealeST]

I witnessed an ambulance in attendance to a couple who had been pulled out the L&L at the top of the Stanley Dock flight in Liverpool some weeks ago. Luckily weather was still freakishly warm. The lady had toppled in on her mobility scooter and the husband had jumped in to rescue. The C&RT were just about to go home when the accident happened and phoned the ambulance. They were kept busy fishing out various belongings  of the couple with a long fishing net after the event. It made me wonder how many such accidents occur? Presumably the lady in the scooter was in the habit of making a journey along the towpath. It was very close to the Eldonian Village.

[Alan de Enfield]

32 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

Every time I read one of these tragedies I always comment about installing some kind of rope ladder on the stern.

Then there's a 20-page discussion about the best type of ladder, and even the best technique for using a rope ladder (one foot in front, and one behind, allegedly), and I end up forgetting about the ladder idea.

If I perish in a freezing water accident I'm going to hold you responsible- all of you. 

 

 

If you've had a heart attack or hit your head 'on the way down' then the best ladder in the world isn't going to save you.

The only thing that will / might is an auto inflate lifejacket** and either a crew memeber realising you are missing, or, if single handed a member of the public seeing you floating down the cut .

 

** A lifejacket MUST automatically turn you onto your back within x seconds, a buoyancy aid turns you face down which will assist you in dying.

 

You do wear an auto lifejacket in cold weather DON'T you ?

Edited November 30, 2023 by Alan de Enfield

[magnetman]

If towpaths were transferred to local authorities they might fence them orf which could save the lives of people who would otherwise be taken out by Darwinism. 

 

What would be better? Fenced orf or a few deaths now and then? 

 

I'd take the deaths. 

 

I never wear a lifejacket and spend a lot of time around fast flowing water in and out of small boats at all times of the yar. 

 

Maybe I'll get Darwinned. Its taking a long time to happen. 

 

 

[truckcab79]

14 minutes ago, magnetman said:

If towpaths were transferred to local authorities they might fence them orf which could save the lives of people who would otherwise be taken out by Darwinism. 

 

What would be better? Fenced orf or a few deaths now and then? 

 

I'd take the deaths. 

 

I never wear a lifejacket and spend a lot of time around fast flowing water in and out of small boats at all times of the yar. 

 

Maybe I'll get Darwinned. Its taking a long time to happen. 

 

 

Indeed.  There will be a scenario in which pretty much anything can kill you given the right set of circumstances. You can’t guard against them all.  Tragic for those involved but  it’s just life,  (and death).  

[cuthound]

5 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

Cold water shock causes muscles to seize up.

On a warm day, there would be little difficulty scrambling out, but in the cold even the slightest effort can be well nigh impossible.

A couple of years ago a friend of mine fell in the cut one freezing February night while getting on his boat.He managed to get aboard but a neighbour found him in the cockpit unconcious a couple of days later.

He'd had a stroke and also had to have a foot amputated due to frostbite.

Now is in a care home and of course no more boating.

 

It also takes your breath away.

 

Many years ago, when I was in my late teens, I had a friend who was a canoe instructor at Thames Young Mariners. One cold March he was teaching me how to canoe when I fell in. Luckily the water was shallow enough for me to stand up, but I couldn't speak, let alone call for help and only just managed to wade the few yards to the shore and climb out.

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Another example of why there should be barriers installed along the canal, between the water and the towpath.

About 40 years ago I worked on the first lock restoration on the Huddersfield Narrow Canal. Most of the chamber had been infilled up to a couple of feet below coping level, a concrete wall had been built where the bottom gates had been and from there there were railings either side of the bottom end of the chamber and around the gate quadrants. We removed the infill, concrete wall and railings, replacing an arrangement with limited opportunity for a dangerous fall to one where there were unprotected edges with a fall of about 8 or 10 feet to 4ft+ depth of water. I did wonder at the time how we could get away with increasing the hazard to passers by in this way, but much the same has happened at many other restored locks.

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

It also takes your breath away.

 

Many years ago, when I was in my late teens, I had a friend who was a canoe instructor at Thames Young Mariners. One cold March he was teaching me how to canoe when I fell in. Luckily the water was shallow enough for me to stand up, but I couldn't speak, let alone call for help and only just managed to wade the few yards to the shore and climb out.

 

Cold water shock

 

Cold Water Shock – the Facts

 

The term ‘cold water shock’ refers to a range of natural reactions that our bodies take to protect us when we enter cold water (although these reactions can sometimes work against us).

With cold water being anything from approximately the temperature of a swimming pool and below, we are not just talking about icy cold water here.

---

So what are the effects of Cold Water Shock?

There are three stages that your body goes through during cold water shock, starting with one that you will be familiar with a mild version of from getting into the swimming pool…a gasp for breath, this is then followed by rapid breathing (hyperventilation).

At the same time as your breathing goes out of control, your blood pressure shoots up as your body tries to keep your blood warm by moving it towards the middle of your body (this is why you go pale when you’re cold).

Once your breathing is back under control, this is your window to get out of the water before the further effects of cold water shock kick in.

As your muscles cool, your strength, endurance and muscle control reduces to the point when you can’t swim any longer so can’t rescue yourself. The point at which you can’t swim any more is called ‘swim failure’, and if you haven’t got out of the water or managed to get hold of a buoyancy aid (like a lifejacket) by this time, you will drown.

---

What about hypothermia?

There is a lot of talk of people dying from hypothermia after falling into cold water, but the truth is that unless they have a way of surviving past the point of swim failure (like wearing a lifejacket), you will drown before you become hypothermic.

Even in really cold water, it takes at least 30 minutes for you to become hypothermic. Crucially, hypothermia remains a risk even when you get out of the water unless you get out of the cold and warm up efficiently and quickly.

---

Is cold water shock really responsible for lots of drownings?

It is difficult to identify if cold water shock was the cause of a drowning or not, but this is what we know:

1. All waters around the UK are cold enough to induce the cold shock effects, even in high summer.
2. Over 60% of drownings are of people who have ended up in the water by accident, so they’re normally very close to the edge, but something stops them from being able to get out safely.
3. A sudden rise in blood pressure can be fatal for people with a pre-existing heart condition. Each year a number of people who are suspected of drowning, turn out to have had a heart attack.
4. Studies show that people’s ability to swim in cold water is much less than their ability in a warm swimming pool.
5. Survivors of drowning have described how the effects of cold water shock made it difficult for them to survive.

---

What should you do if you fall into the water?

First, keep your mouth away from the water until you have your breathing back under control, you can do this by rolling onto your back and floating or paddling to stay at the surface.

Then, don’t waste any time and swim towards an exit before your muscles start to cool, or swim towards something that will help you to stay afloat whilst you are calling for help.

Finally, once you are out of the water re-warm yourself as soon as you can to avoid hypothermia.

[TheBiscuits]

26 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Maybe I'll get Darwinned.

 

Too late, you have kids.  To properly win a Darwin award you need to permanently remove yourself (in a spectacularly stupid way) from the gene pool before passing your genes on.

 

This usually but not always involves a death. The bloke who shot his tackle off by carrying a loaded handgun in his trouser pocket was a notable exception!

[Rob-M]

When the primary school I was a governor at moved next to Portishead marina there were lots of calls for the pathway around the marina to be fenced off, however the health and safety assessment determined it was safer to have a clearly visible danger of the unfenced marina rather than putting a fence or railings as that would lead to children climbing and possibly falling over the fence in to the water and then it would obstruct any rescue attempt.

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Another example of why there should be barriers installed along the canal, between the water and the towpath.

weren't there campaigns some years back to fence off canals 

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, ditchcrawler said:

weren't there campaigns some years back to fence off canals 

yup - thats why my post was a bit ..................

 

 

[ditchcrawler]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

yup - thats why my post was a bit ..................

 

 

I didn't realise you did those sort of posts ☺️

[Tony1]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You do wear an auto lifejacket in cold weather DON'T you ?

 

I only wear my auto lifejacket when I am drowning my sorrows

 

[system 4-50]

If I die in a cold canal, I will sue C&RT for failing to keep the water at a safe temperature.

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, system 4-50 said:

If I die in a cold canal, I will sue C&RT for failing to keep the water at a safe temperature.

 

Makes sense - if you can sue McDonalds for their coffee being too hot, you must be able to sue C&RT if you get hypothermia.

[blackrose]

8 hours ago, magnetman said:

I never wear a lifejacket and spend a lot of time around fast flowing water in and out of small boats at all times of the yar. 

 

Maybe I'll get Darwinned. Its taking a long time to happen. 

 

In general I only wear a lifejacket on tideways, however about 15 years ago I was up on the GU near Apsley and I'd been frozen in for a few days. There was a bit of a thaw so I decided to get going. At the first lock I was walking across the gates which still had a layer of ice on the top and I realised how easy it would be to slip on the ice and fall in. Being single handed early in the morning nobody would know, so I went inside and grabbed a lifejacket. At least it gives you a better chance of getting out.