12 volt sockets and plugs, are they mandatory?

[Graham Davis]

They certainly look like the ones I got. It's difficult to be sure as there is no info on the dimentions of it.

I got these http://www.towsure.com/product/2_Pin_12_Volt_Caravan_Power_Socket and they suck!

 

Those ones are rubbish, and have been superceeded by these:

http://www.towsure.com/product/Caravan_12_Volt_2Pin_Plug_Beige

Seem to go under the name of Clipsal.

Much bigger with two pins, the top one being slightly larger so they can't be put in the socket the wrong way around.

They are about 4 times bigger than your link.

[Radiomariner]

I must admit to doing similar quite a few times usually due to standing on a plug, breaking the main pin then not being able to insert, Ive even shoved in the broken pin and followed it with the remaining 2 pin plug

 

Blimey the amount of times I should have died or been seriously injured messing around with electrics must be well over a cat's nine lives

 

 

 

 

Tell me about it. My model railway transformer was always plugged in by the bare wires and lolly stick method. Or if there was another appliance with a plug on it we would wind long bare wires around its pins and shove it in, saved buying a double adapter too.

 

As a young lad I used to do similar. Found that using the plug of an unused appliance upside down so that inserting the earth pin opened up the shutters on the "Live" cennectors. Elfin safety cottoned on to this and modern sockets are made so that the space between the earth pin aperature and the top of the face plate is such that the earth pin of an upside down plug can not be inserted!

Edited July 20, 2012 by Radiomariner

[bizzard]

As a young lad I used to do similar. Found that using the plug of an unused appliance upside down so that inserting the earth pin opened up the shutters on the "Live" cennectors. Elfin safety cottoned on to this and modern sockets are made so that the space between the earth pin aperature and the top of the face plate is such that the earth pin of an upside down plug can not be inserted!

Often when i went to play with my train set the transformer would be missing, my dad used to nick it to trickle charge the car battery in the kitchen and guess what, he'd not used a plug either.

PS i just remember the old DC round pin plugs and sockets, wonderful, no lolly stick required.

Edited July 20, 2012 by bizzard

[Chris Pink]

As a young lad I used to do similar. Found that using the plug of an unused appliance upside down so that inserting the earth pin opened up the shutters on the "Live" cennectors. Elfin safety cottoned on to this and modern sockets are made so that the space between the earth pin aperature and the top of the face plate is such that the earth pin of an upside down plug can not be inserted!

 

Not true on 4 way sockets where it's a very useful way of getting european plugs in.

[jonathanA]

Not true on 4 way sockets where it's a very useful way of getting european plugs in.

 

 

I think some of the newer better 4w sockets don't allow this, but it is/was a recognised way of getting euro plugs connected.

 

slightly off topic but please do have a look at this site :

 

http://www.fatallyflawed.org.uk/

 

it exposes the dangers of so called 'safety covers' for 13A sockets.

[Chris Pink]

I think some of the newer better 4w sockets don't allow this, but it is/was a recognised way of getting euro plugs connected.

 

slightly off topic but please do have a look at this site :

 

http://www.fatallyflawed.org.uk/

 

it exposes the dangers of so called 'safety covers' for 13A sockets.

 

 

 

'danger'

 

hmmm....

 

It would be interesting to know;

 

1. How many children have been electrocuted as a result of playing with these covers

2. How many children (people) have been electrocuted as a result of sticking things into 13A sockets.

 

 

I always thought the covers were to stop the electricity running out in areas where it's less viscous than normal electricity.

 

On reflection, perhaps 'danger' is correct; "...and gave the smaller part to his younger sister to chew on. She nearly choked.”"

[Ex- Member]

'danger'

 

hmmm....

 

It would be interesting to know;

 

1. How many children have been electrocuted as a result of playing with these covers

2. How many children (people) have been electrocuted as a result of sticking things into 13A sockets.

 

 

I always thought the covers were to stop the electricity running out in areas where it's less viscous than normal electricity.

 

On reflection, perhaps 'danger' is correct; "...and gave the smaller part to his younger sister to chew on. She nearly choked.""

 

Quite a few in 1997 it seems, but this might be in the U'S as they mention 110 volt.

 

 

Electricity-related accidents sent more than 6,000 children to hospital Ers in 1997. Kids under 5 who either chewed on electrical cords or played with wall sockets accounted for 70 percent of these injuries. If your toddler touches a household current, he'll likely pull his hand away in time to prevent serious harm. But if he grabs an electrical appliance while standing in water or bites through an electrical cord, the 110-volt current that runs through most households can pass through his blood and nerves, knock him unconscious, and even stop his heart. Here's lifesaving advice you must know.

 

It's interesting to note though that the U'S do not have the same safety precautions on sockets as does the U'K

 

http://moms4mom.com/...-a-power-socket

 

Clearly the built in safety devices we have work well.

 

 

ETA forgot to add this link

With UK shuttered sockets already widely considered the safest in Europe and with no reported records of children's electrocution from insertions into plug sockets the FatallyFlawed team (including IET members Prof John Roulston OBE and David Peacock) concludes that: 'many companies have been marketing plastic safety socket covers in the misguided belief that they are an essential tool to prevent children from inserting fingers or other objects into plug sockets. '.

http://www.prnewswire.co.uk/news-releases/independent-engineers-find-child-safety-socket-covers-unnecessary-and-potentially-lethal-in-use-156454315.html

Edited July 20, 2012 by Julynian

[steelaway]

I've just received a bunch of 12 volt sockets and plugs for my boat. They look and feel flimsy and way smaller than their 220v equivalents. Basically, they look like kids toys. Does one have to use them or is one free to use regular 220 v sockets for the 12 v wiring and just label them so to avoid confusion/accidents? What are the bw requirements?

I would post a photo of them but cannot figure out how! They're about 25mm by 25mm.

Thanks

 

 

 

Hi

 

For convenience I used one of these -----http://www.campervanaccessories.co.uk/socket-outlet-blackchrome-p-3329.html

 

Alex

[ditchcrawler]

As a young lad I used to do similar. Found that using the plug of an unused appliance upside down so that inserting the earth pin opened up the shutters on the "Live" cennectors. Elfin safety cottoned on to this and modern sockets are made so that the space between the earth pin aperature and the top of the face plate is such that the earth pin of an upside down plug can not be inserted!

What was wrong with using the end of your Biro

[Graham Davis]

Hi

 

For convenience I used one of these -----http://www.campervanaccessories.co.uk/socket-outlet-blackchrome-p-3329.html

 

Alex

 

Pedro,

the plugs I linked to fit this socket!

[Batavia]

Not if you come into my world there isn't, most professional audio and lighting equipment uses those, again its a bloody stupid idea to use mains connectors for 12v

Sorry if I appear to be being a bit blunt but anyone that does this is asking to kill themselves or worse someone else.

I have used the Speakon version for 12 volt outlets, with the supply connected across the two channels, which seems safe enough to me, given that I don't have speakers with these connectors and am unlikely to take any of my 12 volt appliances into an A/V environment.

 

Chris G

 

(awaiting brickbats from Julian, if he can thrown them 2 miles.)

 

 

[bizzard]

There are several designs of 12v plugs and sockets. Two other types i know of are the \ / shaped socket slots and pinned plugs, also the unequal width slot and unequal width plug pin ones. Both obviously will only take the plug one way round.

Edited July 20, 2012 by bizzard

[GUMPY]

I have used the Speakon version for 12 volt outlets, with the supply connected across the two channels, which seems safe enough to me, given that I don't have speakers with these connectors and am unlikely to take any of my 12 volt appliances into an A/V environment.

 

(awaiting brickbats from Julian, if he can thrown them 2 miles.)

 

Speakons as opposed to powercons are almost passable depending on which pins you used

If 2 pin ones then ........

if 4/6/or 8 then provided you used the same polarity pin ie both on a +ve or both on a -ve then that's passable as no damage could happen.

 

And yes I would just wait until you were passing...

 

have to think about how much rewiring I am going to do on the new boat to get it up to standard

[Theo]

Yes and they are still used in many installations for 230v lighting circuits so could still present a danger if the unit was taken off the boat, just because someone has not seen them in use for a while doesn't mean that they are not in use.

I have been through many permutations over the years and now use HD cig lighter sockets and plugs for 12v. The main thing to consider is not to use any high power 12v equipment then cig lighter sockets and plugs are fine, if you need high power then make sure it is hard wired and not pluggable.

 

You can get over the danger of taking your 12v appliances home and plugging them into your 240V 5A sockets like this:

 

Wire your boat sockets so that the top pin is the +ve connection and the bottom left the -ve. The appliance wired up to work with this will not make a connection with the live if accidentally inserted into a 240V 5A socket.

 

Bur how many people have 240V 5A sockets at home?

 

Nick

 

 

 

[Radiomariner]

What was wrong with using the end of your Biro

 

Hey, my biro was a posh metalic one. I was safety concious!

[bizzard]

Hey, my biro was a posh metalic one. I was safety concious!

I used Dickiebirds Glowjoy ice cream lolly sticks as they were thinner than normal. They were lovely lolly's,the creamy type, banana, chocolate, spearmint, strawberry, ect 3d each, The Diciebird van also sold chocolate cup cakes for 1d each.All my pocket money went on that van.

[blackrose]

What are all these 12v appliances you're all running from 12v sockets?

 

My 12v system runs hardwired lights and pumps a couple of extractor fans. Apart from that I only have one 12v socket that I use when I'm away from shore power for a small 12v TV or a car stereo. I guess the only other mains appliance I could run direct from 12v is my laptop.

Edited July 21, 2012 by blackrose

[bizzard]

What are all these 12v appliances you're all running from 12v sockets?

 

My 12v system runs hardwired lights and pumps a couple of extractor fans. Apart from that I only have one 12v socket that I use when I'm away from shore power for a small 12v TV or a car stereo. I guess the only other mains appliance I could run direct from 12v is my laptop.

12v drill charger, 2 12v to 9,6,4,3v droppers for DAB radios, 12v lead lamp, small inverter, 12v fan, 12v CD player,12v table lamp, 12v to 19v laptop transformer, 12v aerial booster. Most of these things are portable.

And my 12v wired barking dog burger alarm.

Edited July 21, 2012 by bizzard

[Mat B]

Not if you come into my world there isn't, most professional audio and lighting equipment uses those, again its a bloody stupid idea to use mains connectors for 12v

Sorry if I appear to be being a bit blunt but anyone that does this is asking to kill themselves or worse someone else.

 

Indeed, but I am not contemplating coming into your world.

 

The chassis mount bit, which I use as a socket outlet, in your world is part of the appliance. The in-line bit on my boat is the appliance, in your world it carries the mains.

 

So even if I ventured into your world with one of my 12V appliances I would not be able to plug it into the mains anywhere.

 

On my boat it is safe

 

On yours, probably not.

 

m@

[GUMPY]

The last comment you made sir labels you as the ill informed person that you are.

FYI I deal with this stuff for a living and have done for over 40 years and have possibly the best safety record in the industry.

You may think you are being so clever using powercon however if someone else follows your example gets it wrong and kills themselves how would you feel then?

[Smelly]

What are all these 12v appliances you're all running from 12v sockets?

 

My 12v system runs hardwired lights and pumps a couple of extractor fans. Apart from that I only have one 12v socket that I use when I'm away from shore power for a small 12v TV or a car stereo. I guess the only other mains appliance I could run direct from 12v is my laptop.

 

2 laptops, portable radio, 12v telly, 12v amp and my old 3g router...

 

A lot of us are away from shore power most/all of the time! 12v sockets are very handy to save inverter time!

 

edit... and a drill!

Edited July 23, 2012 by Smelly

[Old Son]

Pedro doesn't seem to be about. Perhaps he has already touched the wrong wire!!

[smileypete]

Think I would just use the DIN/Hella sockets for high current things and use cigar lighter sockets as well for stuff like mobile chargers where they're built into the plug. Maybe have one of each with a breaker protecting both, then another larger breaker or fuse back at the panel protecting the wiring to the sockets.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~