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"Medium" length stern button


IanD

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7 minutes ago, Goliath said:


and you’ve the smallest,

 

sort them mooring lines/ropes while you’re at it, 🥸

Sometimes size *does* matter -- I've got a small (but shapely) rudder too... 😉

 

Not sure what lines/ropes you're talking about, they're not even on the boat yet. If they were, I'd probably deliberately dangle the stern line over the tiller pin just to see who bites... 🙂

Edited by IanD
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1 minute ago, IanD said:

Sometimes size *does* matter... 😉

 

Not sure what lines/ropes you're talking about, they're not even on the boat yet. If they were, I'd probably deliberately dangle the stern line over the tiller pin just to see who bites... 🙂


I refer you back to the original image you posted. 
 

 

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12 minutes ago, IanD said:

Sometimes size *does* matter -- I've got a small (but shapely) rudder too... 😉

 

Not sure what lines/ropes you're talking about, they're not even on the boat yet. If they were, I'd probably deliberately dangle the stern line over the tiller pin just to see who bites... 🙂

Rudder waving. Mines massive. So are my fenders. 

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26 minutes ago, Goliath said:


I refer you back to the original image you posted.

 

You mean the bits of blue-and-white wet string that are being used for who knows what? 😉

16 minutes ago, Jon57 said:

Rudder waving. Mines massive. So are my fenders. 

I hope you're very happy together 🙂

Edited by IanD
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6 hours ago, magnetman said:

Dennis Cooper? I like the tread plate deck. 

You wouldn't believe the amount of grief I've had from some quarters for wanting to retain the diamond tread plate on Belfast's back deck! Although it has been fitted for years and is part of the boat's history, apparently I'm supposed to replace it with a new steel plate with grooves cut into it to simulate the ash wood planking the deck would have had when new.

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8 hours ago, Goliath said:

Most hire boats seem to have a bit of rubber on the end of some boxed steel which reaches past the rudder. 
Seems a good idea?

Could have it hinged, to lift in tight locks, or when mooring in to that tight space where you just need a couple more feet. 

Ours has one of these. It's a particular characteristic of Black Prince (and other rental companies they or the yard that built them also sold boats to), along with the big rubber bow fender. I know they're far from traditional but I love them. In theory yeah, they can hinge upward but I've got a feeling mine's held in place with a clevis pin... I'm going to have to check this in the morning because I honestly can't remember now. But its design means it definitely wouldn't bend downwards. It can sometimes work as a nice little platform to stand on to clear any gubbins that have been caught around the rudder.

 

I'm finding this thread a little bit fascinating, I must say. Obviously, there are very few truly *traditional* working boats on the network, but plenty of boats (and indeed everything we do on our wonderful network) certainly attempt to simulate, pay homage, whatever you want to call it, to those working boats and times of days gone by. If you'll forgive me for sounding a bit pretentious, it really makes me think of Baudrillard's thoughts of simulacra

 

Quote

... that a simulacrum is not a copy of the real, but becomes truth in its own right: the hyperreal. According to Baudrillard, what the simulacrum copies either had no original or no longer has an original, since a simulacrum signifies something it is not, and therefore leaves the original unable to be located

 

There are things we do on, to, and with canal boats that are certainly attempting to pay homage to and retain the traditions of a bygone era but in that act have actually become their own things entirely. And that simulacrum that has been created in itself has value, and ought be preserved by those that wish to do so. But at the same time, obviously, I genuinely find it fascinating to see how much better we could potentially optimise the vessels we use on the system, the system itself, while still retaining the aspects which I think are a common ground. But maybe that's just my engineer brain getting the better of me.

Edited by sigsegv
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4 minutes ago, sigsegv said:

Ours has one of these. It's a particular characteristic of Black Prince (and other rental companies they or the yard that built them also sold boats to), along with the big rubber bow fender. I know they're far from traditional but I love them. In theory yeah, they can hinge upward but I've got a feeling mine's held in place with a clevis pin... I'm going to have to check this in the morning because I honestly can't remember now. But its design means it definitely wouldn't bend downwards. It can sometimes work as a nice little platform to stand on to clear any gubbins that have been caught around the rudder.

 

I'm finding this thread a little bit fascinating, I must say. Obviously, there are very few truly *traditional* working boats on the network, but plenty of boats (and indeed everything we do on our wonderful network) certainly attempt to simulate, pay homage, whatever you want to call it, to those working boats and times of days gone by. If you'll forgive me for sounding a bit pretentious, it really makes me think of Baudrillard's thoughts of simulacra

 

 

There are things we do on, to, and with canal boats that are certainly attempting to pay homage to and retain the traditions of a bygone era but in that act have actually become their own things entirely. And that simulacrum that has been created in itself has value, and ought be preserved by those that wish to do so. But at the same time, obviously, I genuinely find it fascinating to see how much better we could potentially optimise the vessels we use on the system, the system itself, while still retaining the aspects which I think are a common ground. But maybe that's just my engineer brain getting the better of me.

What you're talking about are skiamorphs... 🙂

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3 minutes ago, IanD said:

What you're talking about are skiamorphs... 🙂

certainly the use of fake rivets etc. might be considered skeuomorphs (the term I'm more familiar with, didn't know the alternative word), but I think it goes a bit deeper than that, with behaviours, practises, etc.

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Just now, sigsegv said:

certainly the use of fake rivets etc. might be considered skeuomorphs (the term I'm more familiar with, didn't know the alternative word), but I think it goes a bit deeper than that, with behaviours, practises, etc.

The term doesn't just refer to physical bits of design...

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1 minute ago, IanD said:

The term doesn't just refer to physical bits of design...

I've never heard of sceuomorphs being used to refer to things that don't directly reference objects and concepts in physical reality but ok, sure. Maybe at a stretch we can agree that sceuomorphs are a subset of simulacra that fit certain criteria.

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9 hours ago, sigsegv said:

Ours has one of these. It's a particular characteristic of Black Prince (and other rental companies they or the yard that built them also sold boats to), along with the big rubber bow fender. I know they're far from traditional but I love them. In theory yeah, they can hinge upward but I've got a feeling mine's held in place with a clevis pin... I'm going to have to check this in the morning because I honestly can't remember now. But its design means it definitely wouldn't bend downwards. It can sometimes work as a nice little platform to stand on to clear any gubbins that have been caught around the rudder.

 

I'm finding this thread a little bit fascinating, I must say. Obviously, there are very few truly *traditional* working boats on the network, but plenty of boats (and indeed everything we do on our wonderful network) certainly attempt to simulate, pay homage, whatever you want to call it, to those working boats and times of days gone by. If you'll forgive me for sounding a bit pretentious, it really makes me think of Baudrillard's thoughts of simulacra

 

 

There are things we do on, to, and with canal boats that are certainly attempting to pay homage to and retain the traditions of a bygone era but in that act have actually become their own things entirely. And that simulacrum that has been created in itself has value, and ought be preserved by those that wish to do so. But at the same time, obviously, I genuinely find it fascinating to see how much better we could potentially optimise the vessels we use on the system, the system itself, while still retaining the aspects which I think are a common ground. But maybe that's just my engineer brain getting the better of me.

I am not sure how something that is designed to stick out at 90 degrees would made to fold up and down but stay sticking out for most of the time without drooping

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1 hour ago, Tonka said:

I am not sure how something that is designed to stick out at 90 degrees would made to fold up and down but stay sticking out for most of the time without drooping

It could be done with (strong) springs. The rate would need to be set to be there to protect the boat in normal use, but spring up (or down) with the forces involved in a tipping situation. Much like a sacrificial link in a chain on a fender attached as such.

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Folding up is easy, that's what they're designed to do to prevent hanging up on a cill. Folding down is more difficult (springs etc) and they're not designed this way, presumably because it would cost more, and getting the stern caught under something is much rarer, especially for less experienced hire boaters who seem to account for most cillings...

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In my experience side fenders hung from Midnight's fender eyes at gunwhale level quickly get ripped off. I now hang fenders from the roof on rope lanyards which allows them to swivel up when wedged by a not quite open lock gate or jetty. Even so I have increased the diameter of the ropes as initially I had a few snap.

 

Awaits counter argument!

 

 

 

Edited by Midnight
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1 hour ago, IanD said:

Fespecially for less experienced hire boaters who seem to account for most cillings...

 

Is that right? The ones Ive seen that have sunk recently (Cillings or rudder stuck in gates) have been owners boats with the exception of the  hirers apparently mooring overnight in the Droitwich staircase locks. We do ( as you know yourself )need to be careful. I suspect these days very many hirers are at least as experienced as many owners.

 

Perhaps minor cillings with rudder damage then slip off may occur but Im not sure theres data for that?  

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1 hour ago, Midnight said:

In my experience side fenders hung from Midnight's fender eyes at gunwhale level quickly get ripped off. I now hang fenders from the roof on rope lanyards which allows them to swivel up when wedged by a not quite open lock gate or jetty. Even so I have increased the diameter of the ropes as initially I had a few snap.

 

Awaits counter argument!

 

 

 

Not boating with fenders down saves having any ripped off.

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1 hour ago, Midnight said:

In my experience side fenders hung from Midnight's fender eyes at gunwhale level quickly get ripped off. I now hang fenders from the roof on rope lanyards which allows them to swivel up when wedged by a not quite open lock gate or jetty. Even so I have increased the diameter of the ropes as initially I had a few snap.

 

Awaits counter argument!

 

 

 

What would you hang them on if fitted to the counter

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