Anyone know of an anode welder around Shropshire?

[magnetman]

I've always been a little suspicious about whether fresh water anodes actually do anything. Is someone pulling a fast one?

 

[Tony1]

4 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Maybe someone from Whittington Wharf would come and do it Whittington Wharf Narrowboats| Llangollen Canal Holiday Boat Hire (whittington-wharf.com)  Blackwater are closer but I don't know if they have them sort of people there Services – Blackwater Meadow Marina

 

Cheers Brian, I'll give them a call, the people at Blackwater seemed pretty decent. 

[Tony1]

30 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Would that be two pack, (it's more expensive than bitumen), I'd be inclined to ring them again, it's quite a task getting everything organised if you are on you own, not so bad if you have a van. I suggest you cost it up more carefully, I seem to think my two pack was £80 per twin pack, and I used two, I think, but I'm not sure. In fact I got a kit from SML paints which saved me £50, good rollers. I still have the personal coverall, which washed up nicely. It's worth looking at their site even if you buy elsewhere, I've no connection, just satisfied customer. They provide technical advice. 

When the boat is out it might be a good idea to check other things. 

Do you have a bow thruster?

 

 

 

No bow thruster, but one of the skin fittings in the engine bay is very rusty and it would be nice to get that replaced as well.

I think if I go down the route of DIYing it, I'll use two pack- the extra couple of hundred quid just makes sense really when you are going to so much time and effort to get paint onto the thing. 

 

Interestingly, the cost for 2-pack treatment at marinas seems to be signficantly higher than blacking, even though the amount of labour is broadly similar, and the raw materials only differ in price by maybe £150? 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Tony1

[PCSB]

25 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

 

No bow thruster, but one of the skin fittings in the engine bay is very rusty and it would be nice to get that replaced as well.

I think if I go down the route of DIYing it, I'll use two pack- the extra couple of hundred quid just makes sense really when you are going to so much time and effort to get paint onto the thing. 

 

Interestingly, the cost for 2-pack treatment at marinas seems to be signficantly higher than blacking, even though the amount of labour is broadly similar, and the raw materials only differ in price by maybe £150? 

 

If I have understood things correctly then the 2 pack needs a very well prepared base. Many advocate sand blasting first, I know that at Aqueduct that is what they do when using 2 pack. This would account for the larger difference perhaps.

[BEngo]

40 minutes ago, magnetman said:

I've always been a little suspicious about whether fresh water anodes actually do anything. Is someone pulling a fast one?

 

They do work, if properly installled. You can usually see the difference as much reduced corrosion, particularly pitting,  for a radius of about 6ft. 

N

[Sea Dog]

1 hour ago, rusty69 said:

Ours are bolt on. The last surveyor advised welding was superior. 

It is if you're moored in an area where folk in wetsuits with spanners might nick yer anodes...

[Tony1]

6 minutes ago, PCSB said:

If I have understood things correctly then the 2 pack needs a very well prepared base. Many advocate sand blasting first, I know that at Aqueduct that is what they do when using 2 pack. This would account for the larger difference perhaps.

 

I asked out of curiosity and was quoted £2500 for sand blasting and 2 pack at Swanley about 18 months ago, but that was high enough that I ruled it out as an option when the time would come. Economically it does add up, because it lasts for the same as maybe 3 blackings (so about 6-7 years)- but it was too big a chunk to take on when cheaper options were around.

Our very own Haggis told me of a pressure washer at Northwich dry dock that is more powerful than the ones usually employed for this task. Not as good as sand blasting, but a very good compromise and only £1500 for the full job with 2 pack. 

At the moment that looks a good option, but it depends on the boat lift being open, so there is that.

If I DIY it, I will use a wire wheel to remove as much rust and crap as possible, so I may also get a half-decent result from that. 

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

It is if you're moored in an area where folk in wetsuits with spanners might nick yer anodes...

I dunno. I never checked if they are still there. 

 

The one on the sailboat has never been stolen, and that's high and dry at least 1/2 of the day. Maybe some of the night too. 

[PCSB]

3 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

I asked out of curiosity and was quoted £2500 for sand blasting and 2 pack at Swanley about 18 months ago, but that was high enough that I ruled it out as an option when the time would come. Economically it does add up, because it lasts for the same as maybe 3 blackings (so about 6-7 years)- but it was too big a chunk to take on when cheaper options were around.

Our very own Haggis told me of a pressure washer at Northwich dry dock that is more powerful than the ones usually employed for this task. Not as good as sand blasting, but a very good compromise and only £1500 for the full job with 2 pack. 

At the moment that looks a good option, but it depends on the boat lift being open, so there is that.

If I DIY it, I will use a wire wheel to remove as much rust and crap as possible, so I may also get a half-decent result from that. 

Another boater I've spoken with has also said the pressure washer they use at Northwich is incredibly powerful. I believ the current plan for the boat lift is to be open in April this year ... fingers crossed eh?

[LadyG]

24 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

I asked out of curiosity and was quoted £2500 for sand blasting and 2 pack at Swanley about 18 months ago, but that was high enough that I ruled it out as an option when the time would come. Economically it does add up, because it lasts for the same as maybe 3 blackings (so about 6-7 years)- but it was too big a chunk to take on when cheaper options were around.

Our very own Haggis told me of a pressure washer at Northwich dry dock that is more powerful than the ones usually employed for this task. Not as good as sand blasting, but a very good compromise and only £1500 for the full job with 2 pack. 

At the moment that looks a good option, but it depends on the boat lift being open, so there is that.

If I DIY it, I will use a wire wheel to remove as much rust and crap as possible, so I may also get a half-decent result from that. 

Personally I would not use a standard wire wheel as you are going to leave lots of tiny bits of rusting wire all over the hull. That's why I earlier specified cupped brass wire brushes. I paid someone to do mine as I don't have a powerful drill, but I I was not impressed by his lack of enthusiasm. If you have power on site it might be a good idea to get decent tools and DIY, again that's another six hours to factor in.

With respect to boatyards do not leave them to make decisions, I told mine I did not intend to haul out for five years, so he put four enormous anodes on, there was already two standard size in good condition on either side of the bow, they are stil there, I think the whole lot wil be there for about twenty years!

Edited January 8, 2023 by LadyG

[TheBiscuits]

15 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

it depends on the boat lift being open

 

Out at Ellesmere Port and in at Weston Marsh via the Ship Canal?

[ditchcrawler]

19 minutes ago, PCSB said:

Another boater I've spoken with has also said the pressure washer they use at Northwich is incredibly powerful. I believ the current plan for the boat lift is to be open in April this year ... fingers crossed eh?

We are booked in for this year so we will see how well the last 2 pk has lasted

[Tony1]

16 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Personally I would not use a standard wire wheel as you are going to leave lots of tiny bits of rusting wire all ver the hull. That's why I earlier specified cupped brass wire brushes. I paid someone to do mine as I don't have a powerful drill, but I I was not impressed by his lack of enthusiasm. If you have power on site it might be a good idea to get decent tools and DIY, again that's another six hours to factor in.

 

 

I think this is why I'm tempted to wait until I'm off the Llangollen. There are probably going to be odd unforeseen bits of gear that I might need if I DIY it, like these cupped brass wire wheels, or extra brushes, or masks- who knows what. And I'll only have it out of the water for a week, so I'll probably need to get to a supplier quickly if I find that I need something urgently.  And the useful suppliers (and my postal address) are much quicker to get to when I'm in Cheshire than in Shropshire. 

I'm hoping that a good wire brushing of the hull will do some of the job that sand blasting would have.

There are also some fibrous grinder discs that are designed to remove paint very quickly- they might be worth a try. 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Tony1

[PCSB]

2 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

We are booked in for this year so we will see how well the last 2 pk has lasted

When did you last do it and did you sand blast it? Ours is 2 packed and was thinking to have a look next year (2024) to see how its going. Your feedback once you've had a look will be valuable.

[ditchcrawler]

48 minutes ago, BEngo said:

They do work, if properly installled. You can usually see the difference as much reduced corrosion, particularly pitting,  for a radius of about 6ft. 

N

This is Harnser's base plate, the anodes are on the hull side near the bottom of the photo both sides where the black is denser. This was the blacking before the 2 pk

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, Tony1 said:

 

 

I think this is why I'm tempted to wait until I'm off the Llangollen. There are probably going to be odd unforeseen bits of gear that I might need if I DIY it, like these cupped brass wire wheels, or extra brushes, or masks- who knows what. And I'll only have it out of the water for a week, so I'll probably need to get to a supplier quickly if I find that need something I wasnt expecting- and the suppliers (and my postal address) are much quicker to get to when I'm in Cheshire than in Shropshire. 

I'm hoping that a good wire brushing of the hull will do some of the job that sand blasting would have.

There are also some fibrous grinder discs that are designed to remove paint very quickly- they might be worth a try. 

 

 

Come up to the L&L and book Wigan.  There's a selection of hire shops and a ToolStation within a few hundred yards and a Screwfix half a mile away.

 

It's also cheaper than Ellesmere dry dock - £250 for the week.

[ditchcrawler]

2 minutes ago, PCSB said:

When did you last do it and did you sand blast it? Ours is 2 packed and was thinking to have a look next year (2024) to see how its going. Your feedback once you've had a look will be valuable.

4 years at Northwich with high pressure wash only., that is why I am interested to see how well its done.

[PCSB]

Just now, ditchcrawler said:

4 years at Northwich with high pressure wash only., that is why I am interested to see how well its done.

Thanks Brian, be good to know 

[Tony1]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Come up to the L&L and book Wigan.  There's a selection of hire shops and a ToolStation within a few hundred yards and a Screwfix half a mile away.

 

It's also cheaper than Ellesmere dry dock - £250 for the week.

 

I've only just learned how to say 'Pontycysyllte'.

I cant be doing with learning Lancashire. 

Is it t'blacking over there?

 

[Tony1]

7 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

This is Harnser's base plate, the anodes are on the hull side near the bottom of the photo both sides where the black is denser. This was the blacking before the 2 pk

 

There is a part of me looks at that and thinks- if all that the anodes do is to stop that small area from corroding, I'm not sure they are worth it.

 

But I suspect the truth is that without the anodes, the corrosion in the other areas might be worse?

 

 

[matty40s]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Never had 'side mounted' anodes on any NB.

 

You might not have, however, it seems to have been brought up at the surveyors/insurance annual meeting in the last 2 years, as most surveyors have been recommending side anodes to most boats, whether they are needed or not.

 

And to your point about the recessed anodes, no, they dont work, most of the old Stowe Hills with side pocket anodes have just as much galvanic corrosion as any other boat that comes in.

[ditchcrawler]

1 minute ago, Tony1 said:

 

There is a part of me looks at that and thinks- if all that the anodes do is to stop that small area from corroding, I'm not sure they are worth it.

 

But I suspect the truth is that without the anodes, the corrosion in the other areas might be worse?

 

 

That is the base plate, some people say they don't work out of line of sight. The photo doesn't give the best impression and the protection is actually a semi circle of about 4 ft looking with the naked eye, the camera is very close to the base

2 minutes ago, matty40s said:

You might not have, however, it seems to have been brought up at the surveyors/insurance annual meeting in the last 2 years, as most surveyors have been recommending side anodes to most boats, whether they are needed or not.

 

And to your point about the recessed anodes, no, they dont work, most of the old Stowe Hills with side pocket anodes have just as much galvanic corrosion as any other boat that comes in.

I had side anodes and yes they did catch things. 

[haggis]

25 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

We are booked in for this year so we will see how well the last 2 pk has lasted

Ours lasted well ! 

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Tony1 said:

Thing is, the dry dock alone costs about £500 for the week, plus maybe £150 to hire the dryer, washer, and paints etc.

Wrong part of the country for the OP maybe, but for £500+VAT you could hire the dock at Ayelesbury for a week. Boat lifted out of the water on a trolley and placed into indoor heated shed, jacked up to whatever height you want to do the bottom. Hire charge includes pressure washer, access equipment and use of adjacent workshop, kitchen, toilet and shower. Heating and electricity charged at cost. Local welder available to weld on anodes or carry out minor hull repairs.

http://aylesburycanal.org.uk/our-services/slipway-dry-dock/

 

[tree monkey]

6 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

Yes its CRT, but I'm hoping they will have met the visiting tradesmen, and maybe have a memory of some useful contact names that I can maybe look up 

There's a boatyard directly opposite the dry dock in Ellesmere, I imagine there will be a handy welder available, maybe as a side job