Stolen boat alert

[bizzard]

Our litter picking rubbish boat ''bin Laden'' was stolen twice whilst we were in the pub after the pick. Luckily we had taken it's electric outboard motor into the pub too as we always did, it also got thirsty on a hot day. The first time bin Laden was stolen it was abandoned a few hundred yards from the pub, the thieves legged it when they saw us coming, I had the motor on my shoulder.

The second time the thieves got further with it, again they must have seen us coming, for they paddled it to and hid under the London rd road bridge. We saw them hiding under there in bin as we approached. We split up and waited on either side of the bridge with the idea of starving them out if necessary. In the end, we made a truce with them. That if they came out and relinquished poor old bin with no damage we wouldn't call the police, which they agreed to, did so and legged it. Us and bin Laden lived happily ever after.

[Dave Payne]

Hope this one gets found, would hate to find Vidar missing!

 

 

I have been thinking about using an old phone i have, tucking it away and connecting the charger directly to the batteries meaning its always charging when in the marina, then if the boat is removed i figure i have about 3 days of charge, this of course would increase as the boat would more than likely be moving a fair bit to get away from the area. Would then log into the account online and use the find my phone app.

[Southern Star]

 

 

I know of a boat ages ago that was stolen from a hire company in the midlands and found on a mooring in Oxford painted a different colour a few weeks later. So Que Sera Sera must have been lifted out ?

Lifted out, stripped for spares and then gas-axed would be my guess. Although the canal network is geographically large, if you condensed it down there would probably be little more route mileage than that of a medium-sized market town, and it would be vary difficult to alter a narrowboat to the point where it would be unrecognisable, as well as the problems of licensing it.

[peterboat]

it all depends how organised they are. nick, crane out, few alterations paint and it gains the id of a scrap boat purchased a few weeks earlier drop in near london and the job is done not hard or rocket science really, just have to do their homework and these boats have been stood around a year so it could be months before anybody realises

[alan_fincher]

it all depends how organised they are. nick, crane out, few alterations paint and it gains the id of a scrap boat purchased a few weeks earlier drop in near london and the job is done not hard or rocket science really, just have to do their homework and these boats have been stood around a year so it could be months before anybody realises

 

I can't quite see how this would work, as a boat record is a bit more than an index number, and includes (at least) dimensions and who built it.

 

Telling CRT that index number had suddenly become something quite different might raise a few complications. However if you didn't make the details match the boat when a boat checker entered it into their hand held, (as they regularly do), the details of the boat that came up would not match the one they are looking at.

 

Also how many steel narrow boats truly get scrapped, I wonder - not a lot I suspect?

[ditchcrawler]

When I registered Harnser I just told them the name and sent the money and bss cert. no proof of who built it.

[Southern Star]

 

Telling CRT that index number had suddenly become something quite different might raise a few complications. However if you didn't make the details match the boat when a boat checker entered it into their hand held, (as they regularly do), the details of the boat that came up would not match the one they are looking at.

 

 

I've seen the checkers with their hand-held devices but never fully understood what goes on. When they input the number, what details does it come up with? Until you said that I could see how what Peterboat was saying might work, and now I just don't know again. I always assumed they just inputted the number and sped on and that it wasn't until the device was uploaded at HQ that any anomolies would be discovered, and these would only concern movement patterns/ non-licensing etc.

[NigelMoore]

People do occasionally get away with it.

 

Que Sera Sera never got found

 

Was fascinated – following on from the link to the Que Sera Sera thread - to see the thread on Kalzar. Had no knowledge of this Forum at the time, and was oblivious to all the discussion.

 

Kalzar was one of the half-dozen boats in my care that were s.8’d by BW in 2007, leading to the 6 year legal battle. At one point in the following year the Australian owner rang/emailed to ask me to hand over the keys to members of his/his wife’s family for them to keep [he was dubious as to the outcome of my case]. I wasn’t going to carry on keeping his boat for free on my moorings under those conditions so said I would take the boat up to the visitor moorings for BW to look after, and he could liaise with them.

 

I did that, gave the moorings manager the owner’s name, number and email, plus the contact details of his UK family with the keys. The owner rang and emailed them, asking what he needed to pay for the licence, moorings etc, so as to get everything cleared away between them.

 

That was forwarded to debbifiggy, who instantly wrote back stating that she doubted the owner could get a mooring where he proposed, and that if she had the resources just then, she “would s.8 and snatch it”.

 

Instead, they took Kalzar up under the overhanging warehouses where it collected a mass of pigeon droppings over the ensuing months, until the boat had accumulated some £5,000 of allegedly owed overstay charges [at £25/day]. Reminiscent of Leigh Ravenscroft’s situation, they demanded payment of those sums before they would release Kalzar back to the owner’s UK representatives.

 

The owner advertised the boat in the hope of clearing at least something from the mess; the local tea leaf specialising in boats saw the ad, drew up a bill of sale, and took the boat away. BW in fact caught up with him quite quickly, but when he showed them the bill of sale and the advert, claiming the owner had met him on the towpath and taken cash for the boat, the police told BW they could do nothing.

 

It all got very messy and complicated after that, with house raids and elaborate sting operations etc etc. The owner was wanted for frauds here I seem to recall, which was why he was not keen to come over and see to things personally. Certainly, the owner lost the boat in the long run.

 

Debbifiggy’s contribution to the episode was one of the reasons for Hildyard J’s disquiet over BW’s handling of the whole situation with me, as recorded in his judgment. It lends a certain retrospective wry note to her contribution back then, as to how the law should be interpreted: “It's not all totally black and white but mostly. I will leave the grey alone well alone for the chaps and chappesses in the wigs in those rooms with the big leather chairs.”

 

I wonder whether she thought back to that comment when she read the judgment?

[alan_fincher]

When I registered Harnser I just told them the name and sent the money and bss cert. no proof of who built it.

 

Is this your Harnser (There are lots, of course!)?

 

 

Harnser Built by Marque N/bts Ltd - Length : 17.37 metres ( 57 feet ) - Beam : 2.08 metres ( 6 feet 10 inches ) - Draft : 0.61 metres ( 2 feet ). Metal hull N/A power of 55 HP. Registered with Canal & River Trust number 507102 as a Powered Motor Boat. ( Last updated on Wednesday 22nd May 2013 )

 

If so, and you scrapped it and used the number on a stolen boat, the details that CRT staff see against the boat would still suggest that it is a 57 foot boat built by Marque Narrowboats. I suppose how good the data checker was at recognising a length or "breed" would determine whether any suspicions were raised or not?

[GoodGurl]

They would have to be stupid to take a boat up the soar right now seeing as it's on red boards

[tillergirl]

I seem to recall a certain boat used to hide quite well on the Soar, red boards or no.....

[GoodGurl]

I seem to recall a certain boat used to hide quite well on the Soar, red boards or no.....

who?

[tillergirl]

Who? Surely you remember that very lengthy thread that eventually got locked?

[David Mack]

 

I just have this picture in my head of a "high " Speed chase with a day boat with a blue light and siren crewed by the keystone cops , in hot pursuit reaching speeds in excess of 4 mph even past moored boats .woohoo ...

 

It's one of the Shakespeare Line/ Avante hire boats that have been stored at Redhill since they went bust over a year ago.

 

If its an Avante boat, is its disappearance in any way linked to the subject of this post?

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=78166&p=1711074

[zenataomm]

................... I knew someone would ask for the crime number! I'm sure Redhill could provide that if anyone wants to ask.

 

It wasn't someone it was me.

 

Thanks for the offer but I'm not going to bother ringing Redhill to get the details just in case I spot it.

We've gone through this before on this site where a boat is claimed to be stolen and then we find the partner of a joint owner has fallen out with the other party and simply moved it. It's too easy for these things to be a civil issue which hacks the Police off to be called into. A crime number avoids all that.

 

I wouldn't expect anyone to act on my behalf if I couldn't provide proof, nor would I tell them to call up a third party for evidence if they did offer.

[MtB]

I seem to recall a certain boat used to hide quite well on the Soar, red boards or no.....

 

 

Surely that was entirely due to the paintwork design...

[GoodGurl]

Who? Surely you remember that very lengthy thread that eventually got locked?

aahhh no that was the trent, just round the corner, if was lifted out at redhill tho

[Wanderer Vagabond]

Just thinking with a bit of a criminal mind, if I 'acquired' a boat in this fashion, did a swift, albeit not very good, paint job on it and looked up on The Boat Index for a boat of about the same length with a fairly popular name of, say Kingfisher and renamed it. The boat index will give me the Reg number to paint on the side of 'my' boat and with these do it yourself printed licences I could then photoshop myself a licence. I'm sure that there must be a flaw in this, but who is going to pick this boat up as stolen? If a CRT checker comes past and inputs the boat number it will come up as a real boat with a matching name albeit the colour may be wrong but then boats get repainted don't they?

 

It seems too easy so I'm sure I must be missing something.

[alan_fincher]

Just thinking with a bit of a criminal mind, if I 'acquired' a boat in this fashion, did a swift, albeit not very good, paint job on it and looked up on The Boat Index for a boat of about the same length with a fairly popular name of, say Kingfisher and renamed it. The boat index will give me the Reg number to paint on the side of 'my' boat and with these do it yourself printed licences I could then photoshop myself a licence. I'm sure that there must be a flaw in this, but who is going to pick this boat up as stolen? If a CRT checker comes past and inputs the boat number it will come up as a real boat with a matching name albeit the colour may be wrong but then boats get repainted don't they?

 

It seems too easy so I'm sure I must be missing something.

 

There could be a flaw, I guess.

 

If you pick a boat to clone from a very different area, then spottings of both boats might well happen at two very different places near simultaneously, and certainly with it not possible for one boat to have travelled between the two locations in the interval involved. Probably CRT systems are not set up to spot this, but data would certainly exist to show two boats with the same details not near to each other.

 

If however you pick a boat near to where you keep your clone, it is quite possible for them to end up close together, and for both to be recorded separately by a checker ding a patch that day. You might even end up sharing a lock with the boat you cloned.

 

Also the licence will show a home mooring, or indicate the boat doesn't have one, and this will be recorded on CRTs systems. They seem to be looking for "ghost" moorings, so if you keep your boat many miles from a declared home mooring it may well attract interest.

 

You obviously would not wish to take up a CRT directly managed on-line mooring or a BWML marina berth, as they will then know that the boat being kept on it is declared as being moored elsewhere, or as not having a home mooring.

 

Of course it is possible their systems are lax, and you would get away with it, but certainly if they wanted to go through their available data, I'm pretty sure you could be detected.

[Wanderer Vagabond]

 

There could be a flaw, I guess.

 

If you pick a boat to clone from a very different area, then spottings of both boats might well happen at two very different places near simultaneously, and certainly with it not possible for one boat to have travelled between the two locations in the interval involved. Probably CRT systems are not set up to spot this, but data would certainly exist to show two boats with the same details not near to each other.

 

If however you pick a boat near to where you keep your clone, it is quite possible for them to end up close together, and for both to be recorded separately by a checker ding a patch that day. You might even end up sharing a lock with the boat you cloned.

 

Also the licence will show a home mooring, or indicate the boat doesn't have one, and this will be recorded on CRTs systems. They seem to be looking for "ghost" moorings, so if you keep your boat many miles from a declared home mooring it may well attract interest.

 

You obviously would not wish to take up a CRT directly managed on-line mooring or a BWML marina berth, as they will then know that the boat being kept on it is declared as being moored elsewhere, or as not having a home mooring.

 

Of course it is possible their systems are lax, and you would get away with it, but certainly if they wanted to go through their available data, I'm pretty sure you could be detected.

Would you get away with it long enough to sell it on to some poor sucker who doesn't ask enough questions about a boat before buying it? Particularly if you were selling it at a 'good' price, cash only

[alan_fincher]

Would you get away with it long enough to sell it on to some poor sucker who doesn't ask enough questions about a boat before buying it? Particularly if you were selling it at a 'good' price, cash only

 

Quite probably(!)

[ditchcrawler]

 

Is this your Harnser (There are lots, of course!)?

 

 

If so, and you scrapped it and used the number on a stolen boat, the details that CRT staff see against the boat would still suggest that it is a 57 foot boat built by Marque Narrowboats. I suppose how good the data checker was at recognising a length or "breed" would determine whether any suspicions were raised or not?

Thats it, O I do have a licence by the way.

[Mrs Trackman]

There do seem to have been a number of incidents around the trent junction area. There have been a large number of ex Shakespeare/avante boats that have just been sitting at Redhill. They are very recognisable boats without a quick cover up. Isn't it possible one was taken for parts and will be dumped? Or maybe someone will try for a quick sale to an unsuspecting would be live aboard?

[Jim Riley]

I bought a Dawncraft project with no reg number, applied to BW, they gave me a number. It had, afaik, been kept off the canal system.

[ditchcrawler]

I bought a Dawncraft project with no reg number, applied to BW, they gave me a number. It had, afaik, been kept off the canal system.

That it Jim So long as you have a bss and insurance you just say I've got a boat I want to register.

Any sightings of it yet. Cant be making much headway without being noticed in these conditions. Not like there are hundreds of boats out there cruising.