Bow thruster..

[Strads]

Yes, I think the biggest surprise of all when I started having a go at steering big old boats was how much easier it was to reverse and to steer in reverse. Their overall control and manoeuvrability is very impressive compared to smaller modern boats (never tried a big modern one).

 

 

Ah but Sarah - you saw what fun I had at Ricky though side wind - other boats infringing..

I even managed to reverse @300 metres the following monday to pick up dicks folly to tow them home..

 

but I am with Dimple - 1 x 3 metre pole ( about 7 squid) fairly reliable ( i did recently break mine)

but works very well at manouvering in tight spots even when windy..

 

that said - when we bought Lincoln she has had a hydrualic BT fitted in the tube -

(and we found the tank, pump and controller gubbins in the engine room lockers, but as we started out without a BT we have become used to not having one, and like others can manouvre well enough into / out of double locks thorugh one gate,

move from one side to the other in the lock etc etc. - question of learning techniques and what works - and what dosnt..

 

with a suitable crew (SWMBO _ Mrs strads) being on her toes and with a rope have arrived and moored in several 71 ft slots with a 70 ft boat. a case of mainly slowly and gently..

 

I'm sure the debate will be as varied and colourful as MP's expenses...

[Bones]

Bow thrusters are the male version of a women.

 

I am not bothered to have one, but if you have the dosh, and can fit it, then why not. It gives you something to do when you are bored and you get the most wonderfully aggressive tuts, looks and wiggles of the eyebrows - not to mention the special chin wobble and the turning of the face away from you when you use one.

 

Worth it just for that I say!

 

edit - when someone shouts something at you don't forget to push the bow thruster button at the same time and put your hand to your ear and say you cant hear them because of the engine....

 

Edited June 5, 2009 by Bones

[Naughty Cal]

!edit - when someone shouts something at you don't forget to push the bow thruster button at the same time and put your hand to your ear and say you cant hear them because of the engine....

 

Oh the sound of a harrased bow thruster...............

Edited June 5, 2009 by Phylis

[MoominPapa]

Bow thrusters are the male version of a women.

I always though men were the male version of women?

 

I'm clearly nothing like enigmatic enough to understand this......

 

MP.

[blackrose]

Im not arguing that case. But for someone to say that they can not reverse without a bow thruster suggests that should the time arise where it breaks (as they do) they will be left up the creek with out the preverbial paddle.

 

To compare a BT with an engine is just nonsense. Or should we all revert back to the horse?

If you'd read my post prioperly you'd see that I wasn't comparing engines and bow thrusters- I was comparing their misuse!

However, now that you mention it if we we're to oppose all modern developments on canal boats, then yes, we should all go back to the horse.

 

Bow thrusters are used in many types of boat, both commercial and recreational all over the world, yet nowhere else but the inland waterways of this country does this parochial anti-BT attitude persist.

I wonder what that says about us?

 

As I said earlier, if you don't want one don't get one, its not like anyone is being forced to have one fitted.

Edited June 5, 2009 by blackrose

[PeterG]

Going back to the original point of the thread, until a couple of weeks a go I had never owned a boat with a bow thruster. However in that time I have steered a large number of different lengths and hull designs, some with more success than others.

 

I have always managed to cope although one particular boat only had slightly rounded ends rather than a swim and normally enjoy the challenge.

 

Anyway a couple of weeks a go my new boat now has a decent electric bow thruster. The boat is 62 feet traditional looking with long swims.

 

So far just for interest I have used the bow thruster only for tricky positions like getting out of a mooring with the wind against me and limited space to spare. In these cases I have found it easier to use the bow thruster than not, although using the bow thruster has never been essential but perhaps the lazy alternative.

 

In summary with my short experience of using as against many years not having a bow thruster yes I can see a use although only very rarely and probably constrained to fine tuning of getting in and out of moorings.

 

I now withdraw to look at the election results........

[nb Innisfree]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

[GUMPY]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

 

Managed just under a kilometre in a barge without a BT...........

Well it did have one but it was broken.

Mind you we did have a 25kg weight on a rope off the bow.

Edited June 5, 2009 by idleness

[Naughty Cal]

Can reverse all day for you if you want. It dont wander around as much at slow speed in reverse

 

Edit: No bowthrusters

Edited June 5, 2009 by Phylis

[Semitrad]

So if it breaks you cant reverse?

 

I didn't say I couldn't reverse, Phylis, only that it's not the easiest manouevre for me, why struggle with poles when a press of the button will do the job?

 

If the morse control breaks I can't reverse either, or do much else come to that!

[Naughty Cal]

I didn't say I couldn't reverse, Phylis, only that it's not the easiest manouevre for me, why struggle with poles when a press of the button will do the job?

 

If the morse control breaks I can't reverse either, or do much else come to that!

 

Why bother driving at all. I hear auto-pilit systems are getting better by the day

[Semitrad]

Why bother driving at all. I hear auto-pilit systems are getting better by the day

 

Perhaps the mods could move this to the "Friday joke" thread it's so funny.

[Chertsey]

As I said earlier, if you don't want one don't get one, its not like anyone is being forced to have one fitted.

NO, but the OP did specifically ask for people's experiences of whether or not they found them helpful/necessary.

[Dominic M]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

Didn't Mot Tlor do much of the system entirely in reverse without a bowthruster, as recorded in his seminal book, Taob Worran?

[Chertsey]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

But how often would you need to do that?

[dave moore]

Hi all

As a traditionalist with a long time around boats, I'm in the "no" camp personally. I don't mind using shafts and or ropes to help manouvre the boat. I also echo the earlier comment of over use of the engine at high power levels for winding etc, a scenario I call "White water rafting".

However....a couple of years ago I was decorating a trad tug for a customer and, on expressing surprise at having one, he replied that health problems in advancing age made it difficult to move around as easily as before, this factor was the clincher for him! I couldn't disagree. It's a dilemma I hope to avoid for a long time yet.....just a thought

Cheers

Dave

[dor]

However....a couple of years ago I was decorating a trad tug for a customer and, on expressing surprise at having one, he replied that health problems in advancing age made it difficult to move around as easily as before, this factor was the clincher for him! I couldn't disagree. It's a dilemma I hope to avoid for a long time yet.....just a thought

 

 

 

 

When my boat was built I had a BT tube installed ,but no BT. It is there for future requirments if needed, and it is for the reason given in the quote that I fitted the tube. It might just keep me boating a little longer if or when we get too infirm to manage the boat as it is.

[carlt]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

I used to regularly wind at the Kilsby road winding hole then reverse the 500 yards or so, to the pub.

 

Never had a hitch (or a bow thruster), either.

 

Edited to add: This is on the N.Oxford, in Rugby, btw. I'd wind in the boatyard, next to the pub but I've heard he can be a funny so and so.

Edited June 5, 2009 by carlt

[wrigglefingers]

Okay, I don't have BTs on Surprise (old boat), never missed them either, but then I mostly have crew with poles at weekends. As I'm proposing to single-hand Cobbett (new boat) round the system I've installed hydraulic ones. Dave Harris has just announced that they're 'very impressive'. I don't think anyone would doubt Dave's credentials as a boatbuilder so that's the end of the argument for me.

 

I probably won't need them every day or even every week, but I might just find myself in tight spot (oo-er!) without help and that's when I'll be grateful I've got them.

Edited June 5, 2009 by wrigglefingers

[mayalld]

But how often would you need to do that?

 

I do it regularly!

 

We moor 200 yards from a winding hole, and I often reverse up to it when setting off.

 

I have no BT, and have no problem with reversing that distance.

[Allan(nb Albert)]

I used to regularly wind at the Kilsby road winding hole then reverse the 500 yards or so, to the pub.

 

Never had a hitch (or a bow thruster), either.

 

Edited to add: This is on the N.Oxford, in Rugby, btw. I'd wind in the boatyard, next to the pub but I've heard he can be a funny so and so.

 

I passed that way a couple of weeks ago and it seems someone had left the cage door open again.

[Allan(nb Albert)]

Before we start...

 

this is not about theoretical benefits, and not a thread for any body who has no practical experience or benefits of having a a BT fitted.

 

It is a thread asking about practical benefits of a BT as fitted to a 60 foot boat, reliabilty, manouverility advantages.

 

Cheers all...

 

Please Sir - I have some practical experience!

 

Having worked in the "shared ownership industry" for a time I have plenty of experience of handling this size of boat with and without bowthrusters.

 

In general, it can be said that electric bowthrusters have proved unreliable in the industry. Indeed, I believe that many ex-Challenger boats simply had electric bow thrusters removed or disabled due to repair costs. However, I am aware of one OwnerShips boat (not a standard design) that has been successfully using an electric bowthruster for many years. As I understand it, electric bowthrusters are simply less robust than hydraulic and tend to suffer from "flat battery syndrome" just when you need them.

 

Despite some of the early boats having teething problems which took time to resolve under warranty, hydraulic bow thrusters have proved reasonably reliable in the high intensity use they get in the shared ownership industry.

 

With regard to handling, I have found them to be a positive benefit when reversing, getting on and off the bank, winding, realigning the bow when entering a lock in windy conditions and manoureving in confined spaces. They are also of benefit when single handed.

 

I think there is a lot of resistance from those who consider themselves to be good helmsman. However, to use a bowthruster effectively requires an additional skill set that they never aquire.

 

Bow thrusters are a matter of personal choice. My choice is not to have one on nb Albert which is only 47' but even if I had a 60' to 70' boat I still would not have one. To me the benefit does not outweigh the additional complexity and cost.

 

Regards

 

Allan

 

ps I have no knowledge of jet thruster systems now being introduced on some shared boats.

[David Schweizer]

When our BT was working we could reverse hundreds of yards without a hitch I have yet to see anyone achieve that without a BT

Just because you haven't seen it doen, does not mean that it cannot be done.

 

A few years ago I had to reverse the full length of the Thrupp Moorings (for Alan's benefit, on the Oxford), from the swing bridge to the bridge by the Jolly Boatman pub, a distance of nearly half a mile. Someone positioned themselves on the fore deck to steer with a pole if needed, and was surprised how little the pole had to be used, except for the bend.

 

As I have already said, it has a lot to do with the underwater shape of the hull, something whch is ignored by many modern boatbuilders.

Edited June 5, 2009 by David Schweizer

[Guest]

Many thanks to all who posted responses relevant to my OP - you know who you are...

[Allan(nb Albert)]

Just because you haven't seen it doen, does not mean that it cannot be done.

 

A few years ago I had to reverse the full length of the Thrupp Moorings (for Alan's benefit, on the Oxford), from the swing bridge to the bridge by the Jolly Boatman pub, a distance of nearly half a mile. Someone positioned themselves on the fore deck to steer with a pole if needed, and was surprised how little the pole had to be used, except for the bend.

 

As I have already said, it has a lot to do with the underwater shape of the hull, something whch is ignored by many modern boatbuilders.

 

To put this into perspective - my experience is that some boats are better at reversing in a straight line than others. As David suggests this is very much due to underwater shape of the hull but local conditions also have a bearing - the profile of the canal and wind.

 

If you get everything right you can get your boat to reverse in a straight line - you may even manage to get some crude form of steering. With a bow thruster you can actually steer the boat properly.

 

Regards

 

Allan