understanding my batteries ???

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, waterdog said:

yes I do have 1.2kw solar but it was doing nowt at 0745 this morning, in fact it did the best part of bu**er all, all day :0

It could have been making your state of charge estimate inaccurate if the inverter/freezer load hadn't already done so.

Edited January 8, 2020 by rusty69
changed would to could

[bizzard]

Good news.  I'm workin on an invention. It'll be a ''Talking Battery'', A talking battery for those of us that have no monitoring devices, gauges. For the ones who do and that have been reading all the stuff on here about monitoring them with all manner of expensive electronic gizmos like flashin lights, bleeping things and all that old tosh, including that effort of a Smartgauge thing. Just think of it though, no continual gauge watching anymore, ears aprick listening for electronic bleeps, sore, smarting eyes caused by trying to look at all the gauges at once, monitors and monitors monitoring the monitors that probably rob your batteries of more power than all your appliances do put together. Worrying yourself demented  day and night thinking and dreaming about the condition of your batteries.

  Of course the ''Talking Battery'' will not suit everyone, 90% is likely as posts about it on this ere forum show, They seem to love it, even through the night when the excuse is declared that they've risen from their bed to have a wee but really its to check all the gauges and gloat over the Smartgauge.

    Anyway all that old junk can be thrown away as the ''Talking Battery'' will keep you informed of its health condition, even from afar as it will have a loud voice.

  An example of the remarks that it will holler out when it cries out for attention are    I'M FEELING CHILLY, STICK THE HEATING ON YOU MEAN SOD.   Or I'M THIRSTY, I NEED A DRINK, or I'M BOILING HOT TURN THAT HORRIBLE BEAST OF A CHARGER OFF, or I'M FEELING A BIT FLAT TODAY SO TURN THAT WRETCHED CHARGER UP, or I HAVE A DEAD CELL THAT'S SHORTING OUT, DISCONNECT ME QUICK OR I'LL BLOW YOU TO KINGDOM COME.

All this can be heard while sitting in you chair far away from your dashboard.

  The only problem I'm having before presenting it to the worldwide market is setting it with all the different lingo's. At the moment I've only managed one, Congealeeze, the country of Congeal of which I've never heard of.  But I'll get it right soon so that any langwidge can be set on the ''Talking Battery'' by twiddling a big knob.                       Wotch this space. 

    

 

[rusty69]

7 minutes ago, bizzard said:

An example of the remarks that it will holler out when it cries out for attention are    I'M FEELING CHILLY, STICK THE HEATING ON YOU MEAN SOD.   Or I'M THIRSTY, I NEED A DRINK, or I'M BOILING HOT

Already got one thanks...... Its called Mrs Rusty. 

[system 4-50]

1 hour ago, bizzard said:

Good news.  I'm workin on an invention. It'll be a ''Talking Battery'', A talking battery for those of us that have no monitoring devices, gauges. For the ones who do and that have been reading all the stuff on here about monitoring them with all manner of expensive electronic gizmos like flashin lights, bleeping things and all that old tosh, including that effort of a Smartgauge thing. Just think of it though, no continual gauge watching anymore, ears aprick listening for electronic bleeps, sore, smarting eyes caused by trying to look at all the gauges at once, monitors and monitors monitoring the monitors that probably rob your batteries of more power than all your appliances do put together. Worrying yourself demented  day and night thinking and dreaming about the condition of your batteries.

  Of course the ''Talking Battery'' will not suit everyone, 90% is likely as posts about it on this ere forum show, They seem to love it, even through the night when the excuse is declared that they've risen from their bed to have a wee but really its to check all the gauges and gloat over the Smartgauge.

    Anyway all that old junk can be thrown away as the ''Talking Battery'' will keep you informed of its health condition, even from afar as it will have a loud voice.

  An example of the remarks that it will holler out when it cries out for attention are    I'M FEELING CHILLY, STICK THE HEATING ON YOU MEAN SOD.   Or I'M THIRSTY, I NEED A DRINK, or I'M BOILING HOT TURN THAT HORRIBLE BEAST OF A CHARGER OFF, or I'M FEELING A BIT FLAT TODAY SO TURN THAT WRETCHED CHARGER UP, or I HAVE A DEAD CELL THAT'S SHORTING OUT, DISCONNECT ME QUICK OR I'LL BLOW YOU TO KINGDOM COME.

All this can be heard while sitting in you chair far away from your dashboard.

  The only problem I'm having before presenting it to the worldwide market is setting it with all the different lingo's. At the moment I've only managed one, Congealeeze, the country of Congeal of which I've never heard of.  But I'll get it right soon so that any langwidge can be set on the ''Talking Battery'' by twiddling a big knob.                       Wotch this space. 

    

 

You've obviously got years of development still do - choosing the name.

[Lord Gadbury]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Start the engine ay 08:00 tomorrow and run it until 21:00 and see if you can get the battery(s) fully charged, it looks to me as if you have not yet managed to get them properly charged.

Then turn off everything and connect up a known load (old-style 55w car headlight bulb is good) run the load until the battery drops to 12.1 volts disconnect the load and battery should recover to 12.2 volts. How long did it take to get from 'full' to 12.2 volts ?

What was the 'known load' wattage ?

 

Keeping doing 'a couple of hours' is not achieving anything as you are still using 'leccy in the interim so we don' know what you are actually getting to.

I will happily do an eletonic version of the drop test, now called 'Load Test.

There are loads off reasons why an alternator doesnt perform well, overheating would be my guess.

 

I would be annoyed if I had to sit in a boat, with the engine running all day long. 

[bizzard]

Stop Press. The good news has travelled fast, reports of my coming invention are arriving from far and wide, Such as...

 Mrs Ilean O'Flattery of Tipparary. Oim lookin forward to it be'jez.  Mr Ching Chang Chillyknees and his wife Orchid Blossom from Canton. I make  you lots Torkin Batterly, me make lots and lots cheap.  Herr Adolph Gross- Kopf, of Munich,  Fool, fool  Imbecile,  zat not never wurken.   Mrs Zulazularamy, Lake Chad, Sahara, I lik.................................... Sorry lost contact with her.  Mrs Ching Fragrant Feet of Limehouse East London, This is idea road of lubbish.  Mr Gullable from Canvey Island, I'd buy them.  Mr Singh of Bradford, Good idea I buy them no problem.  Mrs Oso Sandy, Gobi desert, Good for my tent. Mr B.Johnson, Downing st.  HO ho, excellent, I will consult my mate Trump to except an import.

   So all is looking good.

Edited January 8, 2020 by bizzard

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, Pompey said:

I will happily do an eletonic version of the drop test, now called 'Load Test.

There are loads off reasons why an alternator doesnt perform well, overheating would be my guess.

 

I would be annoyed if I had to sit in a boat, with the engine running all day long. 

A drop test will be of no help.

For leisure batteries you need a controlled long duration draw that takes you from 100% SoC down to a known SoC (ideally 50% to make the maths simple)

[Lord Gadbury]

The 'Load Test' says wether the battery is holding a charge.from a Leisure PoV, that is what the Electronic Version of the drop test ( oh how we learn ) which people relied on.

 

Batteries, ' A way of storing electricity' understanding how that happens, is amazing  

A great fred title!

[Alan de Enfield]

20 minutes ago, Pompey said:

The 'Load Test' says wether the battery is holding a charge.

I was under the impression the OP knows that his battery 'holds a charge', but was trying to find out how much it is holding.

His battery bank was 500Ah when new, but it is not that now - so what is it now ?

 

Will your drop-test tell you that ?

Edited January 9, 2020 by Alan de Enfield

[Lord Gadbury]

No it wont test that. I am not aware of a test that will tell you that.

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, Pompey said:

No it wont test that. I am not aware of a test that will tell you that.

The test I suggested will tell you exactly that.

 

There is a lot of good information on the forum that could help you to get a better understanding of battery management.

Edited January 9, 2020 by Alan de Enfield

[rusty69]

6 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The test I suggested will tell you exactly that.

 

There is a lot of good information on the forum that could help you to get a better understanding of battery management.

Alan, stop arguing with the British Marine certified Electrician and Electronics installer. 

 

 

You know it makes sense! 

[roland elsdon]

11 hours ago, bizzard said:

Good news.  I'm workin on an invention. It'll be a ''Talking Battery'', A talking battery for those of us that have no monitoring devices, gauges. For the ones who do and that have been reading all the stuff on here about monitoring them with all manner of expensive electronic gizmos like flashin lights, bleeping things and all that old tosh, including that effort of a Smartgauge thing. Just think of it though, no continual gauge watching anymore, ears aprick listening for electronic bleeps, sore, smarting eyes caused by trying to look at all the gauges at once, monitors and monitors monitoring the monitors that probably rob your batteries of more power than all your appliances do put together. Worrying yourself demented  day and night thinking and dreaming about the condition of your batteries.

  Of course the ''Talking Battery'' will not suit everyone, 90% is likely as posts about it on this ere forum show, They seem to love it, even through the night when the excuse is declared that they've risen from their bed to have a wee but really its to check all the gauges and gloat over the Smartgauge.

    Anyway all that old junk can be thrown away as the ''Talking Battery'' will keep you informed of its health condition, even from afar as it will have a loud voice.

  An example of the remarks that it will holler out when it cries out for attention are    I'M FEELING CHILLY, STICK THE HEATING ON YOU MEAN SOD.   Or I'M THIRSTY, I NEED A DRINK, or I'M BOILING HOT TURN THAT HORRIBLE BEAST OF A CHARGER OFF, or I'M FEELING A BIT FLAT TODAY SO TURN THAT WRETCHED CHARGER UP, or I HAVE A DEAD CELL THAT'S SHORTING OUT, DISCONNECT ME QUICK OR I'LL BLOW YOU TO KINGDOM COME.

All this can be heard while sitting in you chair far away from your dashboard.

  The only problem I'm having before presenting it to the worldwide market is setting it with all the different lingo's. At the moment I've only managed one, Congealeeze, the country of Congeal of which I've never heard of.  But I'll get it right soon so that any langwidge can be set on the ''Talking Battery'' by twiddling a big knob.                       Wotch this space. 

    

 

It also opens up the title of the thread. Understanding my batteries. Now you can communicate you can understand their psyche.

Why are you flat? Are you depressed?

Is death imminent or can you keep going a few more weeks?

 

I can see a role for trained battery whisperers  dedicated to keeping boat batteries in prime health. Or is it just bunkum like most alternative therapy.

[Alan de Enfield]

2 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Alan, stop arguing with the British Marine certified Electrician and Electronics installer. 

 

 

You know it makes sense! 

Ah ………………. that'll explain why he's talking carp !!

[cuthound]

6 hours ago, Pompey said:

No it wont test that. I am not aware of a test that will tell you that.

 

A discharge test at a steady rate, preferably at not more than 10% of the original rated capacity, increasing load as the voltage drops to keep the current constant.

 

Take specific gravity and voltage readings at least every hour, until the battery is at 50% SoC. Count how many amp hours have been discharged, and double that to get the actual battery capacity.

[WotEver]

Just now, cuthound said:

 

A discharge test at a steady rate, preferably at not more than 10% of the original rated capacity, increasing load as the voltage drops to keep the current constant.

 

Take specific gravity and voltage readings at least every hour, until the battery is at 50% SoC. Count how many amp hours have been discharged, and double that to get the actual battery capacity.

Or a quick ‘n dirty equivalent - discharge until the Smartgauge reads 50% and read the Ah counter, then double the reading. 

[cuthound]

3 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Or a quick ‘n dirty equivalent - discharge until the Smartgauge reads 50% and read the Ah counter, then double the reading. 

 

Yup that works , providing you have a Smartgauge (and it is in calibration - MtB could average his three to get an approximate capacity ?)

[Alan de Enfield]

20 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Or a quick ‘n dirty equivalent - discharge until the Smartgauge reads 50% and read the Ah counter, then double the reading. 

Or just use a bulb and a voltmeter as suggested about 20 posts ago.

It will at least give you a 'somewhere near' idea of capacity.

[Richard10002]

1 hour ago, WotEver said:

Or a quick ‘n dirty equivalent - discharge until the Smartgauge reads 50% and read the Ah counter, then double the reading. 

That's what I have tended to do. If it's roughly the same over a few cycles, it's likely to be there or thereabouts.

[WotEver]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Or just use a bulb and a voltmeter as suggested about 20 posts ago.

It will at least give you a 'somewhere near' idea of capacity.

Yup, the falling voltage and hence reduced C rating isn’t really relevant for this purpose. 

[ditchcrawler]

 

18 hours ago, Pompey said:

The 'Load Test' says wether the battery is holding a charge.from a Leisure PoV, that is what the Electronic Version of the drop test ( oh how we learn ) which people relied on.

 

Batteries, ' A way of storing electricity' understanding how that happens, is amazing  

A great fred title!

How long is the test on for?

[MtB]

13 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Alan, stop arguing with the British Marine certified Electrician and Electronics installer. 

 

 

Is that in his signature? I can't see it.

 

Swerving off at a tangent, I normally have sigs turned OFF as most of them are dull as mud and just as irritating. I just turned them back ON again to see if that nice Mr Pompey has one, and they still don't display. Is this another forum software bug? 

 

 

What makes you think he is a British Marine certified Electrician and Electronics installer?

 

 

(From his level of battery knowledge I'd have guessed 'plumber'  )

 

 

[BEngo]

Surely If he was plumber he'd have 3 Smartgauges, all with different calibrations.

[Alan de Enfield]

15 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

(From his level of battery knowledge I'd have guessed 'plumber'  )

Maybe a professional attention seeker.

[Lord Gadbury]

Ok fair coment, to all,.

 

No installs but looking at systems. Sorry I didnt want to come across Smug, or an Oracle.

 

I will be replacing batteries next year, the winter has taken toll on them, I have a hybrid system, if you include the inverter.

 

Sorry that I didnt come across that well.

 

Yes, certification is a requirement, in order to get insurance etc. it is a thing that has to be done. If I come across wrong on a forum I am sorry about that.

 

The one thing I have learned since owning a boat, is every day is a learning experience.

 

Apologies for any offence caused, certainly not intended.

 

 

The 'Load Test' says wether the battery is holding a charge.from a Leisure PoV, that is what the Electronic Version of the drop test ( oh how we learn ) which people relied on.

 

Batteries, ' A way of storing electricity' understanding how that happens, is amazing  

A great fred title!