Lock etiquette

[IanR]

I'm fairly new to this game and haven't had many issues I'm my short time boating, but I came across something the other day that, a, I couldn't fathom a reason for, and b, caused my 71 year old mother injury which must have more than smarted a little!!

 

We were locking down the first of a flight and met another boat coming up. We both left each others lock set to be helpful. I did the driving and my mum and missus did the locks. My mum, although knocking on(!!!) is still quite handy opened one of the top paddles but failed to notice that the ratchet was not engaged, so when she let go of the windlass it spun back and whacked her in the mouth. She did manage to catch the handle the next time round though, but the one smack was enough to loosen 3 teeth and cut the inside of her mouth. She used to boat regularly so is should be well versed in the methods. She has re learned the methods now though! I know that we should all check the ratchet position but the question is what reason would there be for ever leaving the ratchet disengaged, as the rest of the locks in the flight were all the same?

 

Ian.

[Guest]

I'm fairly new to this game and haven't had many issues I'm my short time boating, but I came across something the other day that, a, I couldn't fathom a reason for, and b, caused my 71 year old mother injury which must have more than smarted a little!!

 

We were locking down the first of a flight and met another boat coming up. We both left each others lock set to be helpful. I did the driving and my mum and missus did the locks. My mum, although knocking on(!!!) is still quite handy opened one of the top paddles but failed to notice that the ratchet was not engaged, so when she let go of the windlass it spun back and whacked her in the mouth. She did manage to catch the handle the next time round though, but the one smack was enough to loosen 3 teeth and cut the inside of her mouth. She used to boat regularly so is should be well versed in the methods. She has re learned the methods now though! I know that we should all check the ratchet position but the question is what reason would there be for ever leaving the ratchet disengaged, as the rest of the locks in the flight were all the same?

 

Ian.

 

I always use to drop them back over,

 

but equally I always used to check that the previous user had done so before winding the paddles up.

[Machpoint005]

If somebody has wound a paddle down (as is recommended) they have no reason to replace the pawl, although many do out of politeness.

If anybody is going to draw a paddle, they should first check that the ratchet is engaged. Basic safety rule.

[by'eck]

Its not unusual for the ratchet arms to be left off/open. Whether this is acceptable or not, I think it fair to say that the onus is on the next operator to ensure they are engaged before lifting a paddle.

[nicknorman]

I'm fairly new to this game and haven't had many issues I'm my short time boating, but I came across something the other day that, a, I couldn't fathom a reason for, and b, caused my 71 year old mother injury which must have more than smarted a little!!

 

We were locking down the first of a flight and met another boat coming up. We both left each others lock set to be helpful. I did the driving and my mum and missus did the locks. My mum, although knocking on(!!!) is still quite handy opened one of the top paddles but failed to notice that the ratchet was not engaged, so when she let go of the windlass it spun back and whacked her in the mouth. She did manage to catch the handle the next time round though, but the one smack was enough to loosen 3 teeth and cut the inside of her mouth. She used to boat regularly so is should be well versed in the methods. She has re learned the methods now though! I know that we should all check the ratchet position but the question is what reason would there be for ever leaving the ratchet disengaged, as the rest of the locks in the flight were all the same?

 

Ian.

Sorry for the injury to your mum, but it is the responsibility of whoever comes to use the lock to check that the ratchet is on before use. I would have thought the absence of the usual clicking sound would be a give away, and anyway I always back the windlass off gently to ensure the ratchet is engaged - some can have a tendancy to slip. Also one should never "let go of the windlass" whilst it is still in the spindle. It should be removed from the spindle for just the reason your mum discovered.

 

So overall, sorry but you can't blame anybody but your mum, and yourself for not correcting her poor technique.

Edited February 23, 2016 by nicknorman

[Machpoint005]

Is this a contender for the record for "fastest consensus on the forum"?

[gazza]

One thing should be taken from this is that you should never attempt to stop an out of control windlass, leave the bugger go and hope it doesn't wallop anything made of bone and flesh.

 

It's the fast way to getting broken bones.

 

Bad news about your mum's teeth, I can feel that typing this (not a fan of dentists!)

[nicknorman]

Is this a contender for the record for "fastest consensus on the forum"?

Probably. What is worrying is the increasing tendency for folk to feel that if something has gone wrong, it must be somebody else's fault. Ok the OP doesn't specifically say this, but it is the implication.

[mayalld]

I'm fairly new to this game and haven't had many issues I'm my short time boating, but I came across something the other day that, a, I couldn't fathom a reason for, and b, caused my 71 year old mother injury which must have more than smarted a little!!

 

We were locking down the first of a flight and met another boat coming up. We both left each others lock set to be helpful. I did the driving and my mum and missus did the locks. My mum, although knocking on(!!!) is still quite handy opened one of the top paddles but failed to notice that the ratchet was not engaged, so when she let go of the windlass it spun back and whacked her in the mouth. She did manage to catch the handle the next time round though, but the one smack was enough to loosen 3 teeth and cut the inside of her mouth. She used to boat regularly so is should be well versed in the methods. She has re learned the methods now though! I know that we should all check the ratchet position but the question is what reason would there be for ever leaving the ratchet disengaged, as the rest of the locks in the flight were all the same?

 

Ian.

 

There is no reason to assume that the mechanism will have been left with safety devices engaged, so you and your crew are responsible for engaging them yourselves.

 

There are perfectly valid reasons for leaving the pawl off;

 

It is much safer when lowering a paddle to take up the tension single handed, remove the pawl and then wind down with 2 hands than to wind down one handed whilst holding the pawl with fingers near to the mechanism.

 

In some cases, an open gate can hold a paddle open a little, and putting the pawl on leads to water loss. Leaving the pawl off allows the paddle to seat properly.

[IanR]

I kind of assumed we'd be getting the 'its for the operator to check ....' bit, which of course it is, but I just thought I'd ask the question as I've never come across the issue before. (I know its not an issue, it can be the norm!) It just seems to my logic that if you drop the paddle you should flip the ratchet back over. My mums fine now, just a bit embarrassed that it caught her out.

 

Thanks folks.

 

Ian.

Probably. What is worrying is the increasing tendency for folk to feel that if something has gone wrong, it must be somebody else's fault. Ok the OP doesn't specifically say this, but it is the implication.

The implication isn't there at all, it was a post to learn, not to blame, but thanks anyhow.

 

Ian.

In some cases, an open gate can hold a paddle open a little, and putting the pawl on leads to water loss. Leaving the pawl off allows the paddle to seat properly.

Now that is a reason for leaving the ratchet disengaged, thankyou.

 

Ian.

[Paul C]

There's an argument for leaving the catches off, to clearly show that the paddle is fully down. Its possible to lower the paddle say 95% of the way down then engage the catch and it will 'leak' an amount of water. Of course...if the mechanism is stiff, the catch off doesn't guarantee its fully down either......hmmmmmm.......

 

Whilst of course checking the catch is engaged is a sensible thing to always do, even if you inadvertently miss it the fact that there is no click should alert you.

 

ALSO its worth developing a technique where the windlass won't smack you in the mouth and not rely on the catch to stop the paddle closing, because 1) some catches are loose or dodgy and 2) certain lock designs require the catch to be disengaged to allow its operation.

[haza]

hi ian i am with you on this one ,leave them as you found them ..i think ..but not every one do locks the same way ...

[nicknorman]

The implication isn't there at all, it was a post to learn, not to blame, but thanks anyhow.

 

 

 

Glad to hear it.

[magictime]

So, taking it as given that it's ultimately the responsibility of a person winding up a paddle to check the ratchet is engaged, can we come to a consensus on this? After winding down a paddle, should you:

 

(1) Put the ratchet back on to lessen the risk of injury to a subsequent user who may fail to check (whether as a result of inexperience, complacency, or whatever)?

 

(2) Leave the ratchet off to lessen the risk of water leakage?

 

(3) Doesn't matter - you don't have a crystal ball and can't be responsible for what happens in either case?

 

I'm inclined to think (3) is a bit of a cop-out - I mean, just because it's not ultimately your responsibility to manage some risk or other, doesn't mean you shouldn't lift a finger (which is literally what we're talking about here!) to minimise it. So, (1) or (2)? Is water leakage caused by engaged ratchets a sufficiently serious, foreseeable issue that one shouldn't err on the side of minimising the risk of injury?

[NickF]

I always put them back on when I can just to leave everything as I found it, there are I think some ground paddles where the catch can not be left in place when closed as it is balanced to fall away from the mechanism. Sp yes I agree with the above, check and double check rather than relying on others top do their bit.

 

Having said that I wish the OP's mother well and I hope she recovers quickly,

[Jerra]

1 as far as I am concerned. It doesn't take long and you may protect somebody from inexperience,carelessness or their own complacency.

[Ray T]

I was taught that when using a windlass to stand in line with the windlass facing the opposite side of the lock, not facing along the length of the canal, if that makes sense?

 

So if one slips with the windlass it doesn't either hit you in the face of across the back of the arm. It may fly off and into the cut or hit someone close by though.

 

With "hard" paddles I realise this isn't always practical though.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Ray T

[system 4-50]

Technique errors:

 

1. When winding a windlass no part of your body should enter the space described by the arc of the windlass at any time.

 

2. When stopping after lifting the paddle, the windlass should be eased back until the load is taken by the ratchet. This is a distinct step in the process. If the ratchet is not in place or broken then this will be discovered at this point. Only when there is no load on the windlass should removal be attempted.

[mayalld]

So, taking it as given that it's ultimately the responsibility of a person winding up a paddle to check the ratchet is engaged, can we come to a consensus on this? After winding down a paddle, should you:

 

(1) Put the ratchet back on to lessen the risk of injury to a subsequent user who may fail to check (whether as a result of inexperience, complacency, or whatever)?

 

(2) Leave the ratchet off to lessen the risk of water leakage?

 

(3) Doesn't matter - you don't have a crystal ball and can't be responsible for what happens in either case?

 

I'm inclined to think (3) is a bit of a cop-out - I mean, just because it's not ultimately your responsibility to manage some risk or other, doesn't mean you shouldn't lift a finger (which is literally what we're talking about here!) to minimise it. So, (1) or (2)? Is water leakage caused by engaged ratchets a sufficiently serious, foreseeable issue that one shouldn't err on the side of minimising the risk of injury?

 

I will do what keeps me safe.

 

Replacing pawls actually makes it LESS safe for others, as it leads people to assume that pawls will be on, and to fail to routinely check themselves.

[billS]

Of course there is no ambiguity if you do it the old fashioned way and just leave the gates open and the paddles up...

[captain birdseye]

The bottom gates at Marple are a classic example where the gate paddles don't fully close with the gates open. Many times we have come across people wondering why they can't get the top gate open and the level in the upper pound is dropping, and when you get to the bottom gates the paddles are a couple of inches open with the ratchet on. It's one of the reasons why Marples pounds are quite often low

Edited February 23, 2016 by captain birdseye

[Athy]

The safety catch should always be replaced by the person operating the lock mechanism. It is courteous, helpful and it is safer. Not to do so is selfish, lazy, rude and, as we have seen, dangerous.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Athy

[Guest]

The safety catch should always be replaced by the person operating the lock mechanism. It is courteous, helpful and it is safer. Not to do so is selfish, lazy, rude and, as we have seen, dangerous.

 

Of course it is, how leaving it off could be seen in any other way unless there is a particular reason at a particular location is beyond me TBH.

[mayalld]

The safety catch should always be replaced by the person operating the lock mechanism. It is courteous, helpful and it is safer. Not to do so is selfish, lazy, rude and, as we have seen, dangerous.

 

Disagree.

 

It is vital that people check that the pawl is on before operating a lock. If they get into the habit of NOT checking (because it is somebody else's job), then they are setting themselves up for a problem.

 

replacing the pawl also encourages people to lower paddles one handed with fingers close to the mechanism.

[Athy]

 

 

 

It is vital that people check that the pawl is on before operating a lock.

Precisely, mon vieux - so let it be on.