How much force on a mooring pin?

[nb Innisfree]

We were once moored opposite some boats and shortly after a boat owner went to work his boat would pull one of its pins out and come bumping into us. After a three hundred walk round to the other side I saw that his remaining pin was about 15" in length, knocked in about 6" and tied off at the top! This happened a couple of times until I managed to meet him and explain, his reaction was to throw his hands up in despair saying he just didn't know what else he could do. When I explained that knocking pins all the way in would improve things it was a revelation to him, as if it was some amazing discovery! His small ball pein hammer didn't help matters either so after I showed him our large two handed lump hammer he went and bought a half decent one and some bigger pins.

 

Some folk do seem to bumble along.

[luctor et emergo]

Another problem with the 'mooring pins' as sold by swindlers chandlers, is that eye at the top. Most boaters tie their line to that, or run the line through it, and back to the boat. Fine if you sledge your pin right in, but most boaters only knock their pin in for about a foot, leaving about a foot out of the ground.

 

 

edit. cross posted with innisfree

Edited February 12, 2014 by luctor et emergo

[Black Ibis]

We were once moored opposite some boats and shortly after a boat owner went to work his boat would pull one of its pins out and come bumping into us. After a three hundred walk round to the other side I saw that his remaining pin was about 15" in length, knocked in about 6" and tied off at the top! This happened a couple of times until I managed to meet him and explain, his reaction was to throw his hands up in despair saying he just didn't know what else he could do. When I explained that knocking pins all the way in would improve things it was a revelation to him, as if it was some amazing discovery! His small ball pein hammer didn't help matters either so after I showed him our large two handed lump hammer he went and bought a half decent one and some bigger pins.

 

Some folk do seem to bumble along.

sounds like a significant number of moorers round our way! "oh, you mean my submerged 15" pins aren't good enough on a river?" they seem genuinely surprised...

Edited February 12, 2014 by Black Ibis

[GUMPY]

Taut lines no go if river level rises 2ft in as many hours like it did at the weekend! Need to be secure on loose lines.

Taut lines can be done if you use long springs from the front to the rear pin and vice versa, then just add a couple of loose breast lines to stop the boat moving out. Its how to moor when there is a tide!

Can't elborate as I'm on my phone.

[dor]

When I had to moor permanently on pins, I made a pair out of some scrap 3"x3" angle iron, cut to a point at one end and about 3ft long. A ring was put through a hole at the top. Knocked in with a sledge hammer so only the ring was above the ground. Didn't move for years.

[Robbo]

When I had to moor permanently on pins, I made a pair out of some scrap 3"x3" angle iron, cut to a point at one end and about 3ft long. A ring was put through a hole at the top. Knocked in with a sledge hammer so only the ring was above the ground. Didn't move for years.

 

My mooring pins are similar with a loose ring at the top and a triangle shaped pin, but around 2ft long. Got them from Tradline but can't see them on the website now.

 

Edit to add, here they are.. http://www.tradline.co/upload/2011%20CATALOGUE%20AND%20PRICE%20LIST.pdf - Dutch Mooring Stake on page 8

Edited February 12, 2014 by Robbo

[Tuscan]

When I had to moor permanently on pins, I made a pair out of some scrap 3"x3" angle iron, cut to a point at one end and about 3ft long. A ring was put through a hole at the top. Knocked in with a sledge hammer so only the ring was above the ground. Didn't move for years.

Yes I had metre length pins with ring 1" square made by the boat blacksmith, I find these with springs keeps me attached, although in this weather I would still be worried.

 

Mak

[MtB]

As Bigste says any 'ground fixing' is only as good as the ground its in - at the moment the ground around us has the consistency of a 'stiff jelly', you need to get down 3 or 4 feet to get into proper 'ground'.

 

I dont think a Rond would hold at the moment.

 

The big advantage of rond anchors is they don't pull out and totally let go like a mooring stake. If pulled too hard they drag through the ground but generally stay in, which is why I like them.

 

I bought a pair of massive rond anchors from the smithy at Stoke Bruerne (for about £40 IIRC)

 

 

MtB

[koukouvagia]

A good pin is 1000mm of 20 mm steel bar, with a point forged on one end. Belt it into the ground until there is 100mm protruding. Put another one 300 mm away on the line of pull from the boat and tie the two together from the top of the first pin to ground level on the second. Then secure the boat to the first pin as close to the ground as possible.

 

 

That's a really good idea. Why had I never thought of doing it like that before?

[MtB]

That's a really good idea. Why had I never thought of doing it like that before?

 

I saw a boat moored with pairs of ordinary 24" mooring stakes in this manner a few years ago, and thought exactly the same!

 

MtB

[David Mack]

What is the existing bank edge? Does it have a concrete wall/coping? If so it is surely best to knock the pins/stakes/angle iron or whatever, in right behind the concrete edge, so that this takes the load. If you put them into soft soil then its much more likely they will pull out.

[Alastair]

the other technique is to use 4 pins, in pairs.

 

Hammer one pin 2/3ds of it's length, but at an angle. Then hammer the next one in, crossing the first so they make an X with the crossing point at ground level. Tie mooring rope around the crossing point.

 

You've now doubled the 'security' of the pins plus don't need eyes over the pins to tie to. When it comes to removing the pins, enough pin is sticking out to get a grip on it.

 

If you are using round pins, a 'stilson' wrench can be useful. This will grip on a round pin and give you lots of leverage to turn the pin, breaking the grip in the ground.

[Robbo]

the other technique is to use 4 pins, in pairs.

 

Hammer one pin 2/3ds of it's length, but at an angle. Then hammer the next one in, crossing the first so they make an X with the crossing point at ground level. Tie mooring rope around the crossing point.

 

 

It's better to do hammer the pins in all the way, but the eyes been at the "crossing point". No point having half the pin in fresh air where it's doing nothing.

[bizzard]

A gardening spade stamped right down is often better than stakes in soggy ground, the wide blade ''obviously facing the boat and not an edge '' presents a wide area for the rope to pull on. For a bit of extra security bang a stake in a couple of yards behind the spade and tie a rope from it to the spades handle, this should keep the spade standing up nice and erect. In summer firm and dry conditions gardening forks also make quite good mooring stakes, easy to stamp in and pull out.

[Swallowman]

Had to tie up Swallow several years ago while on the hoof in the middle of a first class hoolie. Used the anchor down in a concrete gully and then pulled as tight as I could on the rope on the dolly to keep her close to the bank and then a couple of springs on pins to keep her still. The pins did loosen a bit in the very soft ground but we didn't move much. No-one tripped on the anchor chain either because there was no-one about!!!!

[thorne lass]

We use old worn out Acrow props, available for a song from plant hire companies. One half a prop can be driven in quite easily into a soft bank by up to about 2 metres length with a good sledge hammer. The square "foot" is ideal for hammering on. We stop just before that reaches the ground, then drape a loop of chain around the pole just below the foot, and then drive the pole right down into the ground out of sight.

 

The advantage of this are:

 

1. Very strong even in soft ground because you are goIng deep.

 

2. Using a loop of chain means that you can drive the pole in deep so that it disappears and is not a trip hazard and is invisible.

 

3. The chain may (subject to the level of bank v. boat) bury itself in the ground so be invisible also and not a trip hazard.

 

4. This last point may mean that you can drive your poles further from the water, perhaps even the other side of the path, subject to levels (i.e. if the bank is higher than the boat's deck), since the chains will bury themselves (or can be buried).

 

5. Obviously you tie up to the chains (perhaps using shackles). If you leave a generous length of chain in the air and it is heavy chain then its weight will act as a snubber and reduce the snatching forces exerted by the boat.

 

6. Chain is more difficult for vandals to cut.

 

7. It's cheap!

 

By the way, somebody mentioned only two spikes. That is a most unboatmanlike way to secure a boat permanently. Correct angling of the ropes is another lesson that many could learn. I see many boats tied just to breast ropes (i.e. short ropes perpendicular between the boat and bank). These will not stop the boat surging and snatching. The correct way is with head and stern lines running forward and aft of the boat respectively, and head and stern springs running aft and forward respectively, all running at say 45 degrees to the boat or more. These will much reduce surge effects from wind, stream or passing boats. The extra scope of the lines permits greater up and down movement as water levels change, and you have four strings to your bow(t) as opposed to only two.

 

 

[Bod]

I think you have the answer yourselves, 5' scaffold poles, they hold for you, would they work further up/down your moorings?

Fixed as per Bengos idea.

Cheap, quick, readly avaliable.

 

Bod

[madcat]

Looks like another item to go on my look out for list. I have a couple of huge pins made of really hefty reinforcing rod, they were made for a mooring I had with no rings.

I'm always happy to adopt bits of useful metal.

[Tacet]

We use 30" marquee pins, never had a problem yet.

That's a very small marquee.

[watershed]

on the broads,the hire boats are supplied with mooring hooks rather than straight pins.they're bent at slightly more than 90° with a ring at one end.the hook end is pushed right in and mooring line tied to eye at ground level.believe this changes the centre of effort or some such.whatever,they seem to work,even on the tidal stretches

[ditchcrawler]

Another problem with the 'mooring pins' as sold by swindlers chandlers, is that eye at the top. Most boaters tie their line to that, or run the line through it, and back to the boat. Fine if you sledge your pin right in, but most boaters only knock their pin in for about a foot, leaving about a foot out of the ground.

 

 

edit. cross posted with innisfree

The last "Pins" I bought the rings are about 4" from the top, I think I will chop and refix them

The maximum force you could put on your new mooring pins is the breaking strain of your moorings lines

[MtB]

on the broads,the hire boats are supplied with mooring hooks rather than straight pins.they're bent at slightly more than 90° with a ring at one end.the hook end is pushed right in and mooring line tied to eye at ground level.believe this changes the centre of effort or some such.whatever,they seem to work,even on the tidal stretches

 

Those are the 'rond anchors' discussed earlier in this thread!

 

MtB

[JDR]

Without knowing the ground next to your mooring if the council are willing to spend money on ground anchors then digging some holes and cementing in some permanent rings would be a more sensible option long term.

 

Hole digging spade if the ground is soft enough, If the ground is too soft for pins it would suggest this is an option.

 

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p16835?utm_source=feed&utm_medium=googleshopping&utm_campaign=googleshopping&mkwid=nBqw4neb&pcrid=26798419223&gclid=CPPW5OCjx7wCFfLHtAodW3EAVA

 

Mooring rings can be purchased for the same price as the ground anchor listed, Or as suggested above acrow props/scaffold pole.

 

http://www.talamexleisure.com/partnumber.asp?pnid=406116&source=googlebase&utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=cpc&gclid=CNqIxpylx7wCFQPmwgodJjMA2A

 

rough concrete mix in a wheelbarrow backfilled with stone, leave it a day to go off.

Edited February 12, 2014 by JDR

[BenC]

Why not dig a hole fill with concrete, leave 6inches, back fill with soil, then screw in the new twisty anchor that has been offered to you. The council will never know.

Out of interest what will happen to the new pins when people give up their moorings, beg most take them with them, what happens to new moorers? It does seem shortsighted of the council not to just fit hoops every 25ft or so.

[CV32]

We have spyrabase too - very good as long as the ground is not dry and full of stones (unlikely in your present situation).