Regulars on London Temporary moorings.

[MtB]

No. So the insult there has gone right over my head.

 

I bet that nice Mr Athy would be delighted to explain, were he reading!

[ditchcrawler]

I lost the plot on the last glass of red wine

[Mutts]

I think you are not aware of the chambermaids and head housekeepers status, Head/commis chefs and other valuable members of the hotel industry that keeps the Capital filled with international visitors year after year. Some of these are highly prized and awarded at conferences.

One issue our country has is not recognising Waiters/waitresses, and others as a skilled profession, all the continental restaurants do.

It is people like you who complain about service from kids serving meals and not being able to deal with queries/complaints.

Spot on Matty

That's what you get from dining in Ronald McBurger Wimpeys King

[Jerra]

If I remember rightly, a professional technically is someone who has to qualify and belong to a "professional body" to be classed as such. It's a hangover from the old guilds - got nothing to do with raising standards, just a way of keeping the plebs out. I believe playing golf helps...

According to my dictionary a profession is:

 

a paid occupation, especially one that involves prolonged training and a formal qualification.

 

No mention of professional bodies.

 

So I would say there are many professions in the hospitality industry.

[FadeToScarlet]

I lost the plot on the last glass of red wine

There was a plot?

[carlt]

There was a plot?

There was wine?

[KevMc]

 

There are 20 hospitals in Central London.

 

It cost £440 million to build The University Hospital Coventry.

 

Where does the money come from?

 

Another bl**dy good point.....

 

... so the London hospitals have a budget for maintenance and rebuilding old wards etc. How about taking the portion of that which is used to shut down wards and completely refurbish them from each hospital in London and use that to build new facilities in existing regional hospitals outside the centre where there are existing good transport links (from personal knowledge I know of Northwick Park - served by the Met, Bakerloo and Overground lines; and Watford currently near the Overground and soon to be served the Met Line) ... as the old inner city hospitals wind down they could be redeveloped as low cost housing.

[carlt]

 

Another bl**dy good point.....

 

How about taking the portion of that which is used to shut down wards and completely refurbish them from each hospital in London and use that to build new facilities in existing regional hospitals....

 

I don't know about London but the trend elsewhere seems to be to shut down wards, not refurbish them and not reopen them...Unless of course there is a tasty PFI contract to further line rich folks' pockets.

[Athy]

 

Pointless insult of the day...

...though a quite amusing one.

I would suggest that yours is a profession as well as a trade though. The two are not mutually exclusive, are they? These days I'd call myself a professional record dealer - I have years of experience in dealing with wee vinyl diskies, and I hope a modicum of expertise. But I also trade in them.

[KevMc]

 

I don't know about London but the trend elsewhere seems to be to shut down wards, not refurbish them and not reopen them...Unless of course there is a tasty PFI contract to further line rich folks' pockets.

 

Pretty much every hospital I've been to over the last 5-10 years (see below) seems to have an ongoing improvement process underway... as to whether its benefitting the staff & patients or some PFI investor I couldn't say but there certainly seems to be a lot of cash being spent

 

Royal Free Hampstead

Royal London

Northwick Park

Mount Vernon

Watford General

West Herts Hemel

Stoke Mandeville

St Albans

Spire Bushey (private)

Spire Harpenden (private)

[mayalld]

 

I don't know about London but the trend elsewhere seems to be to shut down wards, not refurbish them and not reopen them...Unless of course there is a tasty PFI contract to further line rich folks' pockets.

 

You made a valid point, in that the hospitals already exist in central London, and that there is a question as to the cost benefit of pulling down an existing hospital, and spending Millions on building new, just to save on the higher cost of staffing.

 

There are two answers to that;

 

1) as existing buildings in Central London become life expired and require renewal, they should be replaced with buildings outside the centre of London.

2) some of the central London Hospitals are sitting on some SERIOUSLY valuable land. In several cases, you could build a completely new hospital outside the capital on the proceeds of disposing of the buildings and land in central London.

[Wanted]

Which profession would this be?

Up until recently when I became the primary carer for our son, I specialised in the design and development of homeless, child care and fostering services for local authorities. I worked for a charity but my salary was fundraised and paid for by local authority commissioning consortia, of which in London there are many. This is because it consists of 33 boroughs all nudged up against each other. Occasionally I would do work outside of London, but because of the greography, the commissioning authorities couldn't really muster a cohesive consortia beyond framework tendering. So, in order for me to use my qualifications, feed my family and add benefit to the people I wish to help, I needed to be in London.

 

I'm now living in Bristol, where my only concern is the fact that my two year old had play doh stuck in his ear.

Sorry, 32!

[David Mack]

 

2) some of the central London Hospitals are sitting on some SERIOUSLY valuable land. In several cases, you could build a completely new hospital outside the capital on the proceeds of disposing of the buildings and land in central London.

 

Except I recall that one such site had been sold by its wealthy landowner to be used as a hospital on the basis that if it ever ceased to be a hospital the land would be sold back to the original owner (or his descendants) at the same price. So when the site and buildings became unsuitable for modern NHS use, the Duke of wherever regained some prime Central London property for a knockdown price, and the NHS got next to nothing.

[mayalld]

 

Except I recall that one such site had been sold by its wealthy landowner to be used as a hospital on the basis that if it ever ceased to be a hospital the land would be sold back to the original owner (or his descendants) at the same price. So when the site and buildings became unsuitable for modern NHS use, the Duke of wherever regained some prime Central London property for a knockdown price, and the NHS got next to nothing.

 

Such covenants can be the source of much pain.

 

I know that locally the council tried to sell off some land that had been gifted by a prominent local family many years back, only to discover that the gift came with a clause that should they ever sell the land the proceeds were to go to the heirs of the original donor.

[Mike Todd]

 

You made a valid point, in that the hospitals already exist in central London, and that there is a question as to the cost benefit of pulling down an existing hospital, and spending Millions on building new, just to save on the higher cost of staffing.

 

There are two answers to that;

 

1) as existing buildings in Central London become life expired and require renewal, they should be replaced with buildings outside the centre of London.

2) some of the central London Hospitals are sitting on some SERIOUSLY valuable land. In several cases, you could build a completely new hospital outside the capital on the proceeds of disposing of the buildings and land in central London.

When I had some minor involvement in the mid to late Seventies, there was established RAWP (Resource Allocation Working Party) that was aimed at re-balancing the allocation of NHS resources to different regions, using more rational criteria. At the time a very disproportionate (well I was representing a ward in Tyneside so I would have put it that way!) amount went to the London area with the Home Counties not too far behind. Others lost out badly.

 

There was much hope in the regions until the London hospitals (with far better political connections) found that they could not justify so many of them being located in London - they were often teaching and specialist that provided support to the whole country so could theoretically be located anywhere with good transport connections. However, the leading lights in such places could not contemplate being transported to the benighted colonies and rebelled.

 

Sounds as if the problem still exists.

[ditchcrawler]

There was wine?

There is always wine

[mark99]

There is always wine

 

Donate it to the poor.

[Chris-B]

Wine.. who is giving wine away ?

[mark99]

Wine.. who is giving wine away ?

 

 

Bryan has let it slip he can afford wine.

[Tim Lewis]

 

Except I recall that one such site had been sold by its wealthy landowner to be used as a hospital on the basis that if it ever ceased to be a hospital the land would be sold back to the original owner (or his descendants) at the same price. So when the site and buildings became unsuitable for modern NHS use, the Duke of wherever regained some prime Central London property for a knockdown price, and the NHS got next to nothing.

 

 

http://www.ezitis.myzen.co.uk/stgeorgehydepark.html

 

Tim

 

You made a valid point, in that the hospitals already exist in central London, and that there is a question as to the cost benefit of pulling down an existing hospital, and spending Millions on building new, just to save on the higher cost of staffing.

 

There are two answers to that;

 

1) as existing buildings in Central London become life expired and require renewal, they should be replaced with buildings outside the centre of London.

2) some of the central London Hospitals are sitting on some SERIOUSLY valuable land. In several cases, you could build a completely new hospital outside the capital on the proceeds of disposing of the buildings and land in central London.

 

Which is what happened to the hospital in the post above- St Georges at Hyde Park Corner. Obviously not that successful as the Government put it into special measures today!

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-37822649

 

Tim

Edited November 1, 2016 by Tim Lewis

[thebfg]

 

Such covenants can be the source of much pain.

 

I know that locally the council tried to sell off some land that had been gifted by a prominent local family many years back, only to discover that the gift came with a clause that should they ever sell the land the proceeds were to go to the heirs of the original donor.

I once built a swimming pool for a lady who lived in a multi million pound house. Next Door was a scruffy bungalow sitting on a better plot of land but there was a covenant on it that said no extension or knock down rebuild etc could happen without the neighbours permission.

 

When the owner died no one would buy it so she brought it herself and gave herself permission.

 

At least I got to build another swimming pool for her.

[MtB]

Dug, surely?!

[mark99]

Dug, surely?!

 

Don't call Shirely, Doug.

[Tim Lewis]

Dug, surely?!

One of the jobs I am working on at the moment has a swimming pool on the 6th floor!

 

Tim

[mayalld]

When I had some minor involvement in the mid to late Seventies, there was established RAWP (Resource Allocation Working Party) that was aimed at re-balancing the allocation of NHS resources to different regions, using more rational criteria. At the time a very disproportionate (well I was representing a ward in Tyneside so I would have put it that way!) amount went to the London area with the Home Counties not too far behind. Others lost out badly.

 

There was much hope in the regions until the London hospitals (with far better political connections) found that they could not justify so many of them being located in London - they were often teaching and specialist that provided support to the whole country so could theoretically be located anywhere with good transport connections. However, the leading lights in such places could not contemplate being transported to the benighted colonies and rebelled.

 

Sounds as if the problem still exists.

 

It does.

 

Hospitals in Central London tie up massive amounts of public money in high value real estate, whilst it costs more to staff them.

 

The other trouble is that even with London Weighting added, the salaries don't support the same lifestyle as somebody could enjoy up north in the same job without London Weighting.

 

That doesn't bode well for attracting the best staff into hospitals in central London.