CRT Keys

[TheBeesKnees]

Hello,

 

this maybe has been asked a few times but we are set to pick up our boat next boat and bring her to our mooring but I noticed on the set of keys there is only the locks for the boat.

 

when I get my CRT license do I get a set of keys or do I need to buy a set my self I have seen them on eBay for only £7 for a set of two but I wanted to ask before I buy a set. 
 

cheers and sorry if this has been asked before 

[Onewheeler]

Unless things have changed you need to buy them. Get a 'handcuff 'key as well.

[TheBeesKnees]

Just now, Onewheeler said:

Unless things have changed you need to buy them. Get a 'handcuff 'key as well.

Okay cheers for the help I will order a set. 

[StephenA]

12 minutes ago, TheBeesKnees said:

Hello,

 

this maybe has been asked a few times but we are set to pick up our boat next boat and bring her to our mooring but I noticed on the set of keys there is only the locks for the boat.

 

when I get my CRT license do I get a set of keys or do I need to buy a set my self I have seen them on eBay for only £7 for a set of two but I wanted to ask before I buy a set. 
 

cheers and sorry if this has been asked before 

 

Avoid the ones on Ebay

[ditchcrawler]

Non genuine ones don't always work 

[TheBiscuits]

30 minutes ago, TheBeesKnees said:

Okay cheers for the help I will order a set. 

 

23 minutes ago, StephenA said:

 

Avoid the ones on Ebay

 

19 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Non genuine ones don't always work 

 

Fully agree.  CRT sell "proper" ones for £5 and £7 each last time I checked.

 

Do not buy the knock-off eBay ones - the aluminium handcuff keys are slightly the wrong size, and the unofficial Watermate Yale keys don't have the correct number of slots, so they usually work on worn, tired lock mechanisms but don't work on brand new ones.

 

We once nearly hung a boat in a lock because MrsBiscuits'  handcuff key wouldn't turn the spindle to let her operate the lock.  That one went in the bin, and was replaced with an official CRT one an hour later.

 

We discovered the issue with eBay Yale keys when they replaced a tired lock on the Elsan point at one of the services.  That key would open the toilet and the shower but not the Elsan, which was the only thing we actually needed to use.

 

That's gone in the emergency spare drawer, on the thinking there's a 50:50 chance it will work if we both lose our official ones.

 

Don't mess about for £12 a set, and get one per person and a spare set of both.

 

 

Edited July 16, 2024 by TheBiscuits
Stupid mobile phone

[TheBeesKnees]

25 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

 

Fully agree.  CRT sell "proper" ones for £5 and £7 each last time I checked.

 

Do not buy the knock-off eBay ones - the aluminium handcuff keys are slightly the wrong size, and the unofficial Watermate Yale keys don't have the correct number of slots, so they usually work on worn, tired lock mechanisms but don't work on brand new ones.

 

We once nearly hung a boat in a lock because MrsBiscuits'  handcuff key wouldn't turn the spindle to let her operate the lock.  That one went in the bin, and was replaced with an official CRT one an hour later.

 

We discovered the issue with eBay Yale keys when they replaced a tired lock on the Elsan point at one of the services.  That key would open the toilet and the shower but not the Elsan, which was the only thing we actually needed to use.

 

That's gone in the emergency spare drawer, on the thinking there's a 50:50 chance it will work if we both lose our official ones.

 

Don't mess about for £12 a set, and get one per person and a spare set of both.

 

 

Okay thank you for the help I will avoid eBay can I buy there keys on there website or is it from there shops they have posted around the network. 

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, TheBeesKnees said:

Okay thank you for the help I will avoid eBay can I buy there keys on there website or is it from there shops they have posted around the network. 

 

Either or.  They do sell the keys online, or you can usually buy them direct from a regional office.  I've done both in the past, but they closed the Wigan office (my local one) a few years ago.

 

If you say roughly where you are, someone will know where your nearest office is, or the online shop is available via the online licencing portal.

 

https://licensing.canalrivertrust.org.uk/BoatingShop/AddItem

 

£7.28 and £5.20 currently - there's inflation for you since last time I bought some!

 

😁

 

 

 

 

[Stroudwater1]

It’s very possible the previous owners have left them elsewhere on the boat. That’s what happened with us, two nice handcuff keys and three crt keys left on the boat (amongst other things) there are some really nice people around still. 
 

If not then it’s worth an ask, as they will have been on the boat probably until sold. 
 

If it’s a new boat rarely they may throw them in as a freeby if you ask nicely. 

[TheBiscuits]

2 minutes ago, Stroudwater1 said:

If it’s a new boat rarely they may throw them in as a freeby if you ask nicely. 

 

You'd rather hope they'd throw in £12 of keys on a quarter of a million quid boat!

[ditchcrawler]

21 minutes ago, TheBeesKnees said:

Okay thank you for the help I will avoid eBay can I buy there keys on there website or is it from there shops they have posted around the network. 

The silly thing is you cant visit the CRT online shop for such tings unless you have an account, so until you have bought a boat licence you cant buy a key 

[Tim Lewis]

1 hour ago, StephenA said:

 

Avoid the ones on Ebay

 

Have only ever bought on Ebay and never had a problem

 

[MtB]

1 hour ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Either or.  They do sell the keys online, or you can usually buy them direct from a regional office.  I've done both in the past, but they closed the Wigan office (my local one) a few years ago.

 

If you say roughly where you are, someone will know where your nearest office is, or the online shop is available via the online licencing portal.

 

https://licensing.canalrivertrust.org.uk/BoatingShop/AddItem

 

£7.28 and £5.20 currently - there's inflation for you since last time I bought some!

 

😁

 

I bought a couple of genuine keys from the CRT office at Bratch Locks a few years ago. 

 

IIRC the ebay forgeries are cut to the right shape but on a blank of a slightly different grove profile. So may or may not fit into any given CRT lock. 

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

1 minute ago, MtB said:

IIRC the ebay forgeries are cut to the right shape but on a blank of a slightly different grove profile. So may or may not fit into any given CRT lock.

 

Yes, exactly this.  In my experience it's only brand new lock mechanisms that they don't work in, although I seem to recall a CRT bod telling me that 8 in 10 of the call outs to the "broken" guillotine lock at Todmorden were "fixed" by removing the clone key from the control box and inserting a real one!

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

You also don’t get a license, in regards to a paper copy through the post, unless you specifically ask for one, you’ll get an electronic copy you can print off.

 Ask at the Marina your buying the boat from, they should have genuine CaRT keys for sale and handcuff keys.

 

[cheesegas]

Just to echo the other posts here, avoid the non genuine ones on ebay and also don't have Timpsons make a copy. Neither work reliably, some locks need a jiggle, some don't turn at all, some are fine in my experience.

[springy]

AIUI "genuine" keys have an extra groove/ridge (ward ?) on each side compared with standard "yale" keys and are theoretically "authorised duplication only", the non genuine keys only have a ridge down the back of the key with the remainder of the blade machined flat thus  "bypassing" the additional wards in the barrel. This results in a key which is both physically weaker and likely to have less accurate alignment in the barrel.

 

springy 

[Hudds Lad]

Here's a pic i posted with a direct comparison a couple of years back...

 

 

Link to thread it was from...

 

[BilgePump]

2 hours ago, springy said:

AIUI "genuine" keys have an extra groove/ridge (ward ?) on each side compared with standard "yale" keys and are theoretically "authorised duplication only", the non genuine keys only have a ridge down the back of the key with the remainder of the blade machined flat thus  "bypassing" the additional wards in the barrel. This results in a key which is both physically weaker and likely to have less accurate alignment in the barrel.

 

springy 

Just looked at my 30? year old BWB key and it has more grooves than regular Yale door key, just like 4th pic in @Hudds Lad post above

[TheBiscuits]

49 minutes ago, BilgePump said:

Just looked at my 30? year old BWB key and it has more grooves than regular Yale door key, just like 4th pic in @Hudds Lad post above

 

And the second pic ...

 

... which is the other side of the same key!

[StevieN]

Is it only me that thinks that CRT should only issue keys to registered license holders and not sell them to every Tom, Dick, or Harry?

If facilities are "Boaters Facilities" how the frick is it that cyclists, fishing people and anyone else seems to use the same facilities just because CRT have sold them a key? 

License holders pay for the facilities, not Charlie Farnsbarns who cycles down the towpath in his lycra with the rest of the pelaton.

That's the same facilities that CRT claim CC'ers use more than anyone else hence why they've increased the license...if that's the case then only issue keys to genuine license holders.

[Yellowback]

5 hours ago, StevieN said:

Is it only me that thinks that CRT should only issue keys to registered license holders and not sell them to every Tom, Dick, or Harry?

 

Ebay ??

[Big Bob W]

17 hours ago, StevieN said:

Is it only me that thinks that CRT should only issue keys to registered license holders and not sell them to every Tom, Dick, or Harry?

If facilities are "Boaters Facilities" how the frick is it that cyclists, fishing people and anyone else seems to use the same facilities just because CRT have sold them a key? 

License holders pay for the facilities, not Charlie Farnsbarns who cycles down the towpath in his lycra with the rest of the pelaton.

That's the same facilities that CRT claim CC'ers use more than anyone else hence why they've increased the license...if that's the case then only issue keys to genuine license holders.

I am sure when we bought our Abloy key from Northampton Marina to access the services on the Nene, they would only issue it if we could show our EA license.

[MtB]

On 23/07/2024 at 00:40, StevieN said:

That's the same facilities that CRT claim CC'ers use more than anyone else hence why they've increased the license...if that's the case then only issue keys to genuine license holders.

 

No, they've increased the licence because CRT are running out of money.

 

CCers are getting a bigger rise because its patently unfair that CCers until now paid the same licence as home moorers, despite mooring somewhere on the water every night just like the home moorers who have to pay a substantial additional charge for that privilege. 

 

 

 

 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

On 23/07/2024 at 00:40, StevieN said:

Is it only me that thinks that CRT should only issue keys to registered license holders and not sell them to every Tom, Dick, or Harry?

If facilities are "Boaters Facilities" how the frick is it that cyclists, fishing people and anyone else seems to use the same facilities just because CRT have sold them a key? 

License holders pay for the facilities, not Charlie Farnsbarns who cycles down the towpath in his lycra with the rest of the pelaton.

That's the same facilities that CRT claim CC'ers use more than anyone else hence why they've increased the license...if that's the case then only issue keys to genuine license holders.

Facilities which are slowly being got rid of.

On a recent visit to Sutton Cheney, Ashby Canal, I found the rubbish skip had been removed and the 2 showers removed.

The toilets, I think, no longer have CRT locks on them but seem to be permanently open,

I guess, and am only guessing, the cafe has become responsible for them, I dunno,

Free to use for all, including the van dwellers which now proliferate the Ashby.

So yep, I pay a surcharge for using the non existent facilities more than others,

and the facilities which remain are free to all,

well done CRT 👍