Energy Bills Support Scheme Alternative Funding

[haggis]

But although the mooring provider you started with will be able to say you no longer moor there, he will have no idea if you moor elsewhere or not. Ok, C&RT,have seen you in a few places but that doesn't mean you don't have a mooring somewhere. 

[Paul C]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

Fraudulent it is not.

I am aware of the rules, I just never bothered updating for some reason.

I don't need rapped on the knuckles, thank you.

 

If you were aware of the rules, you would have been aware that its a requirement to update CRT if your mooring changes, or you no longer have the mooring (so they can record you as a CCer). Was the reason you didn't update them, that having a "ghost mooring" was incredibly convenient because of your (lack of) movement pattern? Or were you confused - so confused you were unable to even contact them to ask for help? Or ask on an internet forum, perhaps?

 

I'd keep quiet - that £600 you lost out has "bought" you the non-movement-for-free card.

[TheBiscuits]

3 hours ago, MtB said:

I suspect not. Is the scheme not 'per household'? 

 

I got the payout at my hovel via the leccy account so that's my household paid out. Whatever mooring or CC status my boats have becomes irrelevant. Unless you reckon each of my boats ought to qualify as a separate household! 

 

Depends how you look at it.  Didn't all second/holiday homes which had an electricity supply contract get the money on the original scheme from last October?

 

I think it was deemed cheaper to hand over the £400 than to set up a system to check who got what.

 

Boats may legally be lived on on the canals if they have either a full residential mooring or if they are declared as CCers/ no home mooring.

 

After a year of scratching their heads, this is what the government have come up with.  It sounds harsh, but those who live "under the radar" on leisure moorings are not currently recognised as a group by officialdom.

 

If they become recognised they may get thrown off the mooring and/or have to pay backdated Band A council tax ...

[MtB]

5 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Depends how you look at it.  Didn't all second/holiday homes which had an electricity supply contract get the money on the original scheme from last October?

 

I think it was deemed cheaper to hand over the £400 than to set up a system to check who got what.

 

Boats may legally be lived on on the canals if they have either a full residential mooring or if they are declared as CCers/ no home mooring.

 

After a year of scratching their heads, this is what the government have come up with.  It sounds harsh, but those who live "under the radar" on leisure moorings are not currently recognised as a group by officialdom.

 

If they become recognised they may get thrown off the mooring and/or have to pay backdated Band A council tax ...

 

Or even Band B, given the size of some widebeams nowadays. Especially if they've colonised the bank.

 

 

 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

51 minutes ago, Paul C said:

 

If you were aware of the rules, you would have been aware that its a requirement to update CRT if your mooring changes, or you no longer have the mooring (so they can record you as a CCer). Was the reason you didn't update them, that having a "ghost mooring" was incredibly convenient because of your (lack of) movement pattern? Or were you confused - so confused you were unable to even contact them to ask for help? Or ask on an internet forum, perhaps?

 

I'd keep quiet - that £600 you lost out has "bought" you the non-movement-for-free card.

On the gubbins they send out to tell you licence costs and expiry date, it requires you to update your insurance details if necessary, make any changes to the details shown about you or the licence you require and thirdly, "if your mooring has changed, please supply us with the new location".

They can't really make it any clearer, and if someone knows the information held is wrong and does nothing about it, they can't really complain if they lose out or get penalised.

Same applies if a home moorer doesn't advise CRT of a move - they may get done for overstaying as that's how it will appear to CRT.

If LadyG wasn't on the records as a CC during the relevant dates, she won't qualify. She can't prove she didn't have a home mooring, as you can't prove a negative - having proof of being somewhere else is irrelevant.

Interestingly , in the document it uses the word "eligible" for those entitled to it. How they finally define eligibility will be interesting - expect cries of anguish if it requires acceptable cruising movement according to their records...

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

10 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

How they finally define eligibility will be interesting - expect cries of anguish if it requires acceptable cruising movement according to their records...

not CART giving out the money though,

simply CART helping facilitate the handing out of a long overdue support for energy bills,

I’d guess CART would want as little

involvement as possible. 

computer says yes or computer says no,

CART won’t look in to each case before hand,

 I’d say they probably ain’t looking forward to this at all. Imagine the inevitable complaints and moaning to come their way from those who don’t get their voucher but reckon they should

 

Edited August 17, 2023 by Goliath

[TheBiscuits]

27 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Imagine the inevitable complaints and moaning to come their way from those who don’t get their voucher but reckon they should

 

I'm predicting an increase of at least £600 on CCer's licences - CRT said they'd let us know by "summer" and it's nearly September now ...

 

 

39 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

How they finally define eligibility will be interesting - expect cries of anguish if it requires acceptable cruising movement according to their records...

 

I'm waiting for the cries of "not fair" from those who didn't have a licence at all between February and May!

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

1 hour ago, Goliath said:

not CART giving out the money though,

simply CART helping facilitate the handing out of a long overdue support for energy bills,

I’d guess CART would want as little

involvement as possible. 

computer says yes or computer says no,

CART won’t look in to each case before hand,

 I’d say they probably ain’t looking forward to this at all. Imagine the inevitable complaints and moaning to come their way from those who don’t get their voucher but reckon they should

 

 I’m thinking the same, as it’s not CaRT money do they want the hassle of proving who does and doesn’t qualify? 
 Will they just rubber stamp “qualified” to all those that have not declared a Home mooring up-to 31st May and it’ll be up to the Government to identify if they have received the payment previously for a claim?
 As @LadyG has suddenly just changed her mooring status, I doubt she’ll be identified as a CCer for the qualifying period. She’s probably identified on the CaRT system as a Continuous Moorer if anything😂

Edited August 17, 2023 by BoatinglifeupNorth

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

 I’m thinking the same, as it’s not CaRT money do they want the hassle of proving who does and doesn’t qualify? 
 Will they just rubber stamp “qualified” to all those that have not declared a Home mooring up-to 31st May and will it be up to the Government to identify if they have received the payment previously for a claim?
 As @LadyG has suddenly just changed her mooring status, I doubt she’ll be identified as a CCer for the qualifying period. She’s probably identified on the CaRT system as a Continuous Moorer if anything😂

 

But now she has self identified as a CCer she will probably qualify for the nex 3X premium CC licence.

[Momac]

4 hours ago, LadyG said:

 

Has there always been a cc licence. I was absolutely sure that there was no such thing.

 

That's correct - no such thing.

But you declare a home mooring of CC as you know.

 

Agreed - no such thing.

Good luck with your claim .

 

PS I think you should receive the grant as from the evidence of your posts you are obviously a genuine CC'er liveaboard . 

We know that but I am not sure C&RT will reach the same conclusion as they may simply  look at their records between the dates mentioned earlier.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

5 hours ago, LadyG said:

Has there always been a cc licence. I was absolutely sure that there was no such thing.

 

 

C&RT have kindly provided guidance for you on your licence which you will have seen when reading, &, when you agreed to accept their T&Cs

 

Types of Licences The following types of licence can be applied for.

 

These Conditions (including any Schedules) below apply to these options:

 

• A Pleasure Boat Licence (“standard boat licence”) for either 3, 6 or 12 months is required to navigate on Our Canals & Rivers. You will need a home mooring for Your boat for this licence type.

 

• A Rivers Only Licence is valid for ‘River Waterways’. These are defined in Schedule 1 of the British Waterways Act 1971, as amended. A Rivers Only Licence constitutes a “pleasure boat certificate” for the purposes of the Act.

 

• A Continuous Cruising licence does not need Your boat to have a home mooring. This licence is either for 6 or 12 months and You’ll have to follow Our ‘Guidance for Boaters Without a Home Mooring’.

 

• A Gold Licence, allows You to travel on Our Waterways and Environment Agency (EA) navigations in England & Wales. It is available for 12 months only, beginning on 1st January.

 

• Short Term licences for periods of 1 month or less are for boats visiting Our Waterways for short periods. They are not available to Continuous Cruisers, boats floating in marinas or on moorings connected to Trust Waterways. Further details about short term licences, can be found at https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/enjoy-the-waterways/boating/buy-your-boat-licence/short-termvisitor-licences

 

• Houseboat Certificates are only issued for boats where the Houseboat Certificate and the mooring agreement run at the same time and have the same expiry date. Houseboat means a boat not mainly used for navigation and which has planning permission for the site where it is moored, if needed

 

 

 

 

[Momac]

27 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

C&RT have kindly provided guidance for you on your licence which you will have seen when reading, &, when you agreed to accept their T&Cs

 

 

 

 

So they have (My mistake ).

I see they also clarify that a rivers only license is not a license. 

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

2 hours ago, MartynG said:

That's correct - no such thing.

But you declare a home mooring of CC as you know.

 

Agreed - no such thing.

Good luck with your claim .

 

PS I think you should receive the grant as from the evidence of your posts you are obviously a genuine CC'er liveaboard . 

We know that but I am not sure C&RT will reach the same conclusion as they may simply  look at their records between the dates mentioned earlier.

 

 

 

 

 

 

But will it boil down to the self declaration on the yearly licence renewal?  From what @LadyG writes on here it can be taken in various ways, a CCer that doesn’t move great distances over a giving period and has stayed for long periods in a small area due to breakdowns and not moving due to stoppages on the route she wanted to go. CaRT will have her movements recorded to make their decision, but to suddenly declare as a CCer when the Govt changes policy may not of been the best thing to do, maybe declaring  when starting CCing would of been better?

Edited August 17, 2023 by BoatinglifeupNorth

[Arthur Marshall]

7 minutes ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

But will it boil down to the self declaration on the yearly licence renewal?  From what @LadyG writes on here it can be taken in various ways, a CCer that doesn’t move great distances over a giving period and has stayed for long periods in a small area due to breakdowns and not moving due to stoppages on the route she wanted to go. CaRT will have her movements recorded to make their decision, but to suddenly declare as a CCer when the Govt changes policy may not of been the best thing to do, maybe declaring  when starting CCing would of been better?

CRT don't usually see a problem with legitimate breakdowns, and they certainly can't complain about people being stuck between stoppages. But it's always better to correct an issue as soon as you become aware of it, and that's often only when it suddenly becomes important.

After all, they've only just got stroppy with someone blatantly and deliberately cheating for about twelve years. An unintentional error shouldn't be a problem, though it will almost certainly rule her out of the scheme.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

£600,

now what shall I spend it on?

 

beer?

coal?

beer and coal?

beer beer and coal?

beer beer beer and coal?

........?

sausages!

[dmr]

7 minutes ago, Goliath said:

£600,

now what shall I spend it on?

 

beer?

coal?

beer and coal?

beer beer and coal?

beer beer beer and coal?

........?

sausages!

After almost 14 years of CCing we now have a home mooring, even though we will mostly be out cruising, so we miss out on this £600, so you should spend some of yours on beer for me 😀

Did I read that its in the form of vouchers rather than real money? hope its beer vouchers.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

20 minutes ago, dmr said:

After almost 14 years of CCing we now have a home mooring, even though we will mostly be out cruising, so we miss out on this £600, so you should spend some of yours on beer for me 😀

Did I read that its in the form of vouchers rather than real money? hope its beer vouchers.

I believe one swaps the voucher for hard cash,

 

or perhaps one can opt to buy shares in CART?

 

I’ll buy beer

 

 

or cider

 

or both

Edited August 17, 2023 by Goliath

[ditchcrawler]

14 minutes ago, Goliath said:

I believe one swaps the voucher for hard cash,

 

or perhaps one can opt to buy shares in CART?

 

I’ll buy beer

I wonder what the exchange rate will be.

 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Or there’s this 

https://www.thewhiskyexchange.com/p/43507/elit-vodka-by-stoli-imperial?source=&utm_source=shopwindow&utm_source=redbrain&utm_medium=link&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=affiliatewindow&utm_campaign=css&awaid=400&gclid=CjwKCAjwivemBhBhEiwAJxNWN7_qKgTFGwzzfP8YEXAeQI0vHy_AZ15HLMpzdCMty1XBCXfe0Dm2tRoCkzQQAvD_BwE

 

[ditchcrawler]

19 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Or there’s this 

https://www.thewhiskyexchange.com/p/43507/elit-vodka-by-stoli-imperial?source=&utm_source=shopwindow&utm_source=redbrain&utm_medium=link&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=affiliatewindow&utm_campaign=css&awaid=400&gclid=CjwKCAjwivemBhBhEiwAJxNWN7_qKgTFGwzzfP8YEXAeQI0vHy_AZ15HLMpzdCMty1XBCXfe0Dm2tRoCkzQQAvD_BwE

 

I was thinking of these, but probably a card today  Taxi Tokens - Wendover News

[TheBiscuits]

56 minutes ago, Goliath said:

beer beer beer and coal?

 

Three beers and a sack of coal for 600 quid sounds like London prices to me ...

[Alan de Enfield]

 

Just use the windfall to contribute to the additional CC licence cost (shortly to be announced)

[Steilsteven]

I shall be spending it on my Winter fuel, other bills will have to take their chances.

 

Keith

[Arthur Marshall]

The truly interesting thing about this is that CRT is de facto saying that the only people entitled to claim to be Continuous Cruisers are those living on the boat. This may cause a problem for the dumpers who will automatically, it seems, get it twice. I doubt this will be treated as fraud as it mirrors the way second home owners got it twice, too, but it might indicate CRTs future legal view.

[Paul C]

1 hour ago, Arthur Marshall said:

The truly interesting thing about this is that CRT is de facto saying that the only people entitled to claim to be Continuous Cruisers are those living on the boat. This may cause a problem for the dumpers who will automatically, it seems, get it twice. I doubt this will be treated as fraud as it mirrors the way second home owners got it twice, too, but it might indicate CRTs future legal view.

There is also a check that they haven't received anything before.