noddyboater Posted November 25, 2022 Report Posted November 25, 2022 A 4 cylinder Dorman with box had been taken out of a boat and slung in the scrap skip. It was in running condition apparently. It's down at the boatyard at hillmorton, next to the Oak pub.
frangar Posted November 25, 2022 Report Posted November 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, noddyboater said: A 4 cylinder Dorman with box had been taken out of a boat and slung in the scrap skip. It was in running condition apparently. It's down at the boatyard at hillmorton, next to the Oak pub. That seems daft!! But there again people are. It surely would have fetched more than scrap value
noddyboater Posted November 25, 2022 Author Report Posted November 25, 2022 Something modern replaced it I heard, they didn't want to bother trying to sell it. A good source of parts for someone with a twin I'd guess.
frangar Posted November 25, 2022 Report Posted November 25, 2022 3 minutes ago, noddyboater said: Something modern replaced it I heard, they didn't want to bother trying to sell it. A good source of parts for someone with a twin I'd guess. And that’s everything that’s wrong with some people!! Definitely needs saving 2
roland elsdon Posted November 26, 2022 Report Posted November 26, 2022 Hopefully if no one can go and negotiate the scrap yard will see the value, and salvage it. Too much money and indifferent to history, by the sound of it. Maybe the owners having seen it in the skip the yard will heave it out! 1
Sea Dog Posted November 26, 2022 Report Posted November 26, 2022 It's safe in that skip for the time being - the law states skip companies cannot take their skips away until there has been a mattress on top for a minimum of 5 working days.
Stilllearning Posted November 26, 2022 Report Posted November 26, 2022 On the face of it, it does seem daft to not simply stick the engine and gearbox in the corner of a dry shed somewhere, and advertise it for sale for spares or repair.
john.k Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 People throw Gardners in the scrap here ......so I would have no hesitation scrapping a Dorman.
MtB Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 20 hours ago, Stilllearning said: On the face of it, it does seem daft to not simply stick the engine and gearbox in the corner of a dry shed somewhere, and advertise it for sale for spares or repair. I'd say it is worth peanuts. There is little demand for four cylinder vintage engines like that nowadays. Very unfashionable and not even 'proper' vintage with the flywheel enclosed like that. I had a very similar engine but with three cylinders so far more desirable. I put it on ebay and it took weeks to attract one single bid of the £100 starting price. Even then it wasn't purchased to go into a boat.
frangar Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 2 minutes ago, MtB said: I'd say it is worth peanuts. There is little demand for four cylinder vintage engines like that nowadays. Very unfashionable and not even 'proper' vintage with the flywheel enclosed like that. Still worth something for spares if you have another…Dorman parts aren’t that plentiful. Sadly more value is placed on a white painted interior now than a decent engine.
jonathanA Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 Even as scrap metal I would assume it would be worth 50-100 quid as I assume its fairly heavy... I'm always pleasently surprised when I take a car load of crap to our local scrappie and get £50 in my bank account . More if I'm weighing in old leisure batteries too.
MtB Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 21 minutes ago, jonathanA said: Even as scrap metal I would assume it would be worth 50-100 quid as I assume its fairly heavy... I'm always pleasently surprised when I take a car load of crap to our local scrappie and get £50 in my bank account . More if I'm weighing in old leisure batteries too. I can't imagine it weighing a tonne, which what it would need to be to be worth £70 in scrap. https://www.handsmetals.co.uk/scrap-metal-prices/
Mike Adams Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 This is a Dorman 4DSM many of which were built for the Admiralty during WW2 and some had a Kitchen rudder so the gearbox was only a clutch. Most were fitted in Wooden boats so they easily outlasted the craft they were fitted to and came on the the secondhand market. Many parts were shared with the 2DSM that being the 2 Cylinder model. They were high quality units but quite low in power for their size. I fitted a 2DSM in a 40ft narrowboat in 1980 and even then few parts were available. I have seen other 2DSM's in narrowboats but that was a while ago and I think Chris Lloyd put a 4DSM in a BCN tug in the early eighties and it was at the Tipton Rally around that time. They just don't have the same aesthetic appeal as an open flywheel engine.
jonathanA Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 2 hours ago, MtB said: I can't imagine it weighing a tonne, which what it would need to be to be worth £70 in scrap. https://www.handsmetals.co.uk/scrap-metal-prices/ Actually looking at the pic again its in a skip of scrap metal by the looks of it so imagine there is quite a bit in there and no doubt an extra bit of income for someone.
David Mack Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 2 hours ago, Mike Adams said: I fitted a 2DSM in a 40ft narrowboat in 1980 and even then few parts were available. I have seen other 2DSM's in narrowboats but that was a while ago and I think Chris Lloyd put a 4DSM in a BCN tug in the early eighties and it was at the Tipton Rally around that time. They just don't have the same aesthetic appeal as an open flywheel engine I think Big Woolwich Bath has a 2DSM - an industrial engine from a crane and now fitted with a separately mounted gearbox.
Mike Adams Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 24 minutes ago, David Mack said: I think Big Woolwich Bath has a 2DSM - an industrial engine from a crane and now fitted with a separately mounted gearbox. Most of the Dorman engines fitted to Ruston Cranes were I think the 2lb to 3ld series which were a nice engine but more modern and powerful than the DSM. I fitted one in White Heather for a time and it was a great engine but unfortunately too heavy for its location in the boat so I had to take it out again! The crane/generator engines appear quite often on ebay.
BEngo Posted November 27, 2022 Report Posted November 27, 2022 IIRC the 2DSM was 15 hp at 1000 rpm, with a 1:1 box. That strikes me as a bit lightweight for a Big Woolwich, compared with an 18 hp @1000 rpm National or RN with a 2:1 box. N
john.k Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 The CAV 6" starter has been salvaged ......one will cost you up to $1000 now ,if bought from a antique electrics specialist.
MtB Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 11 hours ago, BEngo said: IIRC the 2DSM was 15 hp at 1000 rpm, with a 1:1 box. That strikes me as a bit lightweight for a Big Woolwich, compared with an 18 hp @1000 rpm National or RN with a 2:1 box. N There are also however, the whacking great big Dormans, 2LB and 3LB with about 30HP and 45HP IIRC. A much better engine for a NB. I was wondering if this might have been a four cylinder version of that, in. which case it is way too big for a NB!
Mike Adams Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 11 hours ago, BEngo said: IIRC the 2DSM was 15 hp at 1000 rpm, with a 1:1 box. I think it was 10HP at 1000rpm which was the admiralty spec but you could raise the governor a bit. The 1:1 gearbox would only swing something like a 16 inch prop and that was fine on a 40foot 18 inch draft boat but maybe with an external 3:1 gearbox it might drive a full length boat slowly.
RLWP Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 We scrapped one because of a cracked block - frost damage. That one looks OK. Nice engine Richard
alan_fincher Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 15 hours ago, David Mack said: I think Big Woolwich Bath has a 2DSM - an industrial engine from a crane and now fitted with a separately mounted gearbox. The National Historic Ships Register suggests that it is a 2DHD.
noddyboater Posted November 28, 2022 Author Report Posted November 28, 2022 1 hour ago, MtB said: There are also however, the whacking great big Dormans, 2LB and 3LB with about 30HP and 45HP IIRC. A much better engine for a NB. I was wondering if this might have been a four cylinder version of that, in. which case it is way too big for a NB! Says the man with an 8 litre twin.. It was in a 45 footer I believe, so a bit overpowered even though it's a little un.
NB Alnwick Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 (edited) After spending ten years working with charities in the re-use and recyling sector, I am rarely surprised at anything that people chose to discard. Many people have little regard for the real value of what they have. Edited November 28, 2022 by NB Alnwick 1
Stilllearning Posted November 28, 2022 Report Posted November 28, 2022 23 minutes ago, NB Alnwick said: After spending ten years working with charities in the re-use and recyling sector, I am rarely surprised at anything that people chose to discard. Many people have little regard for the real value of what they have. I wholeheartedly agree, speaking as an ex-professional conservationist. The greenest businesses I know of are antique and bric-à-brac dealers.
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