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£400 energy bill discount


Lugi

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1 hour ago, Puffling said:

We'll have to disagree on this one then. Being a man, I wasn't welcome at Greenham but my then partner went. She spoke of the sense of community and human purpose that flowed; at its best a small self-organsied society, always with the aim to show that the world does not need nuclear weapons. Who can say tell what benefits the spinoffs from this protest had on those who came later?

 

If you can feel that staying human is worthwhile, even when it can’t have any result whatever, you’ve beaten them.”  George Orwell

 

I have a great admiration for activists, and the people I knew from Greenham were good people and I am sure that you are right about their sense of community and purpose. I  just can't see that the purpose could ever be realised in such a way, so the effort was basically pointless (though you could argue that everything is anyway, ultimately).

Whether the world needs nuclear weapons or not, Greenham did little to reduce their availability.

I just believe that if you want to achieve a goal, you use a method likely to do it, rather than a nicer one that doesn't get you anywhere except older. But I may be wrong!

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46 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I have a great admiration for activists, and the people I knew from Greenham were good people and I am sure that you are right about their sense of community and purpose. I  just can't see that the purpose could ever be realised in such a way, so the effort was basically pointless (though you could argue that everything is anyway, ultimately).

Whether the world needs nuclear weapons or not, Greenham did little to reduce their availability.

I just believe that if you want to achieve a goal, you use a method likely to do it, rather than a nicer one that doesn't get you anywhere except older. But I may be wrong!

Food for thought from Naomi Wolf:

https://naomiwolf.substack.com/p/rethinking-the-second-amendment?s=r

 

I don't agree with her, but some of her points touch on the area of "can peaceful protest ever defeat psychopathic politicians?"

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3 hours ago, MtB said:

 

 

Could it be that the 'thousands' here are still to be convinced that people who don't buy electricity from the grid should still get the £400 rebate?

 

 

 

3 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

It was supposed to be an offset against all rising energy costs,  not just electricity, but paid via the elec bill as everyone has one of those and not everyone has oil or gas. It just leaves out those completely off grid or not connected to domestic electricity.

 


I don’t think it matters how often you say that, it seems to be ignored. 


All the same, I’ll bump it up again 

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8 minutes ago, Goliath said:

 


I don’t think it matters how often you say that, it seems to be ignored. 


All the same, I’ll bump it up again 

People shouldnt be allowed to live under the radar. All these canal trash liveaboards should be made to pay their way, just taking the Mickey out of the establishment and all those of us with a postcode B)

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2 hours ago, Puffling said:

Food for thought from Naomi Wolf:

https://naomiwolf.substack.com/p/rethinking-the-second-amendment?s=r

 

I don't agree with her, but some of her points touch on the area of "can peaceful protest ever defeat psychopathic politicians?"

Thoreau's "On Civil Disobedience" is worth a read. I think I have the name right.

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3 hours ago, mrsmelly said:

People shouldnt be allowed to live under the radar. All these canal trash liveaboards should be made to pay their way, just taking the Mickey out of the establishment and all those of us with a postcode B)

 

Ooh you've changed Tim ... 😁

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13 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Ooh you've changed Tim ... 😁

Do you think he has seen the light ? I thought I detected a smidgen of anti Boris from him the other day but I couldn't see any flying pigs at the time 

Edited by haggis
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I emailed my local MP the following message with copies to the Chancellor and Mr Smelly's pal BoJo.

 

 

With regards to the Chancellor announcement in the House of Commons on 26th May 2022. That each household will get the £400 energy discount, this is not the true as many will miss out due to having to pay their metered electricity through a middle man and not direct to the electricity supply company.

 

We are deal with a matter that effects upwards of a million voting households. The person living in a bedsit with a meter in their room, People living on Boats in a Marina plugged in to electricity grid through a shoreline socket with a meter. People living in retirement on static residential caravan sites. Also for some people who live in blocks of flats or sheltered housing either renting or owning, the only source of electricity is through the building management company who act as a middle man between the flat resident and the electricity supply company.

 

Boat mooring fees rarely include electricity, this is a extra item which is billed quarterly in arrears per unit plus vat at 20%. There is also no energy cap either. The same with static residential caravan sites and some blocks of flats or sheltered housing. The middleman also will add on their own standing charge and in some cases increase the price per unit above the rate that they are paying the electricity company.

 

 

 

As to the Vat rate

 

ETA - I have looked further into this and a site owner or building management should charge VAT at 5% if utility is sub-metered and consumption levels fall below deminimis. Rarely does this happen, Some dishonest owners or companies may charge vat at 20%, but only pass on 5% to the VAT man.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-on-land-and-property-notice-742


11.7.6 Electricity, lighting and heating

If you make a separate charge for un-metered supplies of gas and electricity used by tenants, it should be treated as further payment for the main supply of accommodation. But where you operate a secondary meter, the charges to the tenants for the gas and electricity they use are consideration for separate supplies of fuel and power. These supplies will be standard-rated unless the fuel supplied is of a de-minimis quantity, in which case the supply will be subject to the reduced rate. See Fuel and power (VAT Notice 701/19) for more information.
 

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On 08/06/2022 at 08:22, MtB said:

 

 

Could it be that the 'thousands' here are still to be convinced that people who don't buy electricity from the grid should still get the £400 rebate?

 

 

No, I don't think so, there may only be a hundred who are active on here, and most agree with Arthur, above.

My grump is that the rhetoric is claiming every household gets £400 rebate, but that is not true.

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1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

As people with second homes get the payment twice, should I get it twice, once for the house  and a second one for the boat.

 

I should get it three times then. The cheating bustuds are diddling me!

 

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11 hours ago, nbfiresprite said:

I emailed my local MP the following message with copies to the Chancellor and Mr Smelly's pal BoJo.

 

 

With regards to the Chancellor announcement in the House of Commons on 26th May 2022. That each household will get the £400 energy discount, this is not the true as many will miss out due to having to pay their metered electricity through a middle man and not direct to the electricity supply company.

 

We are deal with a matter that effects upwards of a million voting households. The person living in a bedsit with a meter in their room, People living on Boats in a Marina plugged in to electricity grid through a shoreline socket with a meter. People living in retirement on static residential caravan sites. Also for some people who live in blocks of flats or sheltered housing either renting or owning, the only source of electricity is through the building management company who act as a middle man between the flat resident and the electricity supply company.

 

Boat mooring fees rarely include electricity, this is a extra item which is billed quarterly in arrears per unit plus vat at 20%. There is also no energy cap either. The same with static residential caravan sites and some blocks of flats or sheltered housing. The middleman also will add on their own standing charge and in some cases increase the price per unit above the rate that they are paying the electricity company.

 

 

 

As to the Vat rate

 

ETA - I have looked further into this and a site owner or building management should charge VAT at 5% if utility is sub-metered and consumption levels fall below deminimis. Rarely does this happen, Some dishonest owners or companies may charge vat at 20%, but only pass on 5% to the VAT man.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-on-land-and-property-notice-742


11.7.6 Electricity, lighting and heating

If you make a separate charge for un-metered supplies of gas and electricity used by tenants, it should be treated as further payment for the main supply of accommodation. But where you operate a secondary meter, the charges to the tenants for the gas and electricity they use are consideration for separate supplies of fuel and power. These supplies will be standard-rated unless the fuel supplied is of a de-minimis quantity, in which case the supply will be subject to the reduced rate. See Fuel and power (VAT Notice 701/19) for more information.
 

 

VAT Notice 701/19 also states (in para 3.2.1) that power used for genuine domestic purposes is subject to the 5% rate.  Although the eligibility is shown for houseboats, it is my understanding that this means domestic use on boats.  Certainly my marina charges 5% VAT on the electricity units though 20% on their separate admin fee.

 

Boaters should have seen a minor benefit from the 5p duty cut on diesel, depending on the percentage declared for propulsion, even though this was intended for road users.

  

 

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On 08/06/2022 at 08:56, Alan de Enfield said:

 

And the vast majority (99% ?) of those signed up will be getting an electricity bill, and hence the £400 credit. so have no interest in signing the petition.

I’m surprised you haven’t made your usual comment and put up a picture of one of your twirling girls?

 

I take it you’ve not read the petition? 
🙂

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4 minutes ago, Goliath said:

I’m surprised you haven’t made your usual comment and put up a picture of one of your twirling girls?

 

I take it you’ve not read the petition? 
🙂

 

No I have not - as much as possible I try to avoid anything to do with or originated by the 'Baton Twirlers'

 

Its almost like looking at Porn - I wouldn't want that appearing in by 'Search History' either .

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7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

No I have not - as much as possible I try to avoid anything to do with or originated by the 'Baton Twirlers'

 

Its almost like looking at Porn - I wouldn't want that appearing in by 'Search History' either .

There is always the incognito tab that keeps search history hidden 😉

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19 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

No I have not - as much as possible I try to avoid anything to do with or originated by the 'Baton Twirlers'

 

Its almost like looking at Porn - I wouldn't want that appearing in by 'Search History' either .

Not like looking for young girls twirling batons then? 😂 That’s ok?

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15 hours ago, LadyG said:

 

My grump is that the rhetoric is claiming every household gets £400 rebate, but that is not true.

The day a politician speaks the unsullied truth has yet to dawn, unfortunately. They announce stuff for political advantage and then leave, firstly, the civil servants and then the lawyers to sort out the mess. As the current lot have got rid of most of the competent civil servants in the interests of political purity, we're largely left with the lawyers, and they only care about the big fees.

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8 hours ago, Loddon said:

There is always the incognito tab that keeps search history hidden 😉

 

 

"Incognito" is also great for them websites that demand you agree to their filthy cookies being placed on your PC. Shut the tab, re-open the link 'Incognito' then click 'Agree' and let them place their worst, trackiest cookies and when you shut the Incognito tab or window, PAFF!!! All consigned to the dustbin of history with no trace left filling up your virtual biscuit jar. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

 

"Incognito" is also great for them websites that demand you agree to their filthy cookies being placed on your PC. Shut the tab, re-open the link 'Incognito' then click 'Agree' and let them place their worst, trackiest cookies and when you shut the Incognito tab or window, PAFF!!! All consigned to the dustbin of history with no trace left filling up your virtual biscuit jar. 

 

 


do you do that dark web too ?

 

and what’s a  PC?

 

 

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5 hours ago, Goliath said:


do you do that dark web too ?

 

and what’s a  PC?

 

 

 

 

Nope, never understood the dark web. First time I ever heard of it was when David Cameron started twittering on about it in the news for some reason, about ten years ago.

 

That worried me, to first hear about something to do with technology from a politician. Politicians are usually well behind the curve when it comes to technical stuff. Not that long previously I remember Reading MP Tony Durant commenting in the media that it finally looked as though the internet was "finally catching on", when that was what I thought about it too, but 15 years previous, like. 

 

 

Oh and a PC is a "personal komputa". Broadly obsolete but I expect Mr Durant will be buying one soon. Used mostly for sending messages via the equally obsolete system once known as "email".

 

 

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Today's "Moneybox" on BBC Radio 4 (repeated tomorrow and already on BBC sounds)  deals with this. It is intended to be "per household" and will only be payable via electricity bills in monthly installments of around £66,  starting in October. The government are to consult on how to deliver the discount to people such as those who live in caravan parks where their electricity cost is included in their service charges. For tenants whose electricity is re-sold to tenants by their landlord, the landlord is expected to pass on the discount to the tenant. (It was not mentioned how this will work where a large house has a single meter for the incoming supply and multiple meters are providrd for the landlord to re-sell electricity to his multiple tenants who are individual households.)

 

As usual, the devil is in the detail, but basically, if you do not have a mains electricity supply, you will definitely get nothing. 

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3 minutes ago, Ronaldo47 said:

Today's "Moneybox" on BBC Radio 4 (repeated tomorrow and already on BBC sounds)  deals with this. It is intended to be "per household" and will only be payable via electricity bills in monthly installments of around £66,  starting in October. The government are to consult on how to deliver the discount to people such as those who live in caravan parks where their electricity cost is included in their service charges. For tenants whose electricity is re-sold to tenants by their landlord, the landlord is expected to pass on the discount to the tenant. (It was not mentioned how this will work where a large house has a single meter for the incoming supply and multiple meters are providrd for the landlord to re-sell electricity to his multiple tenants who are individual households.)

 

As usual, the devil is in the detail, but basically, if you do not have a mains electricity supply, you will definitely get nothing. 

But I don't pay £66 a month until this contract runs out. I am one of the ones who didn't listen when they said "Electricity prices are at an all time high, now is not the time to lock in" I did and they just kept going higher.

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