Overstaying apparently

[MtB]

 

Why not just tell the truth "I cannot comply" - get a mooring and cut your stress levels to zero.

 

 

Curiously I've just received an email similar to that received by the OP.

 

Curious because:

 

1) I have a home mooring, I'm just not on it, and

2) I have a Winter Mooring instead, and I'm displaying the permits.

 

Yet I still got the email!

[Murflynn]

The local CRT boat checker in my area rides a bike, so able to cover some considerable distance in a day along the Coventry Canal.

bloody cyclists on towpaths - don't get me started !

[Jrtm]

The direction a boat is pointing is completely irrelevant.

No its not, what if im on a shot arm say going to coventry,

 

Tie up 14 days then move tie up for 6 days then move back close to where i was moored before for 7 days if the checker came on the last day before i move of my 14 day stop but then came out again on my 7 day stop it could appear ive not moved by there systen as it dosnt alow direction.

 

I could from this instance be given a over stay notice dispite doing nothing wrong and infact being fully compliant with the rules as ill ive done is got to the end of the cut and turned around and carrying on my trip.

 

So yes direction does make a diffrence.

[WotEver]

No its not, what if im on a shot arm say going to coventry,

 

Tie up 14 days then move tie up for 6 days then move back close to where i was moored before for 7 days if the checker came on the last day before i move of my 14 day stop but then came out again on my 7 day stop it could appear ive not moved by there systen as it dosnt alow direction.

 

I could from this instance be given a over stay notice dispite doing nothing wrong and infact being fully compliant with the rules as ill ive done is got to the end of the cut and turned around and carrying on my trip.

 

So yes direction does make a diffrence.

But what's to stop someone going nowhere and just turning their boat around?

 

Depending on the length of the boat and the width of the canal they might not even need to find a winding hole.

[Paul C]

No its not, what if im on a shot arm say going to coventry,

 

Tie up 14 days then move tie up for 6 days then move back close to where i was moored before for 7 days if the checker came on the last day before i move of my 14 day stop but then came out again on my 7 day stop it could appear ive not moved by there systen as it dosnt alow direction.

 

I could from this instance be given a over stay notice dispite doing nothing wrong and infact being fully compliant with the rules as ill ive done is got to the end of the cut and turned around and carrying on my trip.

 

So yes direction does make a diffrence.

 

Yes but direction (the boat is facing) alone isn't enough to demonstrate you've been in a different place (for example the end of the arm, to turn). Other factors such as the available places to turn and your boat length are also important. At the end of the day, the law is written that its up to the boater to satisfy the board they're complying.

[Alan de Enfield]

But what's to stop someone going nowhere and just turning their boat around?

 

Depending on the length of the boat and the width of the canal they might not even need to find a winding hole.

 

Pretty much what was said 54 posts earlier :

 

So, all the P-Takers have to do is moor in a part of the cut that is wider than their boat is long, after 14 days, untie the bow, push it out into the cut, pole it around so it is now facing the opposite direction, re-tie the mooring.

Moor for another 14 days, repeat, repeat,...................

 

You don't even need an engine.

[MtB]

If the OP received an email the same as mine it was polite, non-judgemental and simply asked me to start cruising again or call them for a chat. I'm not sure why he didn't just call them instead of moaning about it on here.

 

For the benefit of the board, here is a (slightly redacted) copy and paste of the actual email I received:

 

Title:

Reminder: Moored up for over 14 days? Please move on or contact to discuss.

 

Body:

Dear Mike the Boilerman

 

We’ve been looking at our sighting records and they suggest that your boat has been moored in the same general area for more than 14 days.

If this is not the case, or you have any questions, please give me a call on 01452 318058 so you can have a chat to us about your circumstances. Remember to quote your boat index number and to tell us where you’re currently moored.

 

If you have been moored up for longer than 14 days, please continue your journey to avoid action for overstaying.

 

You can find out more about mooring rules, licensing and the enforcement process, as well as information covering everything else about boating on our waters, on our website: www.canalrivertrust.org.uk/boating.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Anne Simmonds

Boating Co-ordinator

Tel: 01452 318058

 

 

Canal and River Trust at The Dock Office, Commercial Road, Gloucester GL1 2EB

 

 

Please visit our website http://canalrivertrust.org.uk/ to find out more about the Canal and River Trust and download our “Shaping our Future document” on the About Us Page

[Bewildered]

If the OP received an email the same as mine it was polite, non-judgemental and simply asked me to start cruising again or call them for a chat. I'm not sure why he didn't just call them instead of moaning about it on here.

 

For the benefit of the board, here is a (slightly redacted) copy and paste of the actual email I received:

 

Title:

Reminder: Moored up for over 14 days? Please move on or contact to discuss.

 

Body:

Dear Mike the Boilerman

 

Weve been looking at our sighting records and they suggest that your boat has been moored in the same general area for more than 14 days.

If this is not the case, or you have any questions, please give me a call on 01452 318058 so you can have a chat to us about your circumstances. Remember to quote your boat index number and to tell us where youre currently moored.

 

If you have been moored up for longer than 14 days, please continue your journey to avoid action for overstaying.

 

You can find out more about mooring rules, licensing and the enforcement process, as well as information covering everything else about boating on our waters, on our website: www.canalrivertrust.org.uk/boating.

 

 

Hi Mike,

Yes that is pretty much the same letter, although I didn't post on here to complain about it I just found it amusing and was after some clarification on the rules. I have been all over the country this year and now that it is winter I just want to stay in a bit more of a localised area (don't want to get iced in to far from an elsan and water point); I'm just not sure how small that can be. I would have thought a 15-20 mile stretch of canal reasonable, but apparently it's not. Or I'm just doing it wrong.

I will get round to phoning them but today I've been busy moving the boat.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Bewildered

[ditchcrawler]

I find this strange, and would welcome others input, I have never been asked at a lock where a lockie was operating for my details, or noticed them taking details of my boat.

Ours were recorded at Hanwell, Brentford, Bratch, Hearcastle Tunnel, Anderton Lift .Gloucester, Foxton, Watford for ones that I know of.

 

Yes they (collectively) walk the entire length of the towpaths ie including rural areas, stretches of canal away from roads, etc.

And up the arms like the Engine Arm at the top of Napton.

No its not, what if im on a shot arm say going to coventry,

 

Tie up 14 days then move tie up for 6 days then move back close to where i was moored before for 7 days if the checker came on the last day before i move of my 14 day stop but then came out again on my 7 day stop it could appear ive not moved by there systen as it dosnt alow direction.

 

I could from this instance be given a over stay notice dispite doing nothing wrong and infact being fully compliant with the rules as ill ive done is got to the end of the cut and turned around and carrying on my trip.

 

So yes direction does make a diffrence.

You wouldn't get an overstaying notice, they would contact you just like they did the OP

Hi Mike,

Yes that is pretty much the same letter, although I didn't post on here to complain about it I just found it amusing and was after some clarification on the rules. I have been all over the country this year and now that it is winter I just want to stay in a bit more of a localised area (don't want to get iced in to far from an elsan and water point); I'm just not sure how small that can be. I would have thought a 15-20 mile stretch of canal reasonable, but apparently it's not. Or I'm just doing it wrong.

I will get round to phoning them but today I've been busy moving the boat.

But they don't know you have done 20 miles, they have just seen you in the same spot 3 weeks in a row.

[Murflynn]

I hate circular arguments!

[MtB]

 

But they don't know you have done 20 miles, they have just seen you in the same spot 3 weeks in a row.

 

 

And they appreciate the OP may have been cruising and not been logged doing it, which is why they asked the OP to call them. To fill in the blanks.

 

Is that so unreasonable of them?

I hate circular arguments!

 

I quite like the elliptical ones though...

[Mike Todd]

 

 

And they appreciate the OP may have been cruising and not been logged doing it, which is why they asked the OP to call them. To fill in the blanks.

 

Is that so unreasonable of them?

 

I quite like the elliptical ones though...

Sadly, most social media ones are hyperbolic , , ,

[biggles47]

Although I have a live and let live view on life, it does rely on people not taking the P and preventing others from 'letting live'.

 

I'm not saying the OP is taking the P, but it's worth remembering why the 1995 Act was brought in. Before then, everyone had to have a permanent mooring. Lots of boaters wanted to travel around the system for long periods and thought it was unfair to have to pay for a mooring which they wouldn't use. Hence the change in the law to allow boaters to explore the system without having to have a permanent mooring.

 

So it was stipulated by that law that you should move on after 14 days and that you should 'be on a continuous journey'. This was an attempt to uphold the spirit of 'continuous cruising".

 

Those who abuse the spirit of the 1995 act threaten to mess it up for those who wish to cruise around and explore the system.

 

Now all we have to ask ourselves is whether as boaters we are acting within the spirit of the 1995 act? Or would a permanent mooring be actually more convenient if one was available?

[David Mack]

 

I'm not saying the OP is taking the P, but it's worth remembering why the 1995 Act was brought in. Before then, everyone had to have a permanent mooring.

No they didn't. Pre 1995 there was no requirement at all to have a mooring. BW wanted to introduce such a requirement, boater organisations objected and the current CCer requirement was the compromise which resulted.

[biggles47]

No they didn't. Pre 1995 there was no requirement at all to have a mooring. BW wanted to introduce such a requirement, boater organisations objected and the current CCer requirement was the compromise which resulted.

If that's true, I stand corrected.

 

So does that mean as a CC'er or CM'er you could do what you liked before the 1995 act and moor up anywhere you liked for as long as you like? (provided it wasn't on a BW mooring)

[MtB]

Those who abuse the spirit of the 1995 act threaten to mess it up for those who wish to cruise around and explore the system.

 

Now all we have to ask ourselves is whether as boaters we are acting within the spirit of the 1995 act? Or would a permanent mooring be actually more convenient if one was available?

 

 

True, but making every boat get a permanent mooring is not possible. The genie is out of the bottle. There are more boats than moorings.

 

On 'my' bit of the K&A I'd say there are 100+ CCers. CRT have one mooring available on their website and all the marinas are effectively full.

[dmr]

Mike, you say the email was slightly redacted.

 

Ours had a little introductory blurb something like "you might have noticed that our canals are getting busier.....". Did you remove that or have CaRT themselves removed that bit?

 

Its interesting how things change, although your bit is busy the long pound (central K&A) is surprisingly empty this year. There's a busy bit at Hornton but otherwise its quiet with spaces on all of the visitor moorings (Honeystreet, All Cannings and Devizes). Maybe everybody has moved East for the winter.

[Chewbacka]

 

 

True, but making every boat get a permanent mooring is not possible. The genie is out of the bottle. There are more boats than moorings.

 

On 'my' bit of the K&A I'd say there are 100+ CCers. CRT have one mooring available on their website and all the marinas are effectively full.

I suspect you mean there are not enough moorings in the area people wish to live, rather than CRT & marinas can not create enough mooring space overall.

[MtB]

I suspect you mean there are not enough moorings in the area people wish to live, rather than CRT & marinas can not create enough mooring space overall.

 

 

My personal observations suggest the same situation applies to the whole of the K&A, the Thames, all of London and the Oxford canal south of say Rugby. Everywhere in the south there is a large excess of CCing boats over vacant moorings.

 

I dunno how it is up in the wilderness north.

[biggles47]

 

 

My personal observations suggest the same situation applies to the whole of the K&A, the Thames, all of London and the Oxford canal south of say Rugby. Everywhere in the south there is a large excess of CCing boats over vacant moorings.

 

I dunno how it is up in the wilderness north.

What's CC'ing got to do with people trying to find moorings where they want to live?

 

Anyway, a lot of the CC'ers I have met this year are visiting from the North.

[MtB]

What's CC'ing got to do with people trying to find moorings where they want to live?

 

Anyway, a lot of the CC'ers I have met this year are visiting from the North.

 

 

Wake up at the back.

 

I asserted that if the law was changed to make it compulsory to have a mooring, it would be impractical as there are more boats than moorings. A boat with no mooring is a CCer by definition.

 

What does it have to do with where the boat owner want's to live? Boaters want moorings near(ish) to where they DO live!

Edited December 17, 2016 by Mike the Boilerman

[Chewbacka]

BW/CRT have been reducing the number of canal side moorings over the last few years. Moorings are a supply and demand issue, and overall, including private marinas, there are empty mooring spaces. I think that if CRT were able to enforce every boat having a home mooring, they would not take long to make enough spaces available, BUT not close to where many of the CCers would like. So especially around London, Bath, Bristol, Oxford etc.

[biggles47]

 

 

Wake up at the back.

 

A boat with no mooring is a CCer by definition.

 

 

No it isn't. You meant CM'ers and bridge hoppers but thought you'd throw the label of CC'ers into the mix and stir it up.

[Athy]

I beg to differ. A boat with no mooring surely is a Continuous Cruiser, or at least its owner is (there's a point: can CCer apply to both the person and his boat?) Similarly, a CMer by definition has a mooring, even though it is not an official one, because it is continuously moored.

[Murflynn]

this is going to tend towards the elliptical parabolic again.