Nearly drowned

[frahkn]

 

That link is very interesting but one bit confused me, regarding going into cold water unexpectedly.

The link states that you have the gasp, hyperventilation and if you're unlucky, cardiac arrest.

I went in at 1am January before last, and I got the gasp, clearly remember being convinced that my heart had actually stopped, but did not hyperventilate.

Odd.

(I hauled myself out onto the pontoon with about a 2ft drop without any major issue, other than losing my trackie pants... I was also lucky enough to go in in a spot where this was possible to do quickly, before I lost the feeling in my hands.)

I used to be a keen sea swimmer and in various clubs and teams that used to go out across nine months of the year, so I wonder if the effect of the cold was lessened for me-although that is totally unlikely from a scientific point of view, cold is cold, and I was fecking freezing.

 

I am also a bit confused.

 

I fell in while mooring temporarily in Stoke. We had spent a very cold, wet morning coming up from Stone and I was freezing even under multiple winter layers. I think this is why I fell. Strangely, I did not feel cold at all once in the water but could not get myself out. Two passers by came to my aid but were very excitable and I had to explain what they were to do (first, complete tying up the stern, get on board and turn the engine off) they wanted to pull me towards the back of the partly drifting boat. In the event they only passed the rope through a ring - I tied it off on the boat while still in the water.

 

They were two fit young chaps but it was all they could do to pull me out in all that wet clothing.

 

It was only October but it was a wet, cold, windy day and honestly I felt warmer in the water than out of it.

 

We all had a scotch (they needed it for the shock) while I thanked them and then I went in and had a shower. Apart from a bit of a leg injury (which I only spotted in the shower) I was fine.

 

Lucky they were passing though, I don't think my wife could have got me out.

 

Frank.

[Starcoaster]

Perhaps the key there is in the multiple layers part-trapped water between the layers provided some insulation? And also, being in the cut got you out of the wind... Pure conjecture on my part.

[Laurie Booth]

Man swims for 6 hours in sea temp 6c

 

http://www.vikingrune.com/2009/03/true-viking-grit/

[Ray T]

A very interesting and valuable thread. I wonder if anyone one has ever " practiced" what to do in the event? Do any training courses have falling in as a part. This may sound daft but it is standard practice on sailing kayaking and life-saving courses. Falling in cold water, it is often coldest in the spring and early summer, is so different to swimming pool water. The effect of it on the back of the neck, base of the brain, needs to be experienced to realise what effect it has. Maybe marinas could set up " falling in " days, where people could see what its like in "safe" surroundings, with a few people in wet suits etc to help them if they get into difficulty.

Also warming up afterwards is not easy. Should you get in hot or warm water , which can lead to shock, or drink hot liquids alcohol etc

I once jumped into the top of the slalom course at Holme Pierrepont to see what it would be like in a section of continuous white water and that helped a lot when it happened for real, less planned way, to stop me panicking.

 

Some interesting information here. http://www.shipwrite.bc.ca/Chilling_truth.htm

 

If you fall in the canal in winter, you've got about five minutes before you loose dexterity, maybe 30 before you loose consciouness then maybe an hour before you are an ex-boater.

 

Good post above.

 

The only "practice" I have ever done is a sea survival course at Solihull Baths, many years ago. It involved 6 candidates, all of us in full offshore gear. One of the elements of the course was to pull oneself into the life raft unaided. As others have mentioned I lacked the upper body strength to do it. This was in the warmth of the swimming baths. One of the issues in winter is the cold shock which can cause a person to become rigid. In younger days I used to dinghy race throughout the year and from November to April it was mandatory to wear a wet suit. Even then falling in when capsizing was a unpleasant experience.

 

Mrs T fell in at Braunston a couple of years or so ago by the A45 bridge. The concrete sides had nothing to grab hold of and I was unable to pull her out. Luckily another boater came to our aid. We now carry a boarding ladder which fortunately we haven't had to use in anger - yet.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Ray T

[Boaty Jo]

The Shipwrite article makes sobering reading.

There is an arguable case for wearing 'personal flotation' more than we do, particularly in slippery conditions. With one you can buy time to get yourself organised but without one, particularly if you bang your head while falling in, you could be in real trouble. Just about the first thing a C&RT employee does now is put on a self-inflator.

Alcohol is another thing that doesn't mix well with less than ideal conditions - though many of us have taken a risk here.

Being aware of the risks and being able to help someone else is another reason for learning some basic First Aid.

[Athy]

Has no one yet mentioned carrying a lifebelt on the boat? Obviously it's of use only if there is another person aboard to throw or hand it down to the involuntary swimmer, but it can keep him afloat while other crew members seek assistance. We do carry one (well, two actually) though we have not yet needed to use them.

[John V]

I carry one on the roof of the yoghurt pot, but as you say it's only of use if there is someone to throw it to you.

Unfortunately I normally single hand Shapfell.

[MtB]

Has no one yet mentioned carrying a lifebelt on the boat? Obviously it's of use only if there is another person aboard to throw or hand it down to the involuntary swimmer, but it can keep him afloat while other crew members seek assistance. We do carry one (well, two actually) though we have not yet needed to use them.

 

I used to keep a lifebelt on the roof, attached to a 60ft line. It was always a major trip hazard on the roof. On reflection, I decided it was more likely to cause someone to fall in than be of help in rescuing someone already in water four feet deep.

 

So I got rid of it. A finely balanced decision though.

[alan_fincher]

Has no one yet mentioned carrying a lifebelt on the boat? Obviously it's of use only if there is another person aboard to throw or hand it down to the involuntary swimmer, but it can keep him afloat while other crew members seek assistance. We do carry one (well, two actually) though we have not yet needed to use them.

 

If we are talking canals rather than rivers, and you are of reasonable height, then, if you go in, particularly if near the sides, there is a very good chance you will be able to stand on the bottom, if you have not knocked yourself out, or had a severe injury.

 

However there is a wealth of difference between being able to stand on the bottom in ice cold water, and managing to climb out.

 

I'm not knocking having a life ring, but they are only useful if there is someone else there to deploy it, and the person in trouble in a good enough state to get into it.

 

I choosing between the two, and for canal use, I'd place some kind of boarding ladder as more useful than a life ring, but why not have both.

 

I used to keep a lifebelt on the roof, attached to a 60ft line. It was always a major trip hazard on the roof. On reflection, I decided it was more likely to cause someone to fall in than be of help in rescuing someone already in water four feet deep.

 

So I got rid of it. A finely balanced decision though.

 

Tow it behind the boat. so it is immediately available if you go in whilst single handing?

[MtB]

 

If we are talking canals rather than rivers, and you are of reasonable height, then, if you go in, particularly if near the sides, there is a very good chance you will be able to stand on the bottom, if you have not knocked yourself out, or had a severe injury.

 

However there is a wealth of difference between being able to stand on the bottom in ice cold water, and managing to climb out.

 

I'm not knocking having a life ring, but they are only useful if there is someone else there to deploy it, and the person in trouble in a good enough state to get into it.

 

I choosing between the two, and for canal use, I'd place some kind of boarding ladder as more useful than a life ring, but why not have both.

 

Tow it behind the boat. so it is immediately available if you go in whilst single handing?

 

 

Would I have to licence it as a butty?

[Emerald Fox]

So quick he reckons his underpants never got wet.

 

Just 'slightly soiled' perhaps?

 

These don't take up much room, and they really do work:

 

http://renomomsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/waterwings.jpg

 

Going to have a look now for rope ladders, but any links/shops that can be suggested?

We have a rail on each side of the roof, perfect for attaching ladder to, when needed.

[Starcoaster]

I had a life ring on the boat for about three years that I was loathe to get rid of, but I ultimately concluded that it was more likely to knock someone out who was flailing in the water than to help them, so I binned it.

The throw bags as issued to the volockies seem like a most excellent idea for boaters-and at under £20 each, I am surprised they are not more common kit on NB's in general.

They're hefty enough to throw a distance but not hard enough to knock someone out, and when the swimmer has grabbed it, you can use the rope to pull them in.

 

Again, all useless if you're on your own.

A throw bag:

[Guest]

Going to have a look now for rope ladders, but any links/shops that can be suggested?

We have a rail on each side of the roof, perfect for attaching ladder to, when needed.

Excellent idea.

 

Climb out onto boat... attach ladder to rails, jump back in , use ladder to climb out.....

[ditchcrawler]

 

I am also a bit confused.

 

I fell in while mooring temporarily in Stoke. We had spent a very cold, wet morning coming up from Stone and I was freezing even under multiple winter layers. I think this is why I fell. Strangely, I did not feel cold at all once in the water but could not get myself out. Two passers by came to my aid but were very excitable and I had to explain what they were to do (first, complete tying up the stern, get on board and turn the engine off) they wanted to pull me towards the back of the partly drifting boat. In the event they only passed the rope through a ring - I tied it off on the boat while still in the water.

 

They were two fit young chaps but it was all they could do to pull me out in all that wet clothing.

 

It was only October but it was a wet, cold, windy day and honestly I felt warmer in the water than out of it.

 

We all had a scotch (they needed it for the shock) while I thanked them and then I went in and had a shower. Apart from a bit of a leg injury (which I only spotted in the shower) I was fine.

 

Lucky they were passing though, I don't think my wife could have got me out.

 

Frank.

Luckily the water has been unusually warm this autumn

[Athy]

Excellent idea.

 

Climb out onto boat... attach ladder to rails, jump back in , use ladder to climb out.....

Tee-hee. But Foxy does just about all his boating (as far as I know) with Pirkko, so there would be someone left on board to manipulate the ladder.

[MtB]

So given the difficulty in climbing out of the cut when the bank is piling, or in say an empty lock, the best bet for a solo boater in the water seems to be to climb back onto the boat.

 

So what methods are can be used and what kit could be fitted, to be deployed by a solo boater already in the water?

 

Richard mentions a ladder backed under the stern fender. Is this something you made up yourself Richard or is it a manufactured item?

 

Alan mentions the difficulty of climbing up using the skeg and rudder as the rudder swings to one side. Newer hulls have lugs sticking out on the uxter plate to get around this I imagine. Anyone ever tried to climb out using those lugs?

 

Any other suggestions? Tony Jones' approach is to carry a waterproof mobile at all times so he can call for help!

[Athy]

 

The throw bags as issued to the volockies seem like a most excellent idea

In case those big waves make then feel nauseous?

 

(Serious hat on) yes, they look good. Apart from their longer string, though, in what way are they better then the fairly lightweight lifebelts which we carry?

[David Mack]

Tow it behind the boat. so it is immediately available if you go in whilst single handing?

But be careful if you try to go astern!

[nebulae]

Not really relating to this thread,but I am sure each boat should " have a life buoy within reach of the helmsman"to conform to CaRT regs. No help to a single hander anyway. Rope ladders coiled up on the counter may be the answer,but climbing a rope ladder is not as easy as you might think .If your boat has a projection to the uxter plate then you need to be able grab something to pull on,maybe the stern line if it is left on the counter?

[Ray T]

But be careful if you try to go astern!

 

A couple of things I noticed when Millie the Mutt recently slipped her harness and fell overboard.

 

Although I stopped the engine immediately the boat of course carried on moving forward away from the DOB, Dog overboard, could just as easily been a person. The temptation to put the boat into reverse was great. As it was a windy day the boat then proceeded to go where the wind was blowing it, not where I wanted it to be.

 

Also there was a boat coming in the opposite direction who obviously had no idea what was happening in front. I had shouted for Mrs T by this time who immediately shot to the front of the boat and got the approaching boat to try to stop as best they could, which they did.

 

Fortunately Millie knows her boat and and with encouragement from us swam to the counter where we retrieved her.

As I am well versed with man overboard drill from my offshore days and some of this training automatically "kicked in".

 

On one training course one of the crew jumped in Plymouth Sound so we had a real man overboard to rescue. Although he was wearing a safety harness, life jacket etc., it was still incredibly difficult to get him back on board. We actually used a spinnaker halyard clipped him to that and winched him aboard. I know the circumstances are different on a canal but it illustrated how difficult it is to get a sodden person back on board.

 

I should imagine most of us know what action to take "in theory" but reality is often very different.

Edited December 8, 2015 by Ray T

[MtB]

I fell in on Friday evening between my boat and the metal pilings at my mooring. Pitch black and freezing cold. I couldn't get out and panicked. I started to sink into the silt and thought that was it. After about five minutes of sheer panic I stopped moving and got my breath back. I kept still for about ten minutes to get my breath back and gather my thoughts. I then moved to the back end of the boat where it is lower and managed to drag myself out. I've only just stopped shaking. I genuinely thought my time was up. I lost my glasses, had no idea what to do for the best. I couldn't understand what happened. I always thought I would know what to do in this situation and had 'a plan' if it happened. It all went out of the window. I'm reasonably fit for a sixty year old and never even thought I'd have a problem pulling myself out easily. 20 mins in the freezing cold water with no one around made my 'plan' useless. I'll never take any more risks anymore. Horrendous experience, but I have learnt one lesson and that's not to get complacent getting on and off my boat. It can be a question of life or death every time we do it. Sounds dramatic and I don't mean to big my situation up but it's how I feel at the moment. I wonder how many of us take our everyday movements for granted. I certainly don't now.

Steve P

 

 

Another result of your post is whenever I step off or onto the boat I glance around to briefly assess where I'd aim for to get out should I fall in. Right here, the towpath side is thick reeds down to the water so I reckon I'd be able just wade/climb out up the bank. The offside is not piled either, but thick brambles down to the water's edge. Not that getting out on the offside is a great idea, as it would mean a long walk in wet clothes to the nearest bridge or lock to get back to the boat.

 

Even so, glancing around and keeping oneself aware of the possibilities all the time seems a Good Idea to me as a solo boater.

[Tacet]

Newer hulls have lugs sticking out on the uxter plate to get around this I imagine. Anyone ever tried to climb out using those lugs?

 

 

I have - and the steps are better than nothing, but still not easy. At around water level, the step is very high to pull oneself up from, Also, the item available to pull on is the swan neck close to deck level, which therefore swivels towards you, resulting it being closer than is desirable; i.e. wrong angle to finish the pull.

 

My attempt was following a (deliberate) swim in the Nene on a hot summer's day. Whilst it was manageable, the circumstances were as good as they get. Others will have stronger upper body strength than me, but add any shock, cold or clothing and it is doubtful I could do it.

 

Just to add, several other ways of getting-out were identified before I went in. I've been boating 45 years and have yet to fall in; no real explanation as I have taken plenty of chances and no better than averagely nimble or well-co-ordinated.

[system 4-50]

Nobody has explained why CRT is at fault in these circumstances, and everything always has to be CRT's fault in some way, so here is my offering - it is their fault for not providing warning notices every 50 yds along the sides of the canal where it is difficult to climb out, in a similar fashion to the signs telling anglers not to connect their rods to the National Grid, or their signs warning of deep mud.

[MtB]

I have - and the steps are better than nothing, but still not easy. At around water level, the step is very high to pull oneself up from, Also, the item available to pull on is the swan neck close to deck level, which therefore swivels towards you, resulting it being closer than is desirable; i.e. wrong angle to finish the pull.

 

 

Hmmmm interesting comments, thanks.

 

I was imagining grabbing a dolly rather than the swan neck, to pull on. Did you try this? Are they in exactly the wrong place perhaps?

[Emerald Fox]

Excellent idea.

Climb out onto boat... attach ladder to rails, jump back in , use ladder to climb out.....

 

You miss nothing! Apart from the fact that another person on board can attach the ladder, or that the ladder is permanently attached and just needs a pull at a string which is almost at water level.

 

I'm thinking about this, getting a rope ladder. As it happens, I did help to pull a fully clothed chap out of the drink at Aynho last Boxing Day. He had fallen off the gunwhale of his boat.

 

Old boaters don't die - they just smell like it after they've dropped into the cut and been pulled back out again!