Passing above tickover

[b0atman]

On L&L at moment plenty of width and assume depth .

Local boaters go past at a fair rate of knots but cause me and my spring line moored boat no problems.

question is should we have big signs at places like Preston brook advising them of tick over when passing moored boats beyond this point.

[Murflynn]

I don't know.

[b0atman]

I really asked the question as just met a couple of new boat owners out for their first two weeks and it made me think they will learn boating up here and one day venture south .

Lovely elderly couple .But apprentices in the world of boating meeting them later in Liverpool docks.

[by'eck]

Its all about the depth of water under your moored boat. In a shallow canal you can easily see the passing boats wake removing this and therefore causing severe movement of moored boat. Tying up properly with fore and aft lines extending fore and aft (not tied at right angle) helps reduce this of course.

[nicknorman]

"Tickover" is such an arbitrary power setting that it is meaningless in the context of passing moored boats. It is the right setting for our boat on narrow shallow canals because we have a big prop, big engine and displace a lot of water, however there are plenty of boats around that virtually stop when at tickover, and certainly don't respond well to the tiller. Personally I would rather a boat passed slightly faster, than crashed into me!

[Barry]

"Tickover" is such an arbitrary power setting that it is meaningless in the context of passing moored boats. It is the right setting for our boat on narrow shallow canals because we have a big prop, big engine and displace a lot of water, however there are plenty of boats around that virtually stop when at tickover, and certainly don't respond well to the tiller. Personally I would rather a boat passed slightly faster, than crashed into me!

 

Totally agree Nick. Lemontoes' Tonka does about half a mile an hour at tickover. A totally impractical speed to travel at, even past moored boats.

[David Schweizer]

 

Totally agree Nick. Lemontoes' Tonka does about half a mile an hour at tickover. A totally impractical speed to travel at, even past moored boats.

 

Same here, or even slower. It makes those ubiquitous signs asking boats to pass at tickover a nonsense. I pass boats at what I consider to be a speed which respects the moored boat, and reflects the canal conditions. sometimes that is at tickover, but usually a bit faster.

[Higgs]

A speed, no slower than would be necessary to maintain positive control of the boat, under the prevailing conditions.

[Nightwatch]

Richard Cranium has just past us at 'more than slow', He was concentrating on his phone rather than other canal users. I was going to give him 'the look', but he didn't look.

 

I find it unfair as I always slow to pass moored boats,unless I'm on the phone of course.

[BruceinSanity]

Quite agree, tickover is no guide at all. SA draws about 28" at the back and displaces about 23 tonnes, so we take it very slow on narrow and shallow waters, usually this means tickover but sometimes a bit more. Like others, I watch the effect on the boats I'm passing. We're on Tixall atm so boats are passing much faster with out any effect on us at all.

 

To get back to the original point, I have noticed more probs with speeding boats between Preston Brook and Middlewich which I put down to folk coming off the Bridgewater and not adjusting to the conditions. You see the same thing on canals that join river navigations.

[Guest]

Quite agree, tickover is no guide at all. SA draws about 28" at the back and displaces about 23 tonnes, so we take it very slow on narrow and shallow waters, usually this means tickover but sometimes a bit more. Like others, I watch the effect on the boats I'm passing. We're on Tixall atm so boats are passing much faster with out any effect on us at all.

 

To get back to the original point, I have noticed more probs with speeding boats between Preston Brook and Middlewich which I put down to folk coming off the Bridgewater and not adjusting to the conditions. You see the same thing on canals that join river navigations.

Yes there is not much "passing at tickover" on the Bridgewater!

The whole "pass at tickover" is a nonsense for the many reasons that have been stated. There is no "one size fits all" in many boating situations.

 

In all the years on the cut, I can only think of a handful who have moaned about us passing too quickly, and the common denominator was that they all used a centre line (from the cabin roof) to moor their boats.

 

There are some people who were born to be offended, and even if you carried the boat past them, they would still find something to whine about. Happily they are a small minority.

[Midnight]

................

 

There are some people who were born to be offended, and even if you carried the boat past them, they would still find something to whine about. Happily they are a small minority.

 

Oh yes I've met them. I always pass boats in tick-over but check my gps for the speed. It varies between 1.8 and 2.1 knots. Sometimes on wide deep canals tick-over seems ridiculously slow but still I have had a few 'signs' from various boaters over the years.

 

The best was at Preston Brooke in the day's when I hired. On returning to base I spotted some boat movements in the yard so put the engine in neutral and drifted from the motorway bridge past the chandlers to the yard. The side hatch of the boat moored opposite the yard flung open and the boater shouted at me to slow down. When I explained I was in neutral and drifting he closed the hatch as quickly as it was opened.

 

In 12 years of boating I can honestly say only once has a boat passed me at a speed to cause a problem. That was the wide-beam hire boat who passed me when I was moored at Snaygill on the L&L. The surge ripped out a whole 8ft section of the decking to which I was tied.

[koukouvagia]

 

On returning to base I spotted some boat movements in the yard so put the engine in neutral and drifted from the motorway bridge past the chandlers to the yard. The side hatch of the boat moored opposite the yard flung open and the boater shouted at me to slow down. When I explained I was in neutral and drifting he closed the hatch as quickly as it was opened.

My technique is similar. I put the Kelvin in neutral, slow the revs down to 100 and drift past the moored boat, losing very little momentum.

I have often been thanked for slowing down, although the speed of the boat has hardly varied.

[Guest]

My technique is similar. I put the Kelvin in neutral, slow the revs down to 100 and drift past the moored boat, losing very little momentum.

I have often been thanked for slowing down, although the speed of the boat has hardly varied.

Interesting point, and I think it is a psychological to a large extent. I read about a guy who had a constant speed engine, and even though he slowed down for moored boats, he got moaned at frequently.

We are currently on the Oxford, it is peeing down, the bit of canal is narrow, and the boats are not slowing down much when passing us. We are moored with just bow and stern lines, gokart tyres for fenders, no springs on this occasion, and the boat barely moves when others pass.

I think a section of canal boaters would be more suited to the Caravan Club TBH. Pleased to say that the moaners are a small minority, and most people on the cut are brilliant. Been further South this time than ever, and the people are great. I take back everything I have said about Suverners

[Loafer]

My technique is similar. I put the Kelvin in neutral, slow the revs down to 100 and drift past the moored boat, losing very little momentum.

I have often been thanked for slowing down, although the speed of the boat has hardly varied.

 

Small point here - it isn't really the speed of the boat that pulls water out from under moored boats, its your prop, pushing it all backwards. Going past at 2+mph but having been in neutral for 50 yards won't usually drag out someone's water from under them. Even worse would be a really slow, heavy boat at high rpm, struggling to drag his big *rse through the mud - but if he didn't do that he'd probably grind to a halt.

 

Notice how quickly the water is moving backwards on both shores to your sides. The quicker it moves backwards, the shallower it is and the more difference it will make to the boat tied up just ahead of you.

 

I doesn't happen at Tixall, for example, which is why one poster said it didn't affect his moored boat at all. The more water there is available, the less it affects the grumpy.

 

Blither

Edited July 24, 2015 by Loafer

[Scholar Gypsy]

Quite agree, tickover is no guide at all. SA draws about 28" at the back and displaces about 23 tonnes, so we take it very slow on narrow and shallow waters, usually this means tickover but sometimes a bit more. Like others, I watch the effect on the boats I'm passing. We're on Tixall atm so boats are passing much faster with out any effect on us at all.

 

To get back to the original point, I have noticed more probs with speeding boats between Preston Brook and Middlewich which I put down to folk coming off the Bridgewater and not adjusting to the conditions. You see the same thing on canals that join river navigations.

 

Good point.

 

I have already clocked that I will need to watch my behaviour on the Chesterfield this summer - my first narrow canal for well over a year....

[mayalld]

Yes there is not much "passing at tickover" on the Bridgewater!

The whole "pass at tickover" is a nonsense for the many reasons that have been stated. There is no "one size fits all" in many boating situations.

 

In all the years on the cut, I can only think of a handful who have moaned about us passing too quickly, and the common denominator was that they all used a centre line (from the cabin roof) to moor their boats.

 

There are some people who were born to be offended, and even if you carried the boat past them, they would still find something to whine about. Happily they are a small minority.

 

Tickover as a hard and fast rule is indeed nonsense.

 

As a starting point from which to decide what is an appropriate speed, it is superb!

 

One should always pass moored boats as slowly as is required to prevent adverse effects.

 

If one starts from the view that this will be the slowest speed at which you can maintain steerage, then "tickover" is a useful shorthand for "slow right down as much as possible"

 

Where circumstances allow, and speed can be increased a little with no increase in the effect on moored boats then go for it.

 

However if the starting point is normal cruising speed and a little knocked off, this takes no account as to whether taking more speed off might be more considerate.

 

As soon as people start quoting numbers to PROVE they slowed down enough, it becomes extremely doubtful that they have.

 

"I slowed down to 2.3 mph, and still people complain"

 

In such cases, people are keen to emphasise that they are travelling at barely over HALF the speed limit, but they fail to grasp that at anything over 3mph, they will be creating a breaking wash, that their cruising speed is probably 2.9 mph, and that any measure of how much they have slowed against the speed limit is meaningless.

[Arthur Marshall]

 

In such cases, people are keen to emphasise that they are travelling at barely over HALF the speed limit, but they fail to grasp that at anything over 3mph, they will be creating a breaking wash, that their cruising speed is probably 2.9 mph, and that any measure of how much they have slowed against the speed limit is meaningless.

While a breaking wash would definitely be a signal to slow down, i certainly don't make one on the rare ocasions I do achieve 4mph - I average about 3 or a bit above and rarely show more than a ripple behind me. Again, every boat's different.

[cariad]

When the weather is like it is today i have noticed that there are more boaters go faster than they would normally.

Some boaters will moan no matter how slow you go, last year on the Kennet and Avon a person on the towpath asked

me to slow down because his boat was moored a couple of hundred yards away and was pegged into soft earth. My reply

was sure, but have you set springs, he didn't know what i was talking about. you just can't win sometimes.

[DHutch]

"Tickover" is such an arbitrary power setting that it is meaningless in the context of passing moored boats.

Having a steam engine we can beat that, by not having a tickover at all!

 

But yes, fully agree, and also agree that in the l&l the wider canal combined with a general acceptance people boating on it a reasonable folk who expect what boats there are to move, the speed you can pass is higher than in a the narrower ditches with less tolerance....

 

 

Daniel

[by'eck]

While a breaking wash would definitely be a signal to slow down, i certainly don't make one on the rare ocasions I do achieve 4mph - I average about 3 or a bit above and rarely show more than a ripple behind me. Again, every boat's different.

 

More particularly so is every canal or part thereof. With little water under and around a moving boat (narrow shallow section), the wake it creates will be amplified to a large degree and so felt by moored boats, and probably by others passing in the opposite direction. This is why its important to slow down on most canals when passing others travelling in opposite direction, a concept that seems lost to many.

 

A particular boat will always tend to move/push the same amount of water at any given speed. Its all about how much that effect is diluted by the surrounding mass of water.

[Guest]

 

More particularly so is every canal or part thereof. With little water under and around a moving boat (narrow shallow section), the wake it creates will be amplified to a large degree and so felt by moored boats, and probably by others passing in the opposite direction. This is why its important to slow down on most canals when passing others travelling in opposite direction, a concept that seems lost to many.

 

A particular boat will always tend to move/push the same amount of water at any given speed. Its all about how much that effect is diluted by the surrounding mass of water.

Indeed.

[GUMPY]

Slow down for oncoming boats?

By that I hope you mean just knock it back a touch rather than slow right down.

If you slow right down for oncoming boats then you will get into trouble.

 

ETA I do knock it back a touch but no more saves ending up in the bushes

Edited July 24, 2015 by Loddon

[Detling]

I suspect slowing down to pass has only become the 'rule' since the 1980's The Guys and Gals who drove their boats for a living would have a huge belly laugh at the thought.

 

Yes I do slow down as I respect peoples wishes, but unless moored on pins it should not matter if you are correctly moored.

[b0atman]

I find mooring on pins is usually better than Haphazardly placed rings and bollards.