Jump to content
Strawberry Orange Banana Lime Leaf Slate Sky Blueberry Grape Watermelon Chocolate Marble
Strawberry Orange Banana Lime Leaf Slate Sky Blueberry Grape Watermelon Chocolate Marble
alan_fincher

Historic Boats for sale online

Featured Posts

44 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Me too, but buying Tycho would generate an awful conundrum.

 

Do I keep the boat authentic and carry on paying extra licence and mooring fees and cruising about with the massive and redundant ice ram impediment? Or cut it off and store it in the hold (so the next owner can weld it back on again) thus making it a better boat in all ways and suffer almost universal condemnation from the armchair rivet counting brigade?

 

I wouldn't mind betting this is putting off more than just me as a potential buyer. 

The ice ram would have had its uses trying to navigate through Brownsover (Rugby) just now!

 

I think anybody who bought the boat and cut it off would find themselves pilloried, (rightly in my view).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

I think anybody who bought the boat and cut it off would find themselves pilloried, (rightly in my view).

 

My view too, which is why I won't be buying it. And is prolly why no-one will ever buy it unless stoopid cheap. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If my Granny were alive and I could sell her I'd buy Tycho in anticipation of The Granny market being bullish.

I for one would never relieve The Ice Ram of tycho, let alone the other way round. 

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

My view too, which is why I won't be buying it. And is prolly why no-one will ever buy it unless stoopid cheap. 

 

 

You could sell the ice ram to Alan to fit on Sickle.

 

Would have been handy at Alvecote on the weekend, you could have rammed us out the way rather than stopping behind us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Rob-M said:

You could sell the ice ram to Alan to fit on Sickle.

Strangely it wouldn't really fit though.

 

Sextans and Tycho had their ram supported in a significantly different way from Sickle and Theophilus.

 

The ice ram actually replaced the Northwich stem post, so the only proper way for one boat to "donate" it to another should involve a lot of rivet removal and re-riveting, rather than a gas axe, and an awful lot of welding.

AFAIK they are solid steel approaching a couple of inches thick, so I am assuming welding a cut off one onto  another stem so that it is strong as it was designed to be would probably be one very large welding task.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only boat of the four so converted that retains it ice ram. Why cut off 77yrs of history? It's special, now unique.

 

The Petter has been in for 61yrs, a lot longer than the original RN. Whilst some would get rid of the Blue Tops, the space beneath has headroom and would make useful accommodation sensibly done.

 

396669548_Sketch16(Medium).JPG.43ba0a2ab03099dad77287c49e250718.JPG

 

900114363_Sketch17(Medium).JPG.ba6f948baf0d8de055e7faeead116abf.JPG

 

These were just sketches - they were not built.

 

248702034_TYCHOcameo1582.jpg.9ec8b90541630c31f40423818f30ab11.jpg

828194460_TYCHOcameo2583.jpg.387bd10e156c2a2a95e18aabbb2a95f6.jpg

 

1986830961_TYCHOcameo1584.jpg.490e725bd0a15a322875d01361c6cb1a.jpg

 

60378089_115jBuckbyGeneral202(Medium).jpg.8846ed4aad56448e9bf1b25628a51a97.jpg

 

My boat. As was : -

 

296144688_037dGeneral238.jpg.d7d20a55ad15193b8df8394933f719d9.jpg

Edited by Derek R.
Added text

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no intention of buy this or any other historic boat but I find the conversation interesting. Most people interested in historic boats wouldn't think twice about chopping a cabin conversion off to make the boat "Original" but no one would chop this conversion off to make it "Original"  

  • Greenie 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I have no intention of buy this or any other historic boat but I find the conversation interesting. Most people interested in historic boats wouldn't think twice about chopping a cabin conversion off to make the boat "Original" but no one would chop this conversion off to make it "Original"  

 

A very good point.

 

Chopping out 25ft of hold and adding the ice ram certainly massively corrupted the original boat.

 

Getting rid of the ice ram and putting the hold back would be a very responsible thing to do, given the drive for originality in historics these days....

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fore end looks like it was a BCN day boat.  I don't think it was originally a Bantock, or a Harris Bros boat, but someone who knows will be along soon no doubt.

 

N

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mike Tee said:

This one has come up again -

https://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/narrow-boats-traditional/586824

 

No history mentioned, other than '57'6" historic riveted working boat'

The photo's show it called Triumph which in my reference book lists it as a BCN day boat

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

I have no intention of buy this or any other historic boat but I find the conversation interesting. Most people interested in historic boats wouldn't think twice about chopping a cabin conversion off to make the boat "Original" but no one would chop this conversion off to make it "Original"  

 

3 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

A very good point.

 

Chopping out 25ft of hold and adding the ice ram certainly massively corrupted the original boat.

 

Getting rid of the ice ram and putting the hold back would be a very responsible thing to do, given the drive for originality in historics these days....

 

On the other hand...

 

The boats are now 83 years old.  Sextans, Sickle, Theophilus and Tycho spent no more than 6 or 7 years as full length carrying boats, whereas they have spent something like 67 years as shortened boats.  Sextans has actually been progressively relengthened, first with part of another Middle Northwich, and latterly with new steel. but the other three remain as they have been for way over 90% of their existence.

 

There are literally dozens of full length Grand Union motors, most, (but not all) of which have stayed in one piece from the 1930s until now.  There are probably too many to guarantee suitable custodians for all time, particularly as many of the potential custodians get older and older.  Good examples of boats like "Birmingham" remain unsold after a year, so currently anybody with the cash who wants a full length Grand Union motor could have one.

The three "Middle Northwich" ice boats that retain their originally shortened length are very special, and living examples of practical steps taken in the war to keep other boats moving.

It would be travesty to lengthen any more of them, or indeed to savage the one surviving ice ram.

On the other hand surviving examples of unconverted Stewarts and Lloyds day boats become rarer and rarer, whereas there are any number of them shortened and motorised with a cabin conversion.  I think there really is a case for restoring Reginald to carrying condition!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

Sextans, Sickle, Theophilus and Tycho spent no more than 6 or 7 years as full length carrying boats, whereas they have spent something like 67 years as shortened boats.  Sextans has actually been progressively relengthened, first with part of another Middle Northwich, and latterly with new steel. but the other three remain as they have been for way over 90% of their existence.

 

Theophilus hasn't looked quite like this for 90% of its existence

20180827_131703.jpg

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 

 

On the other hand...

 

The boats are now 83 years old.  Sextans, Sickle, Theophilus and Tycho spent no more than 6 or 7 years as full length carrying boats, whereas they have spent something like 67 years as shortened boats.  Sextans has actually been progressively relengthened, first with part of another Middle Northwich, and latterly with new steel. but the other three remain as they have been for way over 90% of their existence.

 

There are literally dozens of full length Grand Union motors, most, (but not all) of which have stayed in one piece from the 1930s until now.  There are probably too many to guarantee suitable custodians for all time, particularly as many of the potential custodians get older and older.  Good examples of boats like "Birmingham" remain unsold after a year, so currently anybody with the cash who wants a full length Grand Union motor could have one.

The three "Middle Northwich" ice boats that retain their originally shortened length are very special, and living examples of practical steps taken in the war to keep other boats moving.

It would be travesty to lengthen any more of them, or indeed to savage the one surviving ice ram.

On the other hand surviving examples of unconverted Stewarts and Lloyds day boats become rarer and rarer, whereas there are any number of them shortened and motorised with a cabin conversion.  I think there really is a case for restoring Reginald to carrying condition!

 

 

So, I take it you'll be putting an ice ram back on SICKLE sometime pretty soon then, eh?

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

So, I take it you'll be putting an ice ram back on SICKLE sometime pretty soon then, eh?

Nope,

We are not exactly sure how long it was there, but almost certainly no more than 15 years.  It went on to do at least 43 years of active work for "Waterways" without it.

It is restored in line with how it spent the vast majority of its working life.

4 hours ago, David Mack said:

 

Theophilus hasn't looked quite like this for 90% of its existence

20180827_131703.jpg

 

 

I was only talking about the length!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

A very good point.

 

Chopping out 25ft of hold and adding the ice ram certainly massively corrupted the original boat.

 

Getting rid of the ice ram and putting the hold back would be a very responsible thing to do, given the drive for originality in historics these days....

 

 

 

 

 

This is a wind up, but also literally and totally wrong as some clown will possibly take it as being serious.

 

TYCHO was six years off the builders yard when the MOW(T) ordered four Middle Northwich boats that were at that time unused due to crew shortages, and made into Ice boats. Their requirement was to keep the waterways open, an essential fact at the time when Winters were hard and ice had to be broken. These boats were not "corrupted" - they were adapted for a new role. TYCHO has been in that adapted format for 77yrs - that is its history.

 

Elsewhere others have stated that the so called 'space invader' cabins should be kept citing RADIANT as one example of changes, hideous as it looks to me with patches and bodges to accommodate a gas bottle. SICKLE had a 'space invader', and PYTHON retains its changed cabin.

 

THEOPHILUS cabin whilst long lived, was in an awful condition, something needed to be done with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

 

 

There are literally dozens of full length Grand Union motors, most, (but not all) of which have stayed in one piece from the 1930s until now.  There are probably too many to guarantee suitable custodians for all time, particularly as many of the potential custodians get older and older.  Good examples of boats like "Birmingham" remain unsold after a year, so currently anybody with the cash who wants a full length Grand Union motor could have one.

 

When those of us who brought the GUCC motors and Buttys from bwb in the 60’ and 70’s we thought we would probably be the last idiots to take on these boats and keep them going but as is apparent there have been plenty of people who have followed us and the current custodians are doing a better job than most of us managed back then. I’m sure others will be along.

  • Greenie 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ANVIL

 

https://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/bantock-bros-57-butty/616901

 

Confusingly there are two B.C.N. day boat conversions called ANVIL, and both converted at about the same time and both have Lister engines. Fortunately these conversions are quite different in their construction as one retains both of its original ends and is fitted with anti-cavitation plates whereas the other has a welded counter stern :captain:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.