A plea to dog owners on the cut (and general)

[haggis]

I think Covid has a lot to answer for. People who had never had a dog before bought one as "it would be nice to have company when taking our exercise". Because of Covid many dog training establishments were not open and the result is a lot of dogs who don't know the boundaries and behave badly. These "new" owners seem to think that is OK dog behaviour.  We live in an area popular with dog walkers and we see a lot of this. 

Re dog licences. While I agree that it might help how would it be enforced? Responsible dog owners would buy them but others probably wouldn't bother. The Police have no time to do all their duties now so how would they cope with checking for licences? Vets as a profession decided not to check for microchips so who would do the checking? No point in introducing dog licences unless there is some method of making people comply. 

[Tony Brooks]

7 minutes ago, haggis said:

I think Covid has a lot to answer for. People who had never had a dog before bought one as "it would be nice to have company when taking our exercise". Because of Covid many dog training establishments were not open and the result is a lot of dogs who don't know the boundaries and behave badly. These "new" owners seem to think that is OK dog behaviour.  We live in an area popular with dog walkers and we see a lot of this. 

Re dog licences. While I agree that it might help how would it be enforced? Responsible dog owners would buy them but others probably wouldn't bother. The Police have no time to do all their duties now so how would they cope with checking for licences? Vets as a profession decided not to check for microchips so who would do the checking? No point in introducing dog licences unless there is some method of making people comply. 

 

That argument is true of all laws, and it seems our police can decide what laws to try to enforce and what to ignore. At least if licences and chipping were mandatory, an occasional blitz on an area with un-chipped or unlicensed animals put down would get the message out. I would even go as far as requiring the RSPCA, Cats Protection League, and similar animal centred charities be required to carry out such work so they can deal with the owners and prevent the destruction of the animals. if the government really wanted to crack down, they could introduce a roving squad of checkers and enforces, set the licence fee high enough to pay for it.

 

Vets are required to carry out all sorts of tasks, such as notifying the ministry of certain diseases. If the law required them to check for chips, then they would or face disciplinary action.

[haggis]

At present the law states that all dogs must be microchipped by the breeder before being sold and I know that the SSPCA, RSPCA and Dog Trust make sure every dog they rehome is microchipped yet we still see posts about dogs being found and not having a microchip. It is all very well introducing laws but unless there is a means of reinforcing them, they are a waste of time. 

[magnetman]

A few months ago the Met police descended on the towpath right opposite my London boat and shot two dogs. Quite gory. At one stage one of the dogs was dragging the dead one along the towpath with a streak of blood.

We were out at the time fortunately as would not have wanted the kids to see it. Bizarrely I was discussing the dangerous dog problem with brother in law at exactly the same time it happened. I think I manifested this outcome. 

 

Anyway there is a shrine for dangerous dogs rights and a continuous procession of terrible scum come to pay their respects to the poor animals. American bulldogs I think they were but being fair the bloke did have them under control. 

 

The police did a bit of a bodgy job (7 coppers 2 with guns on a 4ft wide path 3ft above the water) at the time but no it isn't acceptable to have intimidating dogs in public. It is illegal to put someone else in a fearful state with a dog. 

If more of these dogs were killed it would be a Good Thing as it might help with the messaging.

 

 

 

 

[MIKE P]

17 hours ago, magnetman said:

Yes this is what the handling poles do isn't it. There is a noose at the end which is tightened down. The mouth opens and also you deprive the animal of oxygen so it shuts down. 

 

12 bore might be better but could cause problems later. 

just wondering how to use handling pole if the dog already has something in its mouth, slide it over it's rear end maybe?

[restlessnomad]

Since the story broke, the internet is full of 'my dog wont hurt a fly, its the owners/breeders never the dog' from dog moms and dads.

 

[Naughty Cal]

3 hours ago, M_JG said:

 

The dog of course. I find it intruiging the number of people who allow their kids to approach our dog to stroke him without checking first. As it happens hes OK but how can they be sure?

We have this a lot when we are out walking Syd. Kids just run up to him and we have had them cuddle him!

 

Fortunately he is fine with kids but it really is up to the parents of children to teach them how to behave around dogs. 

 

 

Syd is on his lead most of the time that we are out on walks because he isn't very good with most other dogs. We only let him off if we are certain that there are no other dogs around which really isn't all that often. He is ball obsessed so can be let off to chase a ball but we don't like doing that too often with him.

[Ray T]

20 hours ago, Ray T said:

Although the marina where we moor has a "all dogs on lead" policy there are one or two owners who appear to think the rule does not apply to them. Earlier this year an out-of-control spaniel bit our dog on the back. Fortunately, our dog was wearing a coat so her skin was not damaged. All I got was "Oh - he's usually friendly." Yes right! No apology.

I reported this incident to the office.

 Further to this a fellow Moorer has informed me said dog and owner have been ejected from the marina due to the owner's refusal to put the dog on a lead and the problems thus caused.

Justice is served. 😀

I do feel sorry for the dog though.

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Ray T

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Ray T said:

 Further to this a fellow Moorer has informed me said dog and owner have been ejected from the marina due to the owner's refusal to put the dog on a lead and the problems the dog caused.

Justice is served. 😀

I do feel sorry for the dog though.

 

We were out in Charlestown with the dog the other day as I was paying for parking another owner allowed her dog to approach ours by letting its lead extend.

 

It was being really friendly and I heard the owner say 'oh thats surprising' obviously she was not used to her dog being friendly with other dogs. She had hardly got the words out when her dog snapped at Simon's face.

 

Needless to say, 'Words' were had....

[Mad Harold]

22 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

Maybe true, but what happens when you let go as that dog is going to be very cross with you……. 

Old proverb (don't know where from)

'He who has a Tiger by the tail, can't let go'

[cuthound]

On 21/09/2023 at 16:27, LadyG said:

I told a pair of men to put their dogs on a lead after they had chased my cat up tree. They did not even have leads, these were quite big dogs and obviously did exactly what they wanted. 

For those who want to know how to kill a dog which has taken hold,  take the front leg and put it at right angles to the heart. I haven't tried this, I'd go for throwing in the canal, but if they don't have a collar it's going to be difficult.

Throwing a coat over their heads would be my first approach.

 

With the current publicity surrounding out of control large dogs, I asked my dog's trainer how to get the attacking dog off should one attack my dog.

 

She said to grab the attacking dog by it's rear legs and hoist it off the ground.

 

Given Bully XL's weigh 60kg or more I'm not sure that I could lift one and in any case would then be worried that the dog's gnashers would be dangerously close to my crown jewels!

 

 

 

On 21/09/2023 at 16:57, tree monkey said:

Not sure I would want to try it

 

First choice would be grab collar and twist, hard, it's worked twice for me, once on a doberman and once on a staffy type 

 

This could well work.

 

When I had my reactive rescue GSD, Zeus, a staffie attacked him whilst he as on his lead whilst we were on a pack walk with a local dog walker. Somehow Zeus managed to grab the staffie's collar and the staffie twisted around and then lost consciousness. I thought he had killed it, but the dog walker blew up the staffie's nose and fortunately it came round with no ill effects.

Edited September 22, 2023 by cuthound
To insert spaces between merged posts

[D Ash]

With the current publicity surrounding out of control large dogs, I asked my dog's trainer how to get the attacking dog off should one attack my dog.

 

She said to grab the attacking dog by it's rear legs and hoist it off the ground.

 

Given Bully XL's weigh 60kg or more I'm not sure that I could lift one and in any case would then be worried that the dog's gnashers would be dangerously close to my crown jewels!

 

But you eventually have to release the dog from this position, and what will it then do to you?

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Too many pets are dogs, 

too many dogs are handbag accessories,

too many dogs,

 

And why is ‘dogging’ called ‘dogging’?

Are dogs involved?

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Goliath

[mrsmelly]

15 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

With the current publicity surrounding out of control large dogs, I asked my dog's trainer how to get the attacking dog off should one attack my dog.

 

She said to grab the attacking dog by it's rear legs and hoist it off the ground.

 

Given Bully XL's weigh 60kg or more I'm not sure that I could lift one and in any case would then be worried that the dog's gnashers would be dangerously close to my crown jewels!

 

 

 

 

This could well work.

 

When I had my reactive rescue GSD, Zeus, a staffie attacked him whilst he as on his lead whilst we were on a pack walk with a local dog walker. Somehow Zeus managed to grab the staffie's collar and the staffie twisted around and then lost consciousness. I thought he had killed it, but the dog walker blew up the staffie's nose and fortunately it came round with no ill effects.

Many moons ago as a young bobby during one evening doing battle as always with drunks etc in a Yorkshire town centre a particularily big, nasty, well known thug was battering people. He was a huge powerful nasty piece of work and was repeatedly told to desist but would not and had to be arrested!! We got the local dog out which usualy in fact had always stopped eejuts in their tracks it was an Alsation, I think the modern name is German Shepherd which we never called them. Any way it did its stuff and got hold of the said eejut who it sunk its teeth into. Said eejut got hold of the dog with his huge hands and strangled it until it passed out!! I dont need to tell you what I thought at the time. Any way reinforcements arrived and he was duly arrested and the dog survived. Those were the days 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Many moons ago as a young bobby during one evening doing battle as always with drunks etc in a Yorkshire town centre a particularily big, nasty, well known thug was battering people. He was a huge powerful nasty piece of work and was repeatedly told to desist but would not and had to be arrested!! We got the local dog out which usualy in fact had always stopped eejuts in their tracks it was an Alsation, I think the modern name is German Shepherd which we never called them. Any way it did its stuff and got hold of the said eejut who it sunk its teeth into. Said eejut got hold of the dog with his huge hands and strangled it until it passed out!! I dont need to tell you what I thought at the time. Any way reinforcements arrived and he was duly arrested and the dog survived. Those were the days 

 

On one of 'fly on the wall' police programs recently a police dog had a guy by the crotch...he was screaming 'its got me by the balls' like a baby..

 

The handler was heard to say 'well to be fair its painful enough being grabbed by one of our dogs, but being grabbed by the nuts is another level'......🤣🤣🤣

[restlessnomad]

14 minutes ago, D Ash said:

With the current publicity surrounding out of control large dogs, I asked my dog's trainer how to get the attacking dog off should one attack my dog.

 

She said to grab the attacking dog by it's rear legs and hoist it off the ground.

 

Given Bully XL's weigh 60kg or more I'm not sure that I could lift one and in any case would then be worried that the dog's gnashers would be dangerously close to my crown jewels!

 

But you eventually have to release the dog from this position, and what will it then do to you?

people on internet say the only way to stop such big dog attacking is to chock them(either by twisting the collar or a using your arm), and wait for them to pass out. they are usually back on feet within a few minutes disoriented, so you need to escape within that time.

[mrsmelly]

1 minute ago, M_JG said:

 

On one of 'fly on the wall' police programs recently a police dog had a guy by the crotch...he was screaming 'its got me by the balls' like a baby..

 

The handler was heard to say 'well to be fair its painful enough being grabbed by one of our dogs, but being grabbed by the nuts is another level'......🤣🤣🤣

On evening and night shifts we used to pray for the " Best bobby in the World " to appear.

The best Bobby in the World was, as it was called in the job the rain. If it peed it down the drunks legged it home/got lifts etc etc rather than congregating in the streets looking for trouble.

[cuthound]

23 hours ago, haggis said:

I read a well researched article recently about Bully dogs and apparently the reason why they suddenly become aggressive and attack other dogs and people is because of a gene many inherit

 There was a dog , Rambo, in America which had been aggressive but because he had the heavy build which was sought after he was used at stud indiscriminately and in fact his sperm was frozen and is still being used. There was even breeding with close relatives - brother/sister,  father / daughter etc which increased the chance of a dog having this gene

 When the breed was imported to the UK about 2014 the dogs brought in had the Rambo gene and because there were not so many of the breed in this country there was much close relative breeding. 

Research has shown that this gene can cause a dog which is normally placid to suddenly see red and attack.

When I see photos of children with one of these dogs my blood  runs cold after reading this well researched article.

 

Yes I read that article too. The "aggressive gene, A22, is shared with Belgian Malinois and their breeders are trying to breed the gene out. However owners who don't train their dogs (or dont know how to) and don't understand the breed don't help as this too can cause aggressiveness.

 

Personally I would like see all prospective dog owners have to pass a mandatory test on the theory of dog behaviours, training and ownership before being awarded a "provisional" licence, which would allow them to buy a dog. They would then have to take the dog to mandatory training lessons. When the owner and dog have reached a predetermined level of training a "full" dog licence would be awarded. Finally when the dog dies, the owners licence reverts to provisional, to allow him to buy another dog and undertake training with it to gain the "full" licence.

 

This idea could also usefully be applied to having children as well...

 

It both cases it would save a lot of heartache

[magnetman]

Virtually impossible to enforce. Making cyclists have insurance would be easier but also virtually impossible.

 

More incidents of police shooting dogs might be helpful. 

 

 

Not all that convinced about the rozzers shooting kids but ... well ... errr. 

 

Anyway!

[LadyG]

8 hours ago, haggis said:

At present the law states that all dogs must be microchipped by the breeder before being sold and I know that the SSPCA, RSPCA and Dog Trust make sure every dog they rehome is microchipped yet we still see posts about dogs being found and not having a microchip. It is all very well introducing laws but unless there is a means of reinforcing them, they are a waste of time. 

If someone tries to sell you a dog that has not been microchipped, you walk away.

If you take a dog to a vet he will not treat it until or unless is microchipped, so eventually the message will get through.

But there are idiots, my neighbours drove to a traveller site, paid £800, the pup had that disease and was sheeting everywhere, so she bought it a chrome cage from vet £80, on the advice of the vet who would not allow it in to  surgery..

The pedigree was writ on lined paper out an exercise book.

Edited September 22, 2023 by LadyG

[Alan de Enfield]

22 hours ago, Ken X said:

As one of those strange people who take cats on hire boats we often encounter dogs being walked whilst we are walking our cat. 

 

To be fair, almost all owners are either walking with their dog on a lead or quickly put it on when they clock our cat.

 

If the cat is on the deck it tends to inflate itself if a dog gets too interested and can get very vocal which usually puts the dog off investigating further.

 

The only time in over forty years we had a dog board the boat after our cat was on the rear of a trad stern. The present Mrs X was sitting on the rear steps and it tried to climb over her after the cat.  Cue a very large splash as said dog was swiftly propelled into the cut.  The owners view was that the dog deserved it which was fortunate. 🙂

 

 

 

We often moored in the very same (give or take a few feet) spot .........................

 

 

 

[magnetman]

Microchips are interesting..

 

I was always intrigued by it as they appear to be linked to a subscription service.

 

One day after having my dog for about a decade (battersea dogs home microchipped in 1989) I asked a vet about it. He did get a serial number but there was no reference to her being my bitch. 

 

Maybe its different these days but someone somewhere is going to want paying to keep the database live. 

 

 

 

A .gov service would be useful but does it exist? 

[haggis]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

If someone tries to sell you a dog that has not been microchipped, you walk away.

If you take a dog to a vet he will not treat it until or unless is microchipped, so eventually the message will get through.

But there are idiots, my neighbours drove to a traveller site, paid £800, the pup had that disease and was sheeting everywhere, so she bought is a cage, on the advice of the vet 

The pedigree was writ on lined paper out an exercise book.

It would be good if vets wouldn't treat a dog which hadn't been microchipped but I have never heard that before. Or are you suggesting that this should happen. Not sure from your post 😀

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Microchips are interesting..

 

I was always intrigued by it as they appear to be linked to a subscription service.

 

One day after having my dog for about a decade (battersea dogs home microchipped in 1989) I asked a vet about it. He did get a serial number but there was no reference to her being my bitch. 

 

Maybe its different these days but someone somewhere is going to want paying to keep the database live. 

 

 

 

A .gov service would be useful but does it exist? 

It is up to the new owner to update the microchip record when they acquire a dog from a breeder or rescue centre. 

[mrsmelly]

3 minutes ago, haggis said:

It would be good if vets wouldn't treat a dog which hadn't been microchipped but I have never heard that before. Or are you suggesting that this should happen. Not sure from your post 😀

I disagree, if the poor dog needs treatment its not its fault its not chipped.

[LadyG]

2 minutes ago, haggis said:

It would be good if vets wouldn't treat a dog which hadn't been microchipped but I have never heard that before. Or are you suggesting that this should happen. Not sure from your post 😀

My local vet practice in Scotland ,part of a large group had this ruling , not sure if it's a Law.