£300 million in ten years

[Boaty Jo]

Here for civil works on 1,582 locks, 55 tunnels, 2,790 bridges and 71 reservoirs.  

 

This is in addition to £500 million complex civil engineering deal already awarded.

 

The future's bright?? 

[Tonka]

40 minutes ago, Boaty Jo said:

Here for civil works on 1,582 locks, 55 tunnels, 2,790 bridges and 71 reservoirs.  

 

This is in addition to £500 million complex civil engineering deal already awarded.

 

The future's bright?? 

The futures orange

[BEngo]

It might be the amount of money that ought to be spent, but it will be unusual if CRT actually expect to spend it.

 

Contracts like these are commonly let on the premise that the Contractor is bidding loadsamoney  prices for loadsa work and might well be naive enough to underbid the cost of smaller jobs as a consequence.   The headline is always "up to £xxx million"  .  The reality is usually the client  will spend £× or £×× million on the framework.

 

The Contractors are not as green as they may be cabbage looking.  They know that if they bid low margins for the detailed stuff from the client they can make it up on the 'extras' which the client has not specified.  Once they are on a job they will not lose it and if something is extra to framework then it will be done at profitable day rates, or priced in what is now a non- competitive environment.

 

N

[Jen-in-Wellies]

36 minutes ago, Tonka said:

The futures orange

Only at the north end of the Harecastle Tunnel.

[Hudds Lad]

Its quite cunning, as it doesn’t actually say what exactly the contracts ARE working on. It says enough to cover all eventualities, and then throws you off by listing things the network is made of. Theres so much spin in press releases these days you can’t take anything at face value  

 

“Amco, Breheny, CPC Civils, Forkers, Jacksons, Land and Water, and Onsite will be carrying out a suite of projects that will improve the experience for local communities, boaters and visitors, enabling more people to experience the benefits of spending time by the water.

The new contracts will cover 1,582 locks, 55 tunnels, 2,970 bridges, 281 aqueducts and 71 reservoirs.”

[GUMPY]

£300 million over 10 years 

That's £30m a year

Small change when you consider just the backlog of works was over £100m a year when cart took over, god knows what it is now.

 

[David Mack]

35 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

Its quite cunning, as it doesn’t actually say what exactly the contracts ARE working on. It says enough to cover all eventualities, and then throws you off by listing things the network is made of. Theres so much spin in press releases these days you can’t take anything at face value  

How could it be otherwise? CRT's maintenance programme is set annually, and has to be amended in the light of the changing condition of the infrastructure, availability of funding and unexpected failures. Having framework contractors on board allows for resources to be mobilised (and stood down) as and when required, without the need for a full procurement process for each piece of work.

[Ronaldo47]

46 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

..... enabling more people to experience the benefits of spending time by the water.

 

Note:  "BY" the water, not "ON" the water. 

[Hudds Lad]

7 minutes ago, David Mack said:

How could it be otherwise? CRT's maintenance programme is set annually, and has to be amended in the light of the changing condition of the infrastructure, availability of funding and unexpected failures. Having framework contractors on board allows for resources to be mobilised (and stood down) as and when required, without the need for a full procurement process for each piece of work.

Is it for maintenance though? It says “suite of projects” which could just as easily be developing CRT-owned canalside land into more property for their portfolio as it could be replacing lock gates etc. Perhaps i’m reading too much between the lines, but you can’t tell me they don’t have form for obfuscation.

[David Mack]

It's for civil engineering works. The original press release, from which the linked article was written, is on CRT's website. 

[robtheplod]

Maybe its the cynic in me but I've heard so much 'we're gonna spend squillions' on x/y/z and it usually falls flat... I'm now of the mindset in looking back and saying 'that was well spent' ...

[IanD]

1 hour ago, Loddon said:

£300 million over 10 years 

That's £30m a year

Small change when you consider just the backlog of works was over £100m a year when cart took over, god knows what it is now.

 

Even when you add the other £500M to get £800M over 10 years, that's £80M a year for "civil engineering works" -- which is presumably part of the existing £200M/year CART budget.

 

I don't know whether the backlog was £100M or £100M/yr, but either way this isn't going to fix it since it just looks like the existing (inadequate) budget, not anything extra... 😞

[Boaty Jo]

2 hours ago, IanD said:

Even when you add the other £500M to get £800M over 10 years, that's £80M a year for "civil engineering works" -- which is presumably part of the existing £200M/year CART budget.

 

I don't know whether the backlog was £100M or £100M/yr, but either way this isn't going to fix it since it just looks like the existing (inadequate) budget, not anything extra... 😞

Considering the state of the nations general finances, surely anything is a bonus! The canal system, historic as it is, is not everyone's priority.

[IanD]

Just now, Boaty Jo said:

Considering the state of the nations general finances, surely anything is a bonus! The canal system, historic as it is, is not everyone's priority.

 

Yes, but if I understand the press release correctly this isn't any new or extra money for canal infrastructure, it's just that £80M/yr out of CARTs existing budget has been awarded to contractors to do the work -- presumably either replacing existing contractors, or renewing contracts. We don't even know if this is more, less or the same as is being spent today.

 

So it's non-news dressed up as boosterish news. Sounds familiar, doesn't it? 😞

[oboat]

On 01/09/2022 at 09:20, Loddon said:

£300 million over 10 years 

That's £30m a year

Small change when you consider just the backlog of works was over £100m a year when cart took over, god knows what it is now.

 

I do get sick of this reporting stile which now seems to be so common place. No Fact check just re-print the CRT press release! The report could say, Only $30 million or just under 4 fish passes per year!

[ditchcrawler]

More from the New Civil Engineer https://www.newcivilengineer.com/latest/interview-canal-river-trusts-malcolm-horne-on-the-balance-between-safety-and-historical-asset-preservation-24-10-2022/?fbclid=IwAR3pAfOEZTMPtqpy4eHKJ6RtxmIalFJLCY6rHGD9GRGuvWsaHDix2gOBYBY

[matty40s]

I saw that yesterday, and after ploughing through the usual CRT gumph, was concerned about this bit...

Now he is focused on how to take the trust on “a journey of more innovation and greater efficiency”.

He adds: “Part of my role is to find ways to repurpose our canals to both maintain their heritage but also lean in to help us for the future.

 

Nowhere does he mention maintaining or improving navigation.

[IanD]

9 minutes ago, matty40s said:

I saw that yesterday, and after ploughing through the usual CRT gumph, was concerned about this bit...

 

Now he is focused on how to take the trust on “a journey of more innovation and greater efficiency”.

He adds: “Part of my role is to find ways to repurpose our canals to both maintain their heritage but also lean in to help us for the future.

 

Nowhere does he mention maintaining or improving navigation.

 

If you read the article there's not a single mention of navigation or boats or boaters anywhere in it... 😞

 

"A key balance the charity must strike is how to sensitively upgrade structures to meet modern day safety standards, while protecting their heritage and embracing the roles the canal can play in terms of climate resilience, nature and biodiversity, connecting rural and urban spaces as well as heating and cooling."

[Arthur Marshall]

1 hour ago, matty40s said:

I saw that yesterday, and after ploughing through the usual CRT gumph, was concerned about this bit...

 

Now he is focused on how to take the trust on “a journey of more innovation and greater efficiency”.

He adds: “Part of my role is to find ways to repurpose our canals to both maintain their heritage but also lean in to help us for the future.

 

Nowhere does he mention maintaining or improving navigation.

Quite a few of them got repurposed a while back. They built railways on them.

Then they repurposed the railways into cycle tracks.

I wonder what they have in mind...

[GUMPY]

45 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Quite a few of them got repurposed a while back. They built railways on them.

Then they repurposed the railways into cycle tracks.

I wonder what they have in mind...

That's exactly what happened to The Rolle Canal.

Having said that there is a proposal to bring trains back to The Tarka Line

[MtB]

4 hours ago, matty40s said:

I saw that yesterday, and after ploughing through the usual CRT gumph, was concerned about this bit...

 

Now he is focused on how to take the trust on “a journey of more innovation and greater efficiency”.

He adds: “Part of my role is to find ways to repurpose our canals to both maintain their heritage but also lean in to help us for the future.

 

Nowhere does he mention maintaining or improving navigation.

 

Well quite. You're not understanding the code.

 

What he means is "Bricking up all the locks and cancelling what's left of our dredging schedule and getting rid of boats, supports fish stocks for the maggot-drowners to persecute, and aids bio-diversity in general at near zero cost to CRT. What's not to like?"