Richard10002 Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Mike the Boilerman said: But anyway I know you can 'out-pedant' me with ease, so I'll give way now and agree, yes you are right.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 18 minutes ago, Richard10002 said: This is drifting a bit - no worries on that score but I thought I should let the early responders (thanks again) know that I am still alive. The batteries were all about 11C this morning and I am just putting a battery in my clamp meter before investigating further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 An update. The batteries have been charging for about three hours now. There is no smell of gas. The interconnects show the same current on each although there is one which I cannot get to with the clamp meter. Three are still at about 11C, one at about 14C and the final one at 22C. This is using the infra-red thermometer, by hand there is little temperature difference noticeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 1 hour ago, frahkn said: An update. The batteries have been charging for about three hours now. There is no smell of gas. The interconnects show the same current on each although there is one which I cannot get to with the clamp meter. Three are still at about 11C, one at about 14C and the final one at 22C. This is using the infra-red thermometer, by hand there is little temperature difference noticeable. Is the one at 14*C next to (touching) the one at 22*C ? Monitor the one at 22*C if it gets any hotter take it out of the bank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markinaboat Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 17 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said: £55, order tonight, free delivery Tuesday. 24th https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-110AH-LEISURE-BATTERY-HEAVY-DUTY-LOW-HEIGHT-100-AH-AMP-110-AMP-DUAL-PURP/301581095653?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D60698%26meid%3D420c9a7c384b464194b0a0cff965c054%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dsb%26sd%3D202690470212%26itm%3D301581095653%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Deep-Cycle-Leisure-Battery-12V-100AH-SB-S100-Caravan-Motorhome-Marine-Boat/202690470212?epid=9034190477&hash=item2f314b2144:g:0N8AAOSwjQ5c6vVc https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Deep-Cycle-Leisure-Battery-12V-110AH-SB-LM110-Caravan-Motorhome-Marine-Boat/191393651830?hash=item2c8ff35c76:g:nPYAAOSwopRYiiK9 They even offer some useful guidelines : Leisure Battery Care & Maintenance: SuperBatt leisure batteries are manufactured to the very highest of standards, but to get the very best performance, and longevity out of your batteries it is well worth following a simple care and maintenance program: Always recharge your battery as soon as you can after use after discharge and keep it as fully charged as possible during long periods of in-activity. Please must use Continual Automatic chargers with these batteries such as NUMAX 12V 10A DC Fully Automatic Intelligent Connect & Forget Leisure Battery charger can be left attached to the battery for long periods and will look after your battery at correct state of charge until you need it next. Avoid completely discharging your battery (Below 10.5V) as this will reduce its cyclic lifespan. When the battery is out of the caravan/motor-homes etc., always store it in a cool, dry and well ventilated place. From time to time make sure the terminals are free from dust and dirt, and all connections are sound. Please must not use Trickle charge with these batteries. An equalizing charge for a 12volt battery required that it be charged with a voltage of at least 14.4 volts for a period of at least one hour once a month, or every 10 discharge cycles. An equalizing charge prevents battery stratification and reduces sulfation, the leading cause of battery failure. Equalizing should be performed when a battery is first purchased (called a freshening charge). Reduced performance can also be an indicator that an equalizing charge is needed. All batteries, regardless of their chemistry, will self-discharge. The rate of self-discharge for lead acid batteries depends on the storage or operating temperature. At a temperature of 80 degrees F. A lead acid battery will self-discharge at a rate of approximately 4% a week. A battery with a 125-amp hour rating would self-discharge at a rate of approximately five amps per week. Keeping this in mind if a 125 AH battery is stored for four months (16 weeks) winter without being charged, it will lose 80 amps of its 125-amp capacity. It will also have severe sulfation, which causes additional loss of capacity. Keep your batteries charged while not in use. The spec states that the 110ah capacity is at C100, not C20 so more likely they are 85ah? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 13 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said: Is the one at 14*C next to (touching) the one at 22*C ? Monitor the one at 22*C if it gets any hotter take it out of the bank. None of them are actually touching, there is about 1cm between each battery. The 14C and the 22C are not adjacent. I will certainly be monitoring them. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoominPapa Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 1 hour ago, frahkn said: None of them are actually touching, there is about 1cm between each battery. The 14C and the 22C are not adjacent. I will certainly be monitoring them. Thanks. Stop charging and measure the current in the 22C battery. If it's still in the same direction (ie charging) then the other batteries are charging it and and that's the smoking gun. If I was you I'd just disconnect the 22C battery for 24 hours. and then measure the terminal voltage. If it's still around 12v then it's OK, if it reduces to around 10v then it's dead. MP. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Brummie Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 In the time procrastinating, you could have ordered them and had them for fitting by Tuesday. Once batteries get 'tired', they never get better, and replacing one in a bank is never a good idea. Batteries are consumables at the prices we are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 22, 2019 Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 There is a slight flaw in the plan to order them from ebay, it could be that the OP's boat does not have a postcode. So before ordering he needs to cruise to a pub or find a canalside address that will accept the delivery for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2019 5 hours ago, MoominPapa said: Stop charging and measure the current in the 22C battery. If it's still in the same direction (ie charging) then the other batteries are charging it and and that's the smoking gun. If I was you I'd just disconnect the 22C battery for 24 hours. and then measure the terminal voltage. If it's still around 12v then it's OK, if it reduces to around 10v then it's dead. MP. Thanks Moomin, I'll try that tomorrow. 4 hours ago, Ex Brummie said: In the time procrastinating, you could have ordered them and had them for fitting by Tuesday. Once batteries get 'tired', they never get better, and replacing one in a bank is never a good idea. Batteries are consumables at the prices we are talking about. I've phoned my two closest boatyards, both are closed till 6th January. As Mike spotted, and you could have, I'm not a live aboard and don't have a postcode for deliveries. I'm cool about replacing them, see my original post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceinSanity Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 12 hours ago, frahkn said: I've phoned my two closest boatyards, both are closed till 6th January. As Mike spotted, and you could have, I'm not a live aboard and don't have a postcode for deliveries. I'm cool about replacing them, see my original post. Pub car parks are good for this as long as you can get a decently tight ETA from the supplier. And if you can’t, just get decently tight ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 12 hours ago, frahkn said: As Mike spotted, and you could have, I'm not a live aboard and don't have a postcode for deliveries. Surely that makes it even easier - just have them delivered to where you DO live and take them with you next time you visit the boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 (edited) Right, update. The 22C battery suddenly went to 43C so I took it out of circuit. Will be interesting to see how the remaining 4 will manage. Edited December 23, 2019 by frahkn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoominPapa Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 10 minutes ago, frahkn said: Will be interesting to see how the remains 4 will manage. A lot better now they're not mainly cooking the sick one. MP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, MoominPapa said: A lot better now they're not mainly cooking the sick one. MP. Although they’ll be on their last legs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 3 hours ago, MoominPapa said: A lot better now they're not mainly cooking the sick one. MP. The 14 C battery got hotter (18 C) at first but seems to have calmed down now. Also the Sterling meter still says that it is charging into "full" batteries. If necessary I can get to my home marina in two days and be on shore power. But would this help - surely even on shore power, the 12 volt demand is met by the charger via the batteries? Anyway, for now all is well and from the 6th I can arrange a new set of batteries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBiscuits Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 On 22/12/2019 at 08:57, Mike the Boilerman said: I know you can 'out-pedant' me with ease I thought it would need both skill and effort ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 42 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said: I thought it would need both skill and effort ... Surely you recognise I only do it the get a rise out of Alan, and he usually takes the bait with vigour and runs with it beautifully! As evidenced by this thread.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 7 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said: Surely you recognise I only do it the get a rise out of Alan, and he usually takes the bait with vigour and runs with it beautifully! As evidenced by this thread.... You even have a choice of Alans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtB Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 5 minutes ago, alan_fincher said: You even have a choice of Alans! I even manage it without calling anyone a "loser"...!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Bob Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 10 hours ago, Mike the Boilerman said: Surely you recognise I only do it the get a rise out of Alan, and he usually takes the bait with vigour and runs with it beautifully! As evidenced by this thread.... Bait........ .. .. .. .. Fish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuthound Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 12 hours ago, frahkn said: The 14 C battery got hotter (18 C) at first but seems to have calmed down now. Also the Sterling meter still says that it is charging into "full" batteries. If necessary I can get to my home marina in two days and be on shore power. But would this help - surely even on shore power, the 12 volt demand is met by the charger via the batteries? Anyway, for now all is well and from the 6th I can arrange a new set of batteries. Sadly when batteries are of the same age, when one fails the others soon follow. Providing you keep a eye on the remaining batteries, you should be OK to use them until you can replace them early next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 14 hours ago, frahkn said: Also the Sterling meter still says that it is charging into "full" batteries. Ignore that meter. The only two methods of determining ‘full’ are a relative density reading, which you can’t do with sealed batteries, or measuring the charging current with the charging voltage circa 14.4V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceinSanity Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 I have a pack of el cheapo adhesive thermometer strips bought on Fleabay and stick one on each battery when they’re getting a bit long in the tooth. Not terribly accurate but easily shows when one is out of line with the others, isolate that one from the bank before it starts smelling and work out where to get new ones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahkn Posted December 28, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2019 On 23/12/2019 at 21:30, frahkn said: The 14 C battery got hotter (18 C) at first but seems to have calmed down now. Also the Sterling meter still says that it is charging into "full" batteries. If necessary I can get to my home marina in two days and be on shore power. But would this help - surely even on shore power, the 12 volt demand is met by the charger via the batteries? Anyway, for now all is well and from the 6th I can arrange a new set of batteries. After 3 days with no problems, yesterday the 14C battery went suddenly to 77C so I disconnected everything and went back to the marina. Now at home awaiting the 6th. Thanks again for all the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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