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Brigantine

Edward_M

By Edward_M
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peterboat Veteran II

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Posted
Posted

Just hire a boat to see the narrow bits in the middle.

 

No point restricting your living space just in case you might one day fancy seeing a narrow muddy ditch in the midlands.

Words of wisdom I lived on a narrowboat for 6 years then realised that my waterways are designed for real boats so why should i live in a corridor. My life is now much more comfortable and my cruising is not really compromised as at the moment i have no intention of going any further south than nottingham area.

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Giant Proficient

Giant

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Posted (edited)

Edward,

 

Consider whether a larger class of boat might suit your needs better - some original or replica Dutch barge, or possibly even an actual Sheffield Keel (61'6" x 15'6") as we have. You would not be able to fit up any of the London canals, but you would have the run of the Thames (we can go as far up as Oxford), the Medway, the whole of the estuary to explore, and even the potential to cross the Channel and enjoy the vast European network. Even if you never make that trip yourself, having a boat suitable for the European canals means that you always have the potential to sell to someone who wants to do that.

 

Limehouse can take such things, indeed one of our sister ships is there, and your budget might be sufficient to buy something in that class already on a London mooring somewhere - there are a great many barges of all kinds to be found on moorings all along the Thames.

 

There is a whole other community to be found around barges, the DBA is a good starting point - http://www.barges.org/.

Edited by Giant
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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

Edward,

 

Consider whether a larger class of boat might suit your needs better - some original or replica Dutch barge, or possibly even an actual Sheffield Keel (61'6" x 15'6") as we have. You would not be able to fit up any of the London canals, but you would have the run of the Thames (we can go as far up as Oxford), the Medway, the whole of the estuary to explore, and even the potential to cross the Channel and enjoy the vast European network. Even if you never make that trip yourself, having a boat suitable for the European canals means that you always have the potential to sell to someone who wants to do that.

 

Limehouse can take such things, indeed one of our sister ships is there, and your budget might be sufficient to buy something in that class already on a London mooring somewhere - there are a great many barges of all kinds to be found on moorings all along the Thames.

 

There is a whole other community to be found around barges, the DBA is a good starting point - http://www.barges.org/.

 

 

Odd that one has to pay £30 to even read the discussion forum though.

 

Or have I got that wrong somehow?

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Edward_M Contributor

Edward_M

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Posted

Edward,

 

Consider whether a larger class of boat might suit your needs better - some original or replica Dutch barge, or possibly even an actual Sheffield Keel (61'6" x 15'6") as we have. You would not be able to fit up any of the London canals, but you would have the run of the Thames (we can go as far up as Oxford), the Medway, the whole of the estuary to explore, and even the potential to cross the Channel and enjoy the vast European network. Even if you never make that trip yourself, having a boat suitable for the European canals means that you always have the potential to sell to someone who wants to do that.

 

Limehouse can take such things, indeed one of our sister ships is there, and your budget might be sufficient to buy something in that class already on a London mooring somewhere - there are a great many barges of all kinds to be found on moorings all along the Thames.

 

There is a whole other community to be found around barges, the DBA is a good starting point - http://www.barges.org/.

 

Thanks Giant - I have done... especially the Branson 'Thomas' dutch barges. Inevitably though, my decision has still fallen on wanting some limited use of the canals.

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widebeamboy Collaborator

widebeamboy

Posted
Posted

Edward,

 

Consider whether a larger class of boat might suit your needs better - some original or replica Dutch barge, or possibly even an actual Sheffield Keel (61'6" x 15'6") as we have. You would not be able to fit up any of the London canals, but you would have the run of the Thames (we can go as far up as Oxford), the Medway, the whole of the estuary to explore, and even the potential to cross the Channel and enjoy the vast European network. Even if you never make that trip yourself, having a boat suitable for the European canals means that you always have the potential to sell to someone who wants to do that.

 

Limehouse can take such things, indeed one of our sister ships is there, and your budget might be sufficient to buy something in that class already on a London mooring somewhere - there are a great many barges of all kinds to be found on moorings all along the Thames.

 

There is a whole other community to be found around barges, the DBA is a good starting point - http://www.barges.org/.

 

Bear in mind that anything over 4.5m will attract a 30% surcharge on the annual mooring fee that you will pay. I know your sister ship as I walk past it several times a day and lovely owners it has to.

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Giant Proficient

Giant

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Posted

Thanks Giant - I have done... especially the Branson 'Thomas' dutch barges. Inevitably though, my decision has still fallen on wanting some limited use of the canals.

 

I gather there are quite a number barges around that are capable of going up the Lea, the GU, and the K&A. I expect the high decked style presents some challenges for getting on and off at locks & moorings - where the UK canal norm is for the water to be quite close to ground level. This is the tradeoff with the increased freeboard that makes them suitable for tidal waters and large canals.

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GUMPY Veteran II

GUMPYDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

As the ex owner of a 61x12 barge that was based on the GU near Berko I look back and wonder if for the 10years that I owned Parglena I was out of my mind!

We never really went boating apart from on rivers one trip to Stoke Bruene (first year) One trip down the K&A in the second year. The rest of the time was spent on the Thames and East coast.

70x12 will be a nightmare on the canals especially as they are much busier now than when we had Parglena.

Would I buy a big boat again for canals.

NO

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Northernboater Community Regular

Northernboater

Posted
Posted (edited)

Thanks Giant - I have done... especially the Branson 'Thomas' dutch barges. Inevitably though, my decision has still fallen on wanting some limited use of the canals.

I found this Branson Thomas for sale within your budget of £180-£200k.

 

http://barges.apolloduck.co.uk/feature.phtml?id=400020

 

However being only 40ft is a bit short of your 65-70ft requirement. I think your going to have a bit of a shock and reality check when you start talking to boat builders with regards to cost of a new 65-70ft Brigantine/Dutch Barge, as I can't see you getting anything near your expectations new with your budget. I think you would be better off looking at second hand to get anywhere close to the size your after and that's real-life.

Edited by Northernboater
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Northernboater Community Regular

Northernboater

Posted
Posted

You can get one from Aintree/Collingwood for the budget.

Unfortunately, you get what you pay for and the build quality is something to be "regretted" from what I have witnessed and Ben told, seen, this year.

The OP says he's meeting Jonathan Wilson in Jan to discuss, I think he will be in for an eye opener when it comes to his budget, not to mention time scale for completion. This is something the OP has not mentioned. I would say if he was lucky he may have a new build on the water by the end of 2017 beginning of 2018. How many boat builders have a 65-70ft Brigantine/Dutch Barge shell lying around the bottom of the yard? Has he thought of lead time for a build slot of something that size?

I would not get too wound up with moorings around London as your looking at least a year if that before he has a boat and that is if he can afford one on his budget which I doubt.

He'll probably end up buying a used 60ft Dutch Barge.

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Edward_M Contributor

Edward_M

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Posted

The OP says he's meeting Jonathan Wilson in Jan to discuss, I think he will be in for an eye opener when it comes to his budget, not to mention time scale for completion. This is something the OP has not mentioned. I would say if he was lucky he may have a new build on the water by the end of 2017 beginning of 2018. How many boat builders have a 65-70ft Brigantine/Dutch Barge shell lying around the bottom of the yard? Has he thought of lead time for a build slot of something that size?

I would not get too wound up with moorings around London as your looking at least a year if that before he has a boat and that is if he can afford one on his budget which I doubt.

He'll probably end up buying a used 60ft Dutch Barge.

 

Given the weight of opinion that suggests my plans of a 70 x 12 widebeam are just not suitable for the canals, it seems I should get my priorities in the right order.

 

The second hand Dutch Barge is something that I've been considering, particularly a newish replica so I don't end up with ancient equipment. Something like this appeals to me: http://barges.apolloduck.co.uk/feature.phtml?id=480505

 

With its dimensions, I could probably still take it up and down the K&A occassionally and certainly up to Oxford and back?

 

Thanks all for the advice, it seems to have worked - you're not going to have to worry about yet another massive wide beam on the canals

Are there size restrictions on taking a boat from London to Oxford?

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hounddog Collaborator

hounddog

Posted
Posted

Its a good point. As the OP - the residential mooring will be a base, but I fully intend to use it as regularly as possible on the K&A, GU etc. Hence my questions about dimensions.

 

I don't know enough to know if you're being sarcastic. My impression was a boat of 250k should have AGM or Victron GEL batteries?

 

You'd suggest a 65' x 12' would be an okay compromise if I can make the layout fit?

 

LOL - that'll go well on the K&A!

Your impression shows the paucity of your knowledge and is a good reason to do a LOT more research.

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Athy Veteran II

AthyDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

The boat in your link looks well appointed and is indeed worth considering, despite the ludicrous little wash-basin in the bathroom (easily replaced, I would think). What's more, she's moored on the K&A already!

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widebeamboy Collaborator

widebeamboy

Posted
Posted (edited)

What does 'sailaway' typically include?

 

something basic like this

http://www.collingwoodboatbuilders.co.uk/range/sailaway/

 

However you can add or subtract things you do or don't want, ie you could organise the sprayfoam yourself and put your own floor and ballast in etc.

Edited by widebeamboy
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Edward_M Contributor

Edward_M

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Posted (edited)

Its a bit big. 90 off ft long!

Yes, but the lesson I've learned from this discussion is that although a 70' x12' is technically within canal restrictions, it wouldn't be fun to be taking a boat of that size on the canals. So if I'm restricted to the Thames, I may as well get a massive boat / house and rent a narrowboat for the weekends.

 

Nice though.

 

Richard

From the lack of pics, I assume it has no galley, bathrooms, heating, electrics etc.

 

So I'd have to anticipate what.... 30-40k for a fitout using equipment that is decent, but not excessive?

And from everything I've heard, I really don't want to be taking a massive boat on the canals. It sounds like more trouble than its worth.

 

So the priority is having a really nice living accommodation and being able to go up and down the Thames on weekends, and then exploring the canal system on a hire boat or by 'swapping' boats for a week with a narrowboat owner. I actually really like the idea of this - having a good relationship with the community so that someone I trust can have a week in a nice boat in the middle of London, whilst I get to explore the canals on their narrowboat. A mutual trust and care for each others' boat. It means that even though I'm not on the canal system, I still get to be part of the community.

Edited by Edward Mendelson
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MtB Veteran II

MtBDonate to Canal World

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The reason I ask, is I've seen this:

 

https://www.dutchbargesforsale.co.uk/barges_for_sale_in_holland/6247/complete_rebuild__very_good_quality.html

 

It looks like it needs a full fit, but it is within budget.

 

 

Curiously Chrome won't let me look at that advert, giving me the following error message:

 

 

This site can’t provide a secure connection

www.dutchbargesforsale.co.uk uses an unsupported protocol.

ERR_SSL_VERSION_OR_CIPHER_MISMATCH
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