Pumpout- is there a non-macerator remote option?

[Starcoaster]

As far as I can ascertain the only options are dump through or remote tank w/macerator.

Can anyone tell me if there is a pump out option where it is vacuum pumped to a remote tank but without a macerator? Or would this just not be viable because it would clog?

[Claude]

The dometic vacuflush toilet can be connected to a remote pump out holding tank. I think Dometic have stopped making the toilet now but Lee Sanitation may still stock them so it's worth giving them a call. (They tend not to pick up the phone in the afternoon for some reason.) Note: This is the same toilet bowl as the Vacuflush cassette system but with a different vacuum pump system.

[John V]

A word of warning,

 

When I was looking at systems for Sabina H, I considered Vacuflush.

 

A marine engineer (whose views I trust implicitly with anything to do with ships or boats) advised me to stay away from them under all circumstances.

He told me that the Vacuflush system was fitted to several of the Thames river cruisers and Party boats and used to cause more trips to the repair yard than any other system on board.

 

This was a long time ago, of course but I strongly advise you talk to owners of the system you are thinking of ..... preferably several of them.

[magnetman]

I have installed a Lavac sea toilet discharging to a holding tank (pumpout tank). It has a manual pump. It works very well but I don't know how far from the tank it could be as mine is very close. I think it would work at a distance as long as the pipe goes up first then down as if it were a sea toilet discharging overboard.

Its a nice silent system as the pump is a hand operated diaphragm type. No macerator.

 

I designed and fitted a small header tank with a solenoid valve and a float switch which is topped up automatically by clean water

When the lavac is flushed the lid seals down and flush water is pulled from the cistern.

 

Used 24/7 by 4 people (2 adults two infants) been in there about a year now and been no trouble.

Edited June 15, 2016 by magnetman

[cheshire~rose]

I can imagine a vacuflush would be the worst thing in the world to fit on any party boat!

 

I can only imagine how many "foreign objects" they had to remove and so I do think it is very possible the toilets did not "break down" just failed to cope with people using them who didn't understand they could not just bung anything down there.

 

Can I ask why you do not want a macerator Starry?

[BruceinSanity]

I can imagine a vacuflush would be the worst thing in the world to fit on any party boat!

 

I can only imagine how many "foreign objects" they had to remove and so I do think it is very possible the toilets did not "break down" just failed to cope with people using them who didn't understand they could not just bung anything down there.

 

Can I ask why you do not want a macerator Starry?

I'm a bit puzzled by that, too. Certainly the vacuflush has at least as much to go wrong as the macerator, including (I'm told) three pressure switches. The big plus about the macerator is that you know that if it made it into the tank, it will come out again, no embarrassing incidents with blocked exit pipes.

 

In 12 years of using a macerator, we've had to strip one twice. The first time was uric acid scale blockage, now avoided with occasional doses of phosphoric acid, and the second was a warranty repair to a failed rubber hose.

 

Having said that, everyone should use the toilet they prefer, this is not an invitation to a bog standard debate!

[ditchcrawler]

I can imagine a vacuflush would be the worst thing in the world to fit on any party boat!

 

I can only imagine how many "foreign objects" they had to remove and so I do think it is very possible the toilets did not "break down" just failed to cope with people using them who didn't understand they could not just bung anything down there.

 

Agree, there was a program about Heathrow on TV the other night and they have a big filter box in their pump out line that pumps the aircraft out which blocked. the found amongst other things a plastic 500ml water bottle in it.

[Alan de Enfield]

Agree, there was a program about Heathrow on TV the other night and they have a big filter box in their pump out line that pumps the aircraft out which blocked. the found amongst other things a plastic 500ml water bottle in it.

 

I bet that made the owner's eyes water'

 

Read the words in the attached article.

[ditchcrawler]

 

I bet that made the owner's eyes water'

 

Read the words in the attached article.

You may be in trouble with that post.

[Alan de Enfield]

You may be in trouble with that post.

 

Hmmmmmm

 

Racist - No !

Political - No !

Religious - No !

 

Has humour now been banned ?

[ditchcrawler]

 

Hmmmmmm

 

Racist - No !

Political - No !

Religious - No !

 

Has humour now been banned ?

Possibly

[GUMPY]

A lot depends on cash

We had one of these

http://www.leesan.com/index.asp?m=3&b_idno=10&p=622&t=Rheinstrom%20Y10S%20Toilet,%2012v%20DC

Not a macerator as such, it effectively uses centrifugal force to empty the pan.

Good point is if there is anything it can't deal with it stays in the pan

[magnetman]

 

Hmmmmmm

 

Racist - No !

Political - No !

Religious - No !

 

Has humour now been banned ?

I think crap jokes are probably pushing the guidelines

[cheshire~rose]

I'm a bit puzzled by that, too. Certainly the vacuflush has at least as much to go wrong as the macerator, including (I'm told) three pressure switches. The big plus about the macerator is that you know that if it made it into the tank, it will come out again, no embarrassing incidents with blocked exit pipes.

 

In 12 years of using a macerator, we've had to strip one twice. The first time was uric acid scale blockage, now avoided with occasional doses of phosphoric acid, and the second was a warranty repair to a failed rubber hose.

 

Having said that, everyone should use the toilet they prefer, this is not an invitation to a bog standard debate!

 

In our 12 years (ours is a Tecma) we have had a microswitch fail (this did not require the look to be stripped apart - just the bed base!) The "failure" turned out to be a visiting female relative that "forgot" that some items are not to be flushed

[Starcoaster]

I'm not asking for me-I am working with a boating business and they have a hire fleet with macerators, and despite the signs, warnings and callout charge if they block it after being warned not to put things down it and signing to acknowledge this, they still block on the regular with things like cotton buds and particularly, face wipes-we've been talking about ways around this, and if there is a non-macerator option that would resolve these issues (dump out has been ruled out because holiday makers aren't that keen on seeing into the tank, apparently)!

[Bettie Boo]

I'm not asking for me-I am working with a boating business and they have a hire fleet with macerators, and despite the signs, warnings and callout charge if they block it after being warned not to put things down it and signing to acknowledge this, they still block on the regular with things like cotton buds and particularly, face wipes-we've been talking about ways around this, and if there is a non-macerator option that would resolve these issues (dump out has been ruled out because holiday makers aren't that keen on seeing into the tank, apparently)!

 

Write a reminder in bright red nail varnish on the loo seat or lid?

 

include free face wipes & Q-tips in the bedrooms along with small counter top waste bins with signage saying these bins are for used complimentary wipes & Q-tips?

 

Just suggestions as an alternative to the expense of changing the loos

[magnetman]

Its definitely an interesting topic this one. The perennial problem of how to stop people putting the wrong thing in a boat bog and how to deal with it if they do.

 

One option may be to put in some sort of weedhatch or mudbox arrangement between bog and pump and add a clause to the hire contract which says the hirer is responsible for cleaning it if it gets blocked

 

Limehouse Marina have an elsan hopper which is pumped to the sewer. They have had problems with baby wipes stopping the pump. They now have a notice to the effect that legal action will be taken if anyone puts anything down it which has not been digested or something like that

 

Typos

Edited June 15, 2016 by magnetman

[Chewbacka]

I'm not asking for me-I am working with a boating business and they have a hire fleet with macerators, and despite the signs, warnings and callout charge if they block it after being warned not to put things down it and signing to acknowledge this, they still block on the regular with things like cotton buds and particularly, face wipes-we've been talking about ways around this, and if there is a non-macerator option that would resolve these issues (dump out has been ruled out because holiday makers aren't that keen on seeing into the tank, apparently)!

Fix one of these on the wall by the toilet.

How graphic you make the message will be an interesting challenge for you.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motion-Sensitive-Memo-Minder-Message-Recorder-Memory-Aid-And-Security-Device-/162087505021?hash=item25bd2b0c7d:g:xrsAAOSwGjpXTGyX

 

Not sure your customers will like it shouting out whenever one 'sneaks' in to discretely use the facilities but they can always turn it off.

[BruceinSanity]

I'm not asking for me-I am working with a boating business and they have a hire fleet with macerators, and despite the signs, warnings and callout charge if they block it after being warned not to put things down it and signing to acknowledge this, they still block on the regular with things like cotton buds and particularly, face wipes-we've been talking about ways around this, and if there is a non-macerator option that would resolve these issues (dump out has been ruled out because holiday makers aren't that keen on seeing into the tank, apparently)!

But as I've said, it only postpones the problem until you come to pump out after the client has escaped. I've seen a pump out totally blocked by a piece of workshop towel, so I'm sure a face wipe would do the same. Then you're looking at opening up the tank to get it out.

 

Unless you do what I saw a guy on the Thames do. He had a big plastic boat with a poly cube type tank under the cockpit. The pump out at the lock didn't seem to be working, until I suggested he try it dipped in the river, when it ran just fine. Implication, blocked tank exit. Lifting the decking in the cockpit exposed the tank. As his missus had carried on flushing, the sides of the cube were a bit bowed out.

 

After he'd had a domestic with his wife about their teenage son, who'd been putting said workshop towel down the loo, I ventured to suggest he try flushing down the pump out with the rinse out hose to clear the end of the pipe in the tank. He did so, using a *lot* of water, bulging the tank even more. At this point, I thought "this could go so wrong..." and took a few steps back.

 

It worked – and a jet of dilute sh1t fountained a metre or so into the air and landed all over the pale beige seats in the cockpit. Got the tank emptied, though...

[Starcoaster]

 

Write a reminder in bright red nail varnish on the loo seat or lid?

 

include free face wipes & Q-tips in the bedrooms along with small counter top waste bins with signage saying these bins are for used complimentary wipes & Q-tips?

 

Just suggestions as an alternative to the expense of changing the loos

 

There really is not a lot else we can do about it... There are bins in the toilet and bathroom, clear signs in the bathroom, a face-to-face lecture (ish) on how to use the bog with the emphasis on not putting stuff down it and what happens if they do, they have to sign a document to say that they understand that things can't be put down the toilet, and that they accept an additional fee if they have to call out a tech to unblock the bog because of something they have put down it...

Yet still pretty much every full turnaround, there are one, two or more blocked bog issue call outs over the course of the holiday.

 

I think the crux of the issue is that while people understand that face wipes etc., will block the toilet, they don't think the effect will be immediate, and they'll finish their break and be long gone by the time a problem arises... If they really took in the fact that the macerator will likely block pretty much immediately and why this is, I don't think they'd do it, but nothing seems to get it through.

One callout last week the guy swore up and down that they didn't even have face wipes of any kind on the boat, but there were three packets on the side in one of the cupboards-his response was "must be the mother in law."

[Rob-M]

When I used to do turn round we would often have issues with nappies blocking the pumpout pipe. Dump through toilets were used so the customers didn't get a blocked toilet but they just ignored the signs and stuffed anything they fancied it seemed down the toilet. I'm sure they didn't stuff used nappies down their toilets at home.

[RufusR]

I dont think you will win against the GP to be honest . We are experienced boaters and hired a boat last summer as we wanted to go cruising with 4 friends and their 2 kids and we dont have room to sleep them all so we hired .. We KNOW all about what to do and not to do as we have our own maccerator and still we had to call out the engineer for a blocked bog , cause ? wet wipes wrapped aroudn the blades .. KIDS .. tell them not to do something and they well do it ... when you are not looking ... cant win , very embarrassing .did suggest said child would be fetching it out with his teeth as I rammed his head down teh bog if he did it again mind . have to say ABC Leisure were brilliant and really nice about it espcially as it was a sunday and in the middle of nowhere

 

I dont think you can win so I guess the cost if the call outs will just have to be averaged out and added to the hire charge as a cost of doing business .

[David Mack]

I dont think you can win so I guess the cost if the call outs will just have to be averaged out and added to the hire charge as a cost of doing business .

 

Averaging it out isn't really fair on the majority of hirers who do heed the warnings and avoid putting anything untoward down the bog.

 

If hirers have been told and signed to say they have been told, and you put notices on the bog and they still put the wrong stuff down, there isn't much more you can do, other than charge them to clean it out.

 

Do the warnings make it absolutely clear that if you put something untoward down the bog it will probably stop working NOW, not tomorrow or after the end of the trip?

[ditchcrawler]

Bit on radio 4 just before lunch about people flushing things down the loo. PPP Paper, Poo and Pee is what the man said.

[Chewbacka]

 

Averaging it out isn't really fair on the majority of hirers who do heed the warnings and avoid putting anything untoward down the bog.

 

If hirers have been told and signed to say they have been told, and you put notices on the bog and they still put the wrong stuff down, there isn't much more you can do, other than charge them to clean it out.

 

Do the warnings make it absolutely clear that if you put something untoward down the bog it will probably stop working NOW, not tomorrow or after the end of the trip?

Also if you do charge them, they won't do it again when they next hire a boat, whereas if they get away with it they might.

Carrot & stick is the only training method for some people.