Are Bow Thrusters destroying canal banks?

[Tim Lewis]

I can now see that the only way to move boats without causing damage is by horse and rope. I knew there was a reason why they used to do that

 

Richard

 

Except that BW have banned horses from the towpath because of the damage they cause!

 

Tim

[Jo Gilbertson]

Except that BW have banned horses from the towpath because of the damage they cause!

 

Tim

 

Worse than bicycles?...

[RLWP]

errr Richard, have you seen the rope marks around the system...

 

Yes, but they're not damaging the banks are they?

 

Richard

[luctor et emergo]

Is this a ploy by BW, to absolve them from responsibility for the dreadfull state of so many banks?

 

"No, it is not a lack of maintenance, it is the fault of all those bowtrusters that inept boaters keep using.."

[Jo Gilbertson]

Is this a ploy by BW, to absolve them from responsibility for the dreadfull state of so many banks?

 

"No, it is not a lack of maintenance, it is the fault of all those bowtrusters that inept boaters keep using.."

 

Im not BW ...nor is Steve Haywood - last time I looked...

[mark99]

Amercian Signal crayfish do a bit of bovver to the banks too.

 

Mark

[Keeping Up]

Amercian Signal crayfish do a bit of bovver to the banks too.

 

Mark

 

And they are USELESS for manoeuvring the bows away from the bank with too

[Neil TNC]

Im not BW ...nor is Steve Haywood - last time I looked...

 

Yes...but BW have a habit of listening to nutters, when money is concerned.

[Davo_Willow]

And they are USELESS for manoeuvring the bows away from the bank with too

 

But they do give the correct signals!

[Jo Gilbertson]

Yes...but BW have a habit of listening to nutters, when money is concerned.

 

calling me a nutter neil?

[luctor et emergo]

takes ringside seat

[Tim]

Didn't some badgers cause one of the Llangollen breaches? Now that was bank damage in the extreme!

[Neil TNC]

calling me a nutter neil?

 

Zut alors!...do BW listen to you?...I was talking about my old mate Steve, who definitely is a wind-up merchant.

[mrsmelly]

Don't bowthrusters run on electricity directly from the battery?

Could be useful if the main propulsion engine has run out of err . . .

 

 

 

No you haven't . . .

:clapping:

 

I actually cleared it in 5 minutes........

 

I just loved watching everyone else pulling while I cuddled your loverly BMC

 

 

Obviously, if such a device was to be fitted to mrsmelly's boat it would be hydraulic drive direct from the mighty Beta 43, which needs diese.......

 

Ooopppsss

:P :P

[jenlyn]

whats a bowthruster?

[mrsmelly]

whats a bowthruster?

Thats easy to answer. They were designed and marketed by the makers/suppliers of batteries as mostly but not all are run from a bank of batteries. Their intention being to ruin batteries at a very quick rate hence furthering future battery sales for the said companies. As a side line they make a funny squealing noise a bit like a hairdrier and are actualy marketed as an aid to boat handling Of course no ones daft enough to be taken in by that.............

[jenlyn]

Thats easy to answer. They were designed and marketed by the makers/suppliers of batteries as mostly but not all are run from a bank of batteries. Their intention being to ruin batteries at a very quick rate hence furthering future battery sales for the said companies. As a side line they make a funny squealing noise a bit like a hairdrier and are actualy marketed as an aid to boat handling Of course no ones daft enough to be taken in by that.............

some old bugger pushed me into the lock landing with one of those the other day, i was very polite, and asked him nicely if he would like me to help him inspect his bowthruster thingy from beneath the water line

[magpie patrick]

Thats easy to answer. They were designed and marketed by the makers/suppliers of batteries as mostly but not all are run from a bank of batteries. Their intention being to ruin batteries at a very quick rate hence furthering future battery sales for the said companies. As a side line they make a funny squealing noise a bit like a hairdrier and are actualy marketed as an aid to boat handling Of course no ones daft enough to be taken in by that.............

 

I'm sure some old sage of a boatman, about 100 years ago, saw the first boats fitted with internal combustion engines and wondered why they bothered

 

"nowt so good an an 'oss" they'd say.

 

I've used Bow Thrusters, on longer boats (and longer wider ones) they are useful, but certainly not essential, although I think they make some steerers, and some boat designers, lazy.

[sueb]

Zut alors!...do BW listen to you?...I was talking about my old mate Steve, who definitely is a wind-up merchant.

I thought you were talking about a barge owner.

Sue

[alan_fincher]

As for moving away from banks on setting off I rarely push the nose off first as this leaves the important bit ( The prop ) still alongside and in shallow water. The best way is to leave the front alone push the back end off as you step on then reverse which pulls nose away from bank and then given correct use of engine and tiller move foreward, you will be well clear of bank and go on your merry way. This is only sometimes hindered by very strong winds but I dont boat in heavy winds.

 

'tis the technique I use too... no doubt someone will be along shortly to say it's not correct....

 

Well just make sure you have not got your stern rope hooked over the tiller pin, as it's going to get well wrapped around the prop if you are using a lot of reverse as part of your moving off procedure.

 

More seriously, I always think the "prop is vulnerable when you are close to the bank" argument is rather tenuous. Most narrow boats have the lower reaches of the skeg at least 4" and usually more than this below the rotating prop, so unless you get very unlucky with a large upward pointing object that manages to bypass the skeg, and still hit the prop, it's usually pretty well protected. (And anyway the swim will already have had to get over said object for the prop to be near it, and the swim sits lower than the prop - I'd contend damage is more likely reversing!).

 

Who can actually produse evidence of genuine propeller damage whilst attempting to move away from a bank in forward gear ? I bet it's pretty damn rare. Most props are I believe actually damaged by flotsam like large timbers passing through them, not by hitting obstructions on the bottom.

[Keeping Up]

The reversing technique can be incredibly effective though. The water which is sent forward between the boat and the bank, first pushes the back out into the middle of the canal so that any backwards motion becomes even more useful, and then travels forwards to push the bows out towards the middle as well. Timing your change from reverse to forwards, coupled with a good hard push on the tiller at the same time, can swing the boat out towards the middle of the canal far more powerfully than any bowthruster

[Neil TNC]

I thought you were talking about a barge owner.

Sue

 

Mind you, he has not got a bowthruster.

 

The bloke that is having the pre-production TNC class barge is having a hydraulic:

Bow thruster (10hp)

Stern thruster (10hp)

(Both with remote control pad)

 

Anchor winch

Power steering

 

He really wants a hydraulic spud leg as well, but Graham drew the line at that, so he is having it fitted elsewhere.

He should be able to do some serious destruction of the waterway banks and bottom.

He is a Lloyds certified under water structure inspector and has his Masters Cert.

 

Maurice A....well... that is having a modest hydraulic bowthruster and a Schilling style rudder.

[Guest]

This is probably just going to prolong the agony debate but it's a true story.

 

Last August (2009) we shared the Bingley Five Rise with a boat called Edelweiss, in all respects it was a nice boat (not to everyone's tastes mind - fake rivets n all that and it was a Liverpool shell...) but we liked it (with what we knew then).

 

Jan loved the way the boat deftly moved away from the side of the cut as if propelled by magic - it did of course transpire that Edelweiss had bow AND stern thrusters, Jan was very impressed and vowed then any boat we had would be so equipped.

 

When we started looking in earnest to buy a boat this year during our search we stumbled upon Edelweiss for sale at Whilton Marina....and put in a very cheeky offer, so cheeky it was rejected virtually immediately. Jan was gutted but I persuaded her to press on as I would, given the chance prove to her that a BT and especially a ST was unnecessary as over a bit of time she would learn the deft touch needed to manoeuvre a boat in confined spaces and in and out of locks and our mooring.

 

How we laugh now when she propels the Dog House with aplomb into a lock or mooring saying "WTF is a bow or stern thruster really for??" OK sometimes we only award each other 7/10 if one of us hits the lock side or gate but it's never with any real force.

 

We looked at at least 3 boats during our search where the BT wasn't working with a promise to have it fixed if we bought...nuff said.

Edited September 16, 2010 by MJG

[MikeV]

Who can actually produse evidence of genuine propeller damage whilst attempting to move away from a bank in forward gear ?

Not propeller damage but on two occasions I have hit underwater objects (very solid - probably stone or concrete blocks) when leaving visitor moorings in urban areas. After both instances I suffered drive plate failures a few days later. Obviously I can't say categorically the two were definitely related, but it seems very likely the drive plate was damaged by the impact.

 

I now nearly always push the stern out first and reverse away from the bank. The main exception being lock landings.

 

I also think that while bowthrusters are not essential equipment, they do have their uses especially during tight manouevring when there are strong winds or currents. I try my best not to use it under normal circumstances but I'll use the BT if it avoids potential damage to other boats or reduces the risk of another person being exposed to a more dangerous situation e.g. said person is standing on the end of a pontoon and I'd otherwise hit the pontoon.

Edited September 16, 2010 by MikeV

[blackrose]

Bowthrusters are of no use to anyone unless they are not very capable unless they are needed on longer narrowboats than mine, at only seventy feet I find I have never had need for one praps if I buy a 120 footer that will be a different story

I guess some people used to say the same thing about having engines on boats - that they were only of any use to incapable boaters. If you want to be a purist you better get yourself a horse.

 

As far as thrusters eroding banks, I would think that most are not really powerful enough, wash from passing boats creates far more turbulance. I'm not sure that the argument about thrusters causing more erosion because they direct the thrust perpedicular to the bank really makes sense either - a 45 degree wash can cause plenty of bank erosion.

 

Thats easy to answer. They were designed and marketed by the makers/suppliers of batteries as mostly but not all are run from a bank of batteries. Their intention being to ruin batteries at a very quick rate hence furthering future battery sales for the said companies. As a side line they make a funny squealing noise a bit like a hairdrier and are actualy marketed as an aid to boat handling Of course no ones daft enough to be taken in by that.............

More drivel. My BT batteries are 5 years old and still going strong.

Edited September 16, 2010 by blackrose