Alan de Enfield Posted March 21, 2019 Report Share Posted March 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, WotEver said: I was doing some work around our garden pond yesterday and disturbed a... er... coupled pair of frogs. They remained coupled for every hop, jumped in the pond, surfaced by some plants and still remained coupled. And he was half the size of her too... I have always said "size doesn't matter". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonnieF1967 Posted March 21, 2019 Report Share Posted March 21, 2019 21 hours ago, Athy said: The O.P.might be interested to know how much it cost, unless you would prefer to keep that information to yourself. Hi We had thermal break windows, a Vetus 55kg bow thruster and also all electrics, plumbing and a full bathroom fitted plus some other bits and bobs. Came in at £47500 for this but would have been a bit more but we luckily got our order in for the boat before the new RCD regulations changed so got it slightly cheaper than it should have been. She's a lovely boat and apart from a few teething issues with the Canaline 38 in her she has behaved great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted March 21, 2019 Report Share Posted March 21, 2019 1 minute ago, RonnieF1967 said: Hi We had thermal break windows, a Vetus 55kg bow thruster and also all electrics, plumbing and a full bathroom fitted plus some other bits and bobs. Came in at £47500 for this but would have been a bit more but we luckily got our order in for the boat before the new RCD regulations changed so got it slightly cheaper than it should have been. She's a lovely boat and apart from a few teething issues with the Canaline 38 in her she has behaved great. So, definitely a "sailaway plus". Thanks for that info - it should help the O.P. form an idea of what he'll get for his money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonnieF1967 Posted March 21, 2019 Report Share Posted March 21, 2019 1 minute ago, Athy said: So, definitely a "sailaway plus". Thanks for that info - it should help the O.P. form an idea of what he'll get for his money. Yes its classed as a lined sailaway additions. S Jacksons & Sons supply all their hulls to Lymm Boats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGoat Posted March 21, 2019 Report Share Posted March 21, 2019 9 hours ago, RonnieF1967 said: Yes its classed as a lined sailaway additions. S Jacksons & Sons supply all their hulls to Lymm Boats. That's a good point for most newcomers on here who really just want to do a simple fitout. All the technical stuff should have been done (haha) leaving the new owner "put in the furniture" - which I guess that newbies to boating think that's all that's needed. Of course it depends on who's doing the additions. (ignorantia nimen excusat...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonnieF1967 Posted March 22, 2019 Report Share Posted March 22, 2019 18 hours ago, OldGoat said: That's a good point for most newcomers on here who really just want to do a simple fitout. All the technical stuff should have been done (haha) leaving the new owner "put in the furniture" - which I guess that newbies to boating think that's all that's needed. Of course it depends on who's doing the additions. (ignorantia nimen excusat...) As long as the hull and engine are sound, the fit out can be done as and when necessary, we have camped in ours pretty much from day one and have steadily got the fit out done when money permitted, the boaty stuff (skin fittings, stove installation, engine service etc..) have been done by ourselves with the help of fellow experienced boaters where we moor her (great bunch of friends) The joinery work (kitchen units and some cabinets) have been done by a friend who's in the trade. Still lots to do but enjoying taking her out on the cut as often as we can after all whats the point of getting a boat if you don't cruise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted March 22, 2019 Report Share Posted March 22, 2019 1 minute ago, RonnieF1967 said: Still lots to do but enjoying taking her out on the cut as often as we can after all whats the point of getting a boat if you don't cruise. That's one of the problems, cruising it is better than working on it, so it may never get done but you enjoy it more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonnieF1967 Posted March 22, 2019 Report Share Posted March 22, 2019 4 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said: That's one of the problems, cruising it is better than working on it, so it may never get done but you enjoy it more Yep we are finding that out but wouldn't swap our life, ten months without a fully functioning kitchen and living on pasta and stir fry just about sums it up. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markinaboat Posted March 23, 2019 Report Share Posted March 23, 2019 I would research as many boat builders as possible, get in touch with them and tell them your budget. There may be deals to be had out there! For starters, try http://www.xrandd.co.uk/ and https://www.reevesboatservices.com/ No affiliation but both highly regarded/experienced and far from the most expensive. On the other hand, there's plenty of quality used boats available where all of the hard work is done with the required expensive equipment already installed! Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 (edited) On 20/03/2019 at 09:01, Boater Sam said: There are much more serious problems than a leak, like whole seams only welded on one side, rudder tubes not welded at the top to the deck, need I go on? All defects found and documented with Collingwood. I did not say all shells or every shell, I have seen good and bad, that's the problem you don't know which you have till its too late. Never found any poorly welded seams on my Liverpool Boat and I've had it grit blasted and been over the shell with a fine tooth comb. Of course we hear complaints about Liverpool Boats, they weren't a high end builder after all. However since they probably produced more shells than just about anyone else during the years they were in business it seems fairly obvious that we are likely to hear more negative annecdotes about them. Anyway, LB must have been doing something right since so many people own their boats. One other thing I would say though is to take with a pinch of salt some of the negative stories about Liverpool Boats that you hear from people who've never actually owned one. If people have worked on them professionally like you and MtB then fair enough, but a lot of people have no connection and just repeat what they've heard elsewhere. Edited October 26, 2019 by blackrose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 On 20/03/2019 at 09:22, system 4-50 said: Get your sailaway from Colecraft. I did. Great boats and great people. I've seen some poor work from them too if my friend's Colecraft is anything to go by. Just one boat so probably not representative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 (edited) On 20/03/2019 at 09:30, alan_fincher said: I think any variants by Tyler Wilson or Colecraft are likely to cost a fair bit more than what a Liverpool Boat Company one would have done, if they were still producing them. I'd rate the former as at least mid-market, whereas LBC were definitely towards the lower end price wise. What was that company affiliated to Tyler Wilson? Was is Tim Tyler or am I thinking of the brewery? Anyway, a neighbour at Brentford had a sailaway commissioned by them. The steelwork was lovely but the battening and sprayfoam was appalling - it really looked rushed. All builders cut corners occasionally. Edited October 26, 2019 by blackrose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuthound Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 On 20/03/2019 at 17:03, Captain Pegg said: The use of the word 'quality' in these threads is hugely ambiguous. JP Indeed, "quality" in manufacturing terms just means "compliance with a standard". It doesnt specify how high or low that standard is Public perception of the word "quality" usually differs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, blackrose said: What was that company affiliated to Tyler Wilson? Mike Christian? I think that's the name they give to their basic boats. Someone will doubtless correct me if I'm wrong. As I remember it, Tyler and Wilson are uncle and nephew, and Mike Christian was a relative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 15 minutes ago, cuthound said: Indeed, "quality" in manufacturing terms just means "compliance with a standard". It doesnt specify how high or low that standard is Public perception of the word "quality" usually differs. Indeed - ISO 9000 is the biggest con to hit the whole world. All it says it that your manufacture is 'consistent' it does not say that you make 'high quality' products, but, the public perception is that an ISO 9000 company produce 'good quality goods'. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stegra Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 16 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said: Indeed - ISO 9000 is the biggest con to hit the whole world. All it says it that your manufacture is 'consistent' it does not say that you make 'high quality' products, but, the public perception is that an ISO 9000 company produce 'good quality goods'. Yes. I remember when I was first selling and fitting double glazing I proudly told a customer that the windows were built in compliance with BS5750. They burst out laughing and explained what that meant; I had no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
system 4-50 Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 3 hours ago, blackrose said: I've seen some poor work from them too if my friend's Colecraft is anything to go by. Just one boat so probably not representative. Is the bad work on the steel, which is Colecraft's core business, or the fitout? Is it a very old boat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam1uk Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Athy said: Mike Christian? I think that's the name they give to their basic boats. Someone will doubtless correct me if I'm wrong. As I remember it, Tyler and Wilson are uncle and nephew, and Mike Christian was a relative. Tim Tyler and Jonathan Wilson are brothers-in-law -- and Mike Christian is a made up name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, adam1uk said: Mike Christian is a made up name. Are you going to say that to his face? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, adam1uk said: Tim Tyler and Jonathan Wilson are brothers-in-law -- and Mike Christian is a made up name. Thank you for the correction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Athy said: Mike Christian? I think that's the name they give to their basic boats. Someone will doubtless correct me if I'm wrong. As I remember it, Tyler and Wilson are uncle and nephew, and Mike Christian was a relative. Mmm, it all sounds rather incestuous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 7 minutes ago, blackrose said: Mmm, it all sounds rather incestuous! Family businesses are hardly "incestuous" and not uncommon. The two blokes who run the associated Finesse company are also brothers-in-law! I think that the pair who build Fox boats are, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 hour ago, system 4-50 said: Is the bad work on the steel, which is Colecraft's core business, or the fitout? Is it a very old boat? Steelwork was fine, it was the fit-out - done by Colecraft themselves (or their contractors) on a 2006 or 2007 boat. The owner took me through and showed me lots of things they'd done wrong. You find these things over time. I found a few things on my LB, mainly sailaway fit-out related. The only thing "wrong" with the steelwork on my boat is the 6mm uxter plate. I think it should have been 10mm to match the base plate but that was their standard spec and I should have been aware of that beforehand. Collingwood do the same thing. Nothing wrong with a 6mm uxter plate per se, but I just can't really understand how it amounts to a significant cost saving for the builder? 2 minutes ago, Athy said: Family businesses are hardly "incestuous" and not uncommon. It was just a joke. But my point was it's not a family business. It's a series of related businesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, blackrose said: It was just a joke. But my point was it's not a family business. It's a series of related businesses. Fairy nuff - a series of related businesses run by a family, yes. From memory, boatbuilder Mike Heywood was also a relative, perhaps he WAS the uncle of one of them. Edited October 26, 2019 by Athy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted October 26, 2019 Report Share Posted October 26, 2019 On 20/03/2019 at 09:01, Boater Sam said: There are much more serious problems than a leak, like whole seams only welded on one side, rudder tubes not welded at the top to the deck, need I go on? All defects found and documented with Collingwood. I did not say all shells or every shell, I have seen good and bad, that's the problem you don't know which you have till its too late. https://noproblem.org.uk/blog/my-day-in-court-with-collingwood-boat-builders/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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