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Tim Lewis

CANAL & RIVER TRUST APPOINTS REGIONAL DIRECTORS

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As far as I know, none of us saw the job description or person spec for this role and apart from a short précis of their background, we do not have all the information on the candidates that was availiable to the recruiting panel.  Under the circumstances, I don't think we are qualified to comment on the suitability of any of the successful candidates.

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5 minutes ago, Nick D said:

As far as I know, none of us saw the job description or person spec for this role and apart from a short précis of their background, we do not have all the information on the candidates that was availiable to the recruiting panel.  Under the circumstances, I don't think we are qualified to comment on the suitability of any of the successful candidates.

We are qualified to say that looking at the resumes of the candidates, at least 4 have virtually no boating connections bar warships. 

It does show that CRT is moving further from boating and navigation in its direction which should be a big concern to us boaters.......who wish to keep boating. 

If I joined Canalworld to talk about property development or inclusiveness across modern transport to work methods then I would be happy.  

As a boater , I am worried.

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It seems strange that these posts have been filled without having been advertised, or did no one on here see them advertised.

It strikes me as last gasp restructuring because the first generation failed to meet their goals; not that I consider it likely that those goals were achievable.

Rather than feeling "inclusive", I feel "reclusive", and a foreboding sense of unwellness.

Edited by LadyG

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6 minutes ago, LadyG said:

It seems strange that these posts have been filled without having been advertised, or did no one on here see them advertised.

The latter I would say. These sort of posts are not usually advertised on waterways forums or magazines, but may well have been listed in the Executive Search pages of the broadsheet newspapers. Headhunters may have been involved too.

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9 minutes ago, David Mack said:

The latter I would say. These sort of posts are not usually advertised on waterways forums or magazines, but may well have been listed in the Executive Search pages of the broadsheet newspapers. Headhunters may have been involved too.

Just the same, if you want folks with some relevant background, it would seem a good idea to cast the net a bit wider than some London-centric recruiting organisation. I'm sure there are a few forum members who read the Sunday Times.

Edited by LadyG

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The appointment of the West Midlands regional manager is of candid interest. In the PR resume he has the least said about him yet controls a huge area. That area contains a large mileage of underused urban canals which still hardly see boats. Its an area where housing is at a premium for the lower end of the scale. CRT ,I think most of us believe is cash short and desperate for funds. Add in a person with this man's experience, in areas of urban degradation and the cauldron has a interesting mix. Where could you earn a lot of money quickly in a short time, one answer would be "Housing" in whatever form it took.  ai agree the waterway knowledge shared by this six is minimal, but what are they bringing to the table? I fear for the BCN becoming a housing estate network.

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1 hour ago, Laurence Hogg said:

The appointment of the West Midlands regional manager is of candid interest. In the PR resume he has the least said about him yet controls a huge area. That area contains a large mileage of underused urban canals which still hardly see boats. Its an area where housing is at a premium for the lower end of the scale. CRT ,I think most of us believe is cash short and desperate for funds. Add in a person with this man's experience, in areas of urban degradation and the cauldron has a interesting mix. Where could you earn a lot of money quickly in a short time, one answer would be "Housing" in whatever form it took.  ai agree the waterway knowledge shared by this six is minimal, but what are they bringing to the table? I fear for the BCN becoming a housing estate network.

Conjecture. 

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2 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Conjecture. 

There is always going to be a degree of conjecture Glenn no matter what we say , it is a fact however that any land with water frontage commands a Premium and provides a Leisure Facility literally at your front door , I think it inconceivable that won't be taken advantage of by CRT where possible . Why wouldn't you ?

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I'm just staggered that those at the top of CRT think that the best way to place Regional Directors in almost all these new regions is by external recruitment.  As far as I can see, only one of the permanent posts is being filled by someone already in CRT's employ.

 

Do they really have so little faith in those already employed by CRT, (including existing Regional Managers), that they think that in all but one case bringing in someone with no prior waterways experience will be a better bet than using somebody already on the strength.  Don't forget that some regional managers that CRT recruited externally have already left CRT - hardly confidence giving.

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7 hours ago, Teasel said:

It's also a fact that positive discrimination - i.e. employing someone solely because they have a protected characteristic rather than because they are the best candidate for the job - is unlawful in the UK. If CRT has done this, they are breaking the law - it's discrimination.

On Radio 4 this morning they were interviewing some cricketing guy and he said that now for every vacancy they have to interview someone from an ethnic background. I may have the exact words wrong and I dont know what they do if someone who fits the criteria doesn't apply for the position

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1 minute ago, alan_fincher said:

I'm just staggered that those at the top of CRT think that the best way to place Regional Directors in almost all these new regions is by external recruitment.  As far as I can see, only one of the permanent posts is being filled by someone already in CRT's employ.

 

Do they really have so little faith in those already employed by CRT, (including existing Regional Managers), that they think that in all but one case bringing in someone with no prior waterways experience will be a better bet than using somebody already on the strength.  Don't forget that some regional managers that CRT recruited externally have already left CRT - hardly confidence giving.

I think you make an assumption when you say " no prior waterways experience " who says they are bringing them in for their experience of Waterways . Its effectively like Graduate Programs in Industry, there are plenty of Donkeys underneath who actually know the job , you are there to ostensibly Manage and the rest you pick up as you go .

4 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

On Radio 4 this morning they were interviewing some cricketing guy and he said that now for every vacancy they have to interview someone from an ethnic background. I may have the exact words wrong and I dont know what they do if someone who fits the criteria doesn't apply for the position

Managing by quota

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2 minutes ago, Parahandy said:

I think you make an assumption when you say " no prior waterways experience " who says they are bringing them in for their experience of Waterways . Its effectively like Graduate Programs in Industry, there are plenty of Donkeys underneath who actually know the job , you are there to ostensibly Manage and the rest you pick up as you go .

I do not consider their track record to date with a lot of the external recruitment for senior posts has been very good at all, though.

Can you point at some positive examples of senior managers that they have recruited externally, (and who have stayed!), who you consider have really enhanced the organisation.

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5 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

I do not consider their track record to date with a lot of the external recruitment for senior posts has been very good at all, though.

Can you point at some positive examples of senior managers that they have recruited externally, (and who have stayed!), who you consider have really enhanced the organisation.

I totally agree with you its been a shambles in my opinion but what can you expect from an organisation that employs checkers to ride up and down a Towpath every week to Log Boat Movements whilst at the same time advertising for Volunteers to fill their Posts , what Loyalty or Commitment does that behaviour imply ?

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17 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

On Radio 4 this morning they were interviewing some cricketing guy and he said that now for every vacancy they have to interview someone from an ethnic background. I may have the exact words wrong and I dont know what they do if someone who fits the criteria doesn't apply for the position

Yes - I heard that, I think the bottom line was to try and get the UK Asians to be as committed to cricket as the Asians in the Asian countries are.

 

The England and Wales Cricket Board is to implement a 'Rooney Rule' for all coaching roles in the national men's, women's and disabled teams.

It means that at least one applicant from black, Asian or minority ethnic (BAME) backgrounds will be interviewed for future jobs.

That follows the biggest study the ECB has ever conducted into cricket in South Asian communities.

The Rooney Rule was implemented in the USA's NFL in 2003.

Named after NFL diversity committee chairman Dan Rooney, it requires clubs in American football to interview at least one BAME candidate for each head coach or senior football operation vacancy.

The Football Association adopted a similar stance for positions in the England football set-up in January.

The study, which involved speaking to more than 600 people across the UK, has revealed that South Asian participation makes up 30% of the recreational game in the UK and 18% of the cricketing economy is contributed by fans of South Asian origin.

 

Agree or disagree - it is now a fact of life that companies have targets to employ BAME.

 

C&RT's main 'Diversity target' is for 5% of employees to be BAME, but have so far failed to achieve it.

They have also failed to meet their secondary 'Diversity' target of 25% of senior management must be female.

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1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Yes - I heard that, I think the bottom line was to try and get the UK Asians to be as committed to cricket as the Asians in the Asian countries are.

You recall Norman Tebbit... ;)

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3 minutes ago, WotEver said:

You recall Norman Tebbit... ;)

I'm assuming you are not referring to this quote

 

"Perhaps they should just push off back to their own countries"

 

But to this one :

 

"It's good to remember the unburied dead and the uncollected rubbish. Most of it can now be seen on the Labour benches in the House of Commons".

 

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36 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

On Radio 4 this morning they were interviewing some cricketing guy and he said that now for every vacancy they have to interview someone from an ethnic background.

I think it's the difference between 'positive action' and 'positive discrimination' - so you may be able (although its not clear) to reserve one space on a shortlist for people of a particular characteristic, but you can't actually give them the job unless they're the best one for it. Although, if there are two equally good candidates and one has a protected characteristic you can 'take the protected characteristic into account' as long as it's proportionate - that's difficult as its hard to show 'equal merit' between two candidates with different experience.. Positive action would usually mean increasing training for particular groups, or proactively encouraging people from particular groups to apply etc.. there's a Standard Note here - file:///C:/Users/user/Downloads/SN06093%20(1).pdf. 

 

That SN is a bit dated, but positive discrimination is still unlawful. 

Edited by Teasel

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5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

No, this one:

 

A large proportion of Britain's Asian population fail to pass the cricket test. Which side do they cheer for? It's an interesting test. Are you still harking back to where you came from or where you are?

 

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1 hour ago, Laurence Hogg said:

The appointment of the West Midlands regional manager is of candid interest. In the PR resume he has the least said about him yet controls a huge area. That area contains a large mileage of underused urban canals which still hardly see boats. Its an area where housing is at a premium for the lower end of the scale. CRT ,I think most of us believe is cash short and desperate for funds. Add in a person with this man's experience, in areas of urban degradation and the cauldron has a interesting mix. Where could you earn a lot of money quickly in a short time, one answer would be "Housing" in whatever form it took.  ai agree the waterway knowledge shared by this six is minimal, but what are they bringing to the table? I fear for the BCN becoming a housing estate network.

I think it is the obvious route out, sometimes the obvious solution works, provided someone knows what they are doing, and why.. 

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1 hour ago, Parahandy said:

There is always going to be a degree of conjecture Glenn no matter what we say , it is a fact however that any land with water frontage commands a Premium and provides a Leisure Facility literally at your front door , I think it inconceivable that won't be taken advantage of by CRT where possible . Why wouldn't you ?

And it is all guesswork and spinning a story. 

I’vE stumbled in a good pub. 

So I’ll carry on tomorrow 

as in post tomorrow

 

Edited by Goliath
A

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1 minute ago, Goliath said:

And it is all guesswork and spinning a story. 

I’vE stumbled in a good pub. 

So I’ll carry on tomorrow 

as in post tomorrow

 

Good Man take care going on and off the Boat , be a shame to lose you now ?

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3 hours ago, LadyG said:

It seems strange that these posts have been filled without having been advertised, or did no one on here see them advertised.

It strikes me as last gasp restructuring because the first generation failed to meet their goals; not that I consider it likely that those goals were achievable.

Rather than feeling "inclusive", I feel "reclusive", and a foreboding sense of unwellness.

 

3 hours ago, LadyG said:

Just the same, if you want folks with some relevant background, it would seem a good idea to cast the net a bit wider than some London-centric recruiting organisation. I'm sure there are a few forum members who read the Sunday Times.

Perhaps I am the only forum member who reads the Sunday Times -

 

https://www.thefloater.org/the-floater-february-2018/what-will-become-of-the-waterways-managers

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15 minutes ago, Parahandy said:

Good Man take care going on and off the Boat , be a shame to lose you now ?

I’ve a lot of practice.  

thank you.

 

Will post again as soon as  I’m safe and sound at home on board. But don’t wait up. 

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42 minutes ago, Goliath said:

I’ve a lot of practice.  

thank you.

 

Will post again as soon as  I’m safe and sound at home on board. But don’t wait up. 

Home? 

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10 hours ago, WotEver said:

No, this one:

 

A large proportion of Britain's Asian population fail to pass the cricket test. Which side do they cheer for? It's an interesting test. Are you still harking back to where you came from or where you are?

 

Indeed, I know Millwall supporters who left Peckham half a century ago.  And residents on the Costa del Sol who refuse to be thought of as anything other than British.

 

 

 

It may be that these new regional directors will find it easier to unite CRT and its paying customers than others have - but that is hope winning over experience ......

11 hours ago, Parahandy said:

I think you make an assumption when you say " no prior waterways experience " who says they are bringing them in for their experience of Waterways . Its effectively like Graduate Programs in Industry, there are plenty of Donkeys underneath who actually know the job , you are there to ostensibly Manage and the rest you pick up as you go .

11 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

sadly, new people in middle management are employed to listen attentively to those who gave them their handsome new pay-packets and their shiny new lap-tops.    In  my experience they tend to flog the Donkeys, accuse them of being stubborn, and overburden them, to the point at which they cannot do the job, and instead of being recognised as donkeys become labelled dinosaurs.

 

Remember when Richard Parry was appointed - and he promised to listen? He even set up lots of structures to enable him to listen.  Thing is he hasn't listened - he doesn't even bother to comply with his own customer service standards.  

 

Ear to the ground or head in the clouds - it has to be one or the other and what they used to term Blue Sky thinking is the latter.

 

 

 

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