Mooring off side

[Sanddancer]

Advice needed a farmer has offered to let me leave my boat on his land. I'll not be living aboard so what permission do I need if any?.

Thanks in advance

[alan_fincher]

On what canal or river?

 

This may well affect the answer, but on most canals that fall under Canal and River Trust, they will need to give permission for the mooring, and you will have to pay them at the "End of Garden" rate, which is usually about half what one of their unserviced towpath moorings in the area would cost you. This is in addition to anything you pay the farmer, unless he already has his own agreement with CRT and is paying them something himself, in which case his charge to you would normally reflect that, unless he is being very generous to you.

[lydfordcastle]

Just to add to Alan's answer, if the farmer already has an agreement with C&RT then you need not apply to them for permission but you should specify the mooring when applying for a cruising license. If the farmer has no agreement, you need to apply to C&RT for a mooring license and the cost will be as Alan said. Such an application or renewal is not available on-line and has to be done by post or personal visit. Either way you can be pretty sure that one of the enforcement team, or whatever they are called nowadays, will eventually spot you wherever you moor and if you're not compliant, expect a letter.

[David Mack]

Creating a new mooring, if that is what this is, requires CRT approval. There is a policy of removong online moorings, and it is by no means certain that CRT will give that approval.

[Cloudinspector]

Contact CRT and find out if it a recognised mooring. We were offered a really nice mooring by a farmer but It wasn't recognised by CRT and they wouldn't accept it as a home mooring.

[system 4-50]

Advice needed a farmer has offered to let me leave my boat on his land. I'll not be living aboard so what permission do I need if any?.

Thanks in advance

If its on his land and not in the water you'll need a different set of permissions. (Somebody had to say it!)

[ditchcrawler]

If its on his land and not in the water you'll need a different set of permissions. (Somebody had to say it!)

Why am I thinking South Oxford and a hole in the field right now.

[Sanddancer]

So it would be wiser if I contacted the CRT and not the farmer. It's on the Leeds and Liverpool near Accrington and there are no crt moorings near by the farmer wants to create about 20 moorings in time.

[Alan de Enfield]

So it would be wiser if I contacted the CRT and not the farmer. It's on the Leeds and Liverpool near Accrington and there are no crt moorings near by the farmer wants to create about 20 moorings in time.

 

It is normally the 'land owners' responsibility to apply to C&RT for permission to make moorings, I doubt that C&RT will even talk with you.

There was an example (quoted on this forum) where some one was buying a house on the canal side and would only buy the house conditional on getting the mooring rights. The 'buyer' had to get a letter from the 'seller' stating that the 'buyer had their permission to discuss the subject with C&RT.

[bottle]

When/if the farmer gets permission.

 

He can then offer you a mooring

 

As to how your 'rental' of the mooring and the need for CRT to be paid is between you and the farmer.

 

You either pay the farmer for the whole lot and he pays CRT

 

or

 

you pay the farmer for the mooring and CRT for the permission.

[David Mack]

 

It is normally the 'land owners' responsibility to apply to C&RT for permission to make moorings, I doubt that C&RT will even talk with you.

Somewhere on the CRT website they say that they will usually allow a single offside end of garden mooring if you own a canalside house, subject to any operational restrictions e.g. too close to a lock or bridge or in a particularly narrow section. A block of new farmers field moorings looks rather unlikely to me. But I doubt the farmer has looked into this.

[Sanddancer]

Would I be fined if I moored up and the farmer has not got permission for a mooring? Or would I only get a warning?

[David Mack]

When you apply for a licence you either have to declare a home mooring or that you are a continuous cruiser. If your home mooring is not acceptable to CRT they will soon tell you. If you declare you are a CCer then you have to move to another place every 14 days.

[nikvah]

It seems to me that you could declare a home mooring and CRT can not, or do not, check with the declared Marina. I've even heard that the Marina do not have to reveal a list of their moorers to CRT. A more cunning man than I might declare a mooring a week away from their actual mooring and appear to be regularly cruising to a favoured location and back.

[Alan de Enfield]

It seems to me that you could declare a home mooring and CRT can not, or do not, check with the declared Marina. I've even heard that the Marina do not have to reveal a list of their moorers to CRT. A more cunning man than I might declare a mooring a week away from their actual mooring and appear to be regularly cruising to a favoured location and back.

 

And then you wonder why C&RT do what they do.

[NilesMI]

A more cunning man than I might declare a mooring a week away from their actual mooring and appear to be regularly cruising to a favoured location and back.

 

But CRT boat loggers do visit marinas in which boats are required to have a CRT licence. The boat would never be seen at its declared home and the cunning man's plan would be rumbled, followed by the serving of a notice.

 

No doubt he would complain that he was being harassed by the Evil Empire and start another interminable thread on CWDF.

[Sanddancer]

Thanks everyone will explain to farmer the rules and let him decide in the meantime I'll just move every 14 days.

What is the accepted distance for the move? A mile or more?

[Paul C]

Thanks everyone will explain to farmer the rules and let him decide in the meantime I'll just move every 14 days.

What is the accepted distance for the move? A mile or more?

 

There is no distance set in the legislation, although there are other requirements to be met, to "continuously cruise". You should make yourself familiar with these requirements and be happy you can meet them. There's plenty of threads (and debate) on this forum, and plenty of other resources searchable on the internet which will help you out.

[NilesMI]

What is the accepted distance for the move? A mile or more?

 

As Paul C says, there is a good deal of debate on the subject of what is actually enforceable.

 

CRT's current guidelines. https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/media/library/633.pdf

[nikvah]

 

And then you wonder why C&RT do what they do.

Yes, I do wonder about why CRT do what they do - the poetry, and the duck crossings, and the florescent banners, and the chuggers etc.

[Paul C]

It seems to me that you could declare a home mooring and CRT can not, or do not, check with the declared Marina. I've even heard that the Marina do not have to reveal a list of their moorers to CRT. A more cunning man than I might declare a mooring a week away from their actual mooring and appear to be regularly cruising to a favoured location and back.

 

The danger with that approach is it raises the bar a bit, to fraud. If you're not doing anything wrong, there is no need to fraudulently invent a mooring. CRT can check mooring details with a marina and the marina operator can put a clause into their mooring agreement to that effect. Some may not, but it is unlikely that a marina operator will want to be dragged into a dispute (especially if a moorer DOESN'T moor there). Also most marinas allow CRT data loggers entry and they regularly check the details of boats moored there.

[ditchcrawler]

 

But CRT boat loggers do visit marinas in which boats are required to have a CRT licence. The boat would never be seen at its declared home and the cunning man's plan would be rumbled, followed by the serving of a notice.

 

No doubt he would complain that he was being harassed by the Evil Empire and start another interminable thread on CWDF.

My boat has not been at its declared mooring since the end of June and it has not overstayed anywhere in that time.

[Canal321]

So it would be wiser if I contacted the CRT and not the farmer. It's on the Leeds and Liverpool near Accrington and there are no crt moorings near by the farmer wants to create about 20 moorings in time.

Why must it be a farmers field that you moor in? There are no CRT mooring in that area but I know of at least 3 recognised off towpath moorings on that stretch. There's: Altham marine, Clough Bank, or Knotts bridge, all would consider you for a spot and have services such as water and electric.

[Mike Todd]

Thanks everyone will explain to farmer the rules and let him decide in the meantime I'll just move every 14 days.

What is the accepted distance for the move? A mile or more?

As said, there is not specific formula in the legislation and almost every attempt by CaRT to give an indication of what might be in their collective mind when considering whether they are convinced that your mooring pattern constitutes 'continuous cruising' (it is they that have to be convinced, not you) have been derailed by those who want to push the boundaries as far as possible.

 

You might, however, ask yourself - or better still a stranger - whether moving one mile every 14 days can reasonably be construed as being bona fide on a journey, especially if your 'miles' are alternately in opposite directions. Much depends on whether you want a quiet life, confident that what you are doing is perfectly legitimate and anyone trying to say otherwise is engaging in harassment, or whether your chosen lifestyle demands that you do all that you can to push the boundary such that you are always in conflict with those that want to push it just that little bit further in the opposite direction.

 

None of the above is meant to indicate support or opposition for those who live permanently aboard not those that choose not to have a home mooring, but simply to point out that living near an ill-defined crumbling cliff edge always means that you awake each morning to see whether you have survived the latest rock fall.

 

Your choice!

[magictime]

What is the accepted distance for the move? A mile or more?

 

A mile should be fine, but to keep CRT happy you must have an acceptable cruising range over the course of a year as well as moving an acceptable distance every 14 days. They've said anything less than 15-20 miles is unlikely to satisfy them. Given that the area you're talking about is lock-free for 23 miles, you really shouldn't struggle to do the bare minimum (although why and whether you'd want to with so much glorious cruising on your doorstep is another question...)