A very Scary passage!

[Chewbacka]

Can't find a picture of a kebon the Internet, but it is a bit like a garden rake with extended tines and a long handle.

Do a Google search using - keb canal rake

[Chertsey]

 

No doubt, but when you're descending these locks and the paddle is opened, it's not scary and it doesn't take full power to avoid being slammed into the lower gate, so what's different here?

 

MP.

Well, I can only cite my experience in Colwich lock, when a top paddle was left slightly open - it wasn't really noticeable - and that somehow created a sufficient flow with both bottom paddles open to draw the boat back, and there was nothing I could do to stop it. The upshop of that experience was the new General Regulation that when I scream you drop the paddles first and argue later.

 

That may or may not be relevant to this case , but certainly counterintuitive things can happen when you have paddles open at both ends.

[magnetman]

A more typical keb design is shown below:

Or the Volunteer's actions might have made the boater move directly in the path of a falling meteorite.

But hey - its always satisfying to have someone else to blame for all the bad stuff that life throws at you to deal with.

Havw you been through many locks with other people working the paddles in a way that you did not ask them to??

Edited September 26, 2016 by magnetman

[alan_fincher]

Or the Volunteer's actions might have made the boater move directly in the path of a falling meteorite.

But hey - its always satisfying to have someone else to blame for all the bad stuff that life throws at you to deal with.

 

Hmmm,

 

Are you really from the Isle of Wight, as your profile suggests.

 

Based on this and some of your other posts, I could be tempted to think you are actually based in Hillmorton!

[MtB]

Or the Volunteer's actions might have made the boater move directly in the path of a falling meteorite.

But hey - its always satisfying to have someone else to blame for all the bad stuff that life throws at you to deal with.

 

When you first turned up here some of your contributions were quite amusing. But now they are just banal.

 

I suspect you have no boating experience, or just here to cause trouble.

[churchward]

Yesterday, we ascended Foxton locks, a flight we are very familiar with. Boat wise, it was fairly quiet. After waiting for four to descend, it was our turn as the first of two ascending.

 

All went well initially. Me on the tiller and Ali working the locks. Moving up into an upper chamber,we had a problem. The gates would not shut, with something jamming under them, very possibility a fender. After several unsuccessful attempts of trying to blow the offending object off the cill, Ali located a Velocky. Now our expectation was he would fetch a Keb and try to remove the object, but he knew better.

 

Without any consultation he instructed his colleague to open the paddles on the lower gates, with me in the upper chamber. And I mean fully open! Suddenly, the water was pouring out and it took full power to prevent the boat at the very least being drawn over the cill. Ali, realising what was happening, instructed him to close the paddles, Now! You do not argue with Ali, believe me...

 

What concerned me was the total lack of communication. It could have all gone horribly wrong. His attitude was that he was the "Expert". Ali pointed out it was our boat in the lock, not his.

 

Had he said that he was going to slowly release the water whilst I was in the upper chamber, in order to expose and then remove the offending item, fine. But he said nothing other than to instruct his colleague to open the paddles.

 

We never did find out what the obstruction was. It cleared whilst I was madly trying not to be drawn back over the cill. But it was a sobering experience.

 

Be careful out there...

Firstly, I am glad it was just a scare and not something worse and that you are all OK.

 

I agree with the views that think the lock assistant should have discussed the actions with you first and sought your permission given that you were not in an emergency situation that required immediate action. I think Alan Fincher's advice in post #6 is right.

 

We had almost an opposite experience recently at Grindley Brook staircase. When going into the middle chamber we grounded midway in. We were ascending and there was not enough water in the middle lock. I shouted up to the assistant I was stuck and he just said there was nothing he could do. I said in reply he had better call out the troops and close the canal then as given I was stuck I wasn't going anywhere or alternatively he could get the other lock keepers to let some water down from the top chamber and get some more water in this one. The other lock keepers knew what to do and with the help of my crew we got floating again.

[QCat]

Well, I can definitely see why a Keb is useful. They look like the sort of thing that an angry mob waves when storming the vampire's castle!

[magnetman]

Well, I can definitely see why a Keb is useful. They look like the sort of thing that an angry mob waves when storming the vampire's castle!

Or the sort of thing an angry boater waves when approaching an incompetent volunteer assistant maybe that's why they don't put them by locks anymore.

[johnmck]

The form Alan kindly provided the link for, now completed and sent into the ether. I hope our experience and the reporting of it, may prevent any repetition.

[bizzard]

They used to keep a Keb on a rack up at the top lock house at Foxton, well, when I was last up there there was For deep locks Kebs are sometimes operated with reins and two blokes. Two pairs of ropes tied to the lower Keb part, two ropes passing up to a bloke on one side of the chamber and two ropes passing to a bloke up on the other side They can then yank it back and forth along the cill with more oomph to shift heavy bits of masonry. Used more I think on wide locks though. Well Lea and Stort anyway.

[magnetman]

 

Sounds like a good system. A proper keb on a long handle is very heavy so I could see that being effective.

[bizzard]

Sounds like a good system. A proper keb on a long handle is very heavy so I could see that being effective.

Yes. We were stopped at Latton lock on the Stort once because of gate that wouldn't close. We all tried with boat poles, we could feel the obstruction but couldn't shift it. phoned BW and they turned up next morning and did as I described, it was a dirty great lump of masonry from the lock wall. They quite easily shifted it out of the way with that tackle.

Also stopped at Cowroast lock once, same trouble. There they used to keep a keb on a rack in the lock house garden.

Edited September 26, 2016 by bizzard

[magnetman]

All hail British Waterways

(seriously)

[bizzard]

All hail British Waterways

(seriously)

Yes, they were a jovial couple of chaps, we made them tea while they had a skive.

[Scholar Gypsy]

I've only once used a keb - when a paddle rack (at Broadmoor lock on the South Oxford) dropped off the bottom of the paddle gearing, and ended up in the bottom of the lock. It was quite a long walk to Cropredy lock, where I borrowed it from.

 

I also have a small grappling anchor, which has been quite effective at moving eg a lump of masonry that was stuck on a bottom cill.

[Ally]

Eeek! I'm sure Ali will make c&rt fully aware and illicit the appropriate response.

[Victor Vectis]

The upshop of that experience was the new General Regulation that when I scream you drop the paddles first and argue later.

We do exactly the same.

 

And I'd agree about the effect of a top paddle left open.

Are you really from the Isle of Wight, as your profile suggests.

I'd put money on West Wight.

 

Therer are some funny people out there!

 

Or the sort of thing an angry boater waves when approaching an incompetent volunteer assistant maybe that's why they don't put them by locks anymore.

We're on the Calder& Hebble @pres, using a pickaxe handle for a handspike.

 

It might come in useful if I want to rob a bank en route.

 

(Now where did I put that balaclava?)

 

[Chewbacka]

We do exactly the same.

 

And I'd agree about the effect of a top paddle left open.

I'd put money on West Wight.

 

Therer are some funny people out there!

 

Careful what you say about the Isle of Wight - Ofsted chairman quits after Isle of Wight 'inbreeding' comments

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/2016/08/23/ofsted-chairman-quits-after-isle-of-wights-inbreeding-comments/

[dogless]

The form Alan kindly provided the link for, now completed and sent into the ether. I hope our experience and the reporting of it, may prevent any repetition.

It's always easiest to do nothing. After the passage of a little time, and when the heart beat returns to normal, it's all too easy to file it under 'can't be arsed'.

 

So greenie, and thank you.

 

Rog

[alan_fincher]

The form Alan kindly provided the link for, now completed and sent into the ether. I hope our experience and the reporting of it, may prevent any repetition.

 

Well done.

 

If everybody did this when something happens, then I think CRT would have a fuller picture, and certainly Tony Stammers, head of health and safety told us firmly that that is what they want to happen.

 

I have just sent you a PM in respect of this.

[johnmck]

Well finally, a few days ago, Ali had a call back in regard to our report. We waited to see if there would be any feedback, but as time passed, thought the report had been filed!

 

Lee King (you just gotta smile), rang to say that the issue had been addressed with the staff concerned. The locky concerned has been spoken too at length and now understands the possible consequences of his actions. They are holding "What we have learned" sessions for volunteers and will use our incident as an example, reinforcing the message, that the helmsman is in charge.

 

Ali suggested that volunteers without any boating experience,should have a trip, up/down the flight, on a boat, so that they can experience the environment from the boaters perspective, whilst in the lock. Especially as this is a staircase. All the volunteers will also receive further training.

 

So, apart from the delay, a result that may prevent a repetition.

[dogless]

Well done you, and a pleasing outcome all round I suggest.

 

Thanks

 

Rog