Making The Turn At Hawkesbury - Got to love this picture!

[luctor et emergo]

 

An efficient stern thruster from the butty though, and there are some convenient strapping posts besides the corner of the bridge - I used on once

 

Richard

You mean the momentum of butty pushing the stern of the motor? Then the stern would have ended up further in the basin to allow the bow to swing that far over...

 

The strapping posts make sense, hence my comment regarding manhandling.

[zenataomm]

It just makes getting to the pub easier .... quick hop, step and a jump across the cabin tops.

[RLWP]

You mean the momentum of butty pushing the stern of the motor? Then the stern would have ended up further in the basin to allow the bow to swing that far over...

 

The strapping posts make sense, hence my comment regarding manhandling.

 

And if you use both? Strapping from the front of the cabin to the post while the butty pushes the motor around?

 

There are a lot of tricks and secrets to handling a loaded pair that aren't obvious - and I don't know what they all are

 

Richard

It just makes getting to the pub easier .... quick hop, step and a jump across the cabin tops.

 

Reminds me of Odana and Black Beauty's wedding. I got most of the way across Old Turn like that

 

Richard

[Laurence Hogg]

I don't find anything odd with this picture, the Joey boat has just come out of the lock and the large Woolwich is about to enter, the butty tied up on the left is probably with one of the large Woolwich motors. Ladybank is in the turn on its way to destination. The pair on the cottage side are probably "holding in" for fuel or the shop.Excellent busy picture, both Woolwich motors retain their panelling and the Fenchurch St address is visible so imho dating the picture to late 1930's

Edited November 12, 2014 by Laurence Hogg

[Derek R.]

The water cans are very plain, is that any indication of age?

 

Its a great photo !

 

Possibly red white and blue in respect of the Coronation 1937. Not to say this was 1937, but from then on.

[David Mack]

Interesting to note that Ladybank's tiller is painted with multiple short bands of colour, whereas the Woolwich behind appears to have a single colour (brass?) tiller.

 

The Woolwich has three bands on the swan neck. Ladybank has three or perhaps four, but the colours are in a different order. Was there a standard design for painting the GUCCCo swan neck and tiller?

Edited November 12, 2014 by David Mack

[alan_fincher]

 

Possibly red white and blue in respect of the Coronation 1937. Not to say this was 1937, but from then on.

 

Ladybank was only a few months old at the start of 1937, so I don't think it unreasonable to suggest the picture is 1937 onwards!

[Tony Dunkley]

I don't find anything odd with this picture, the Joey boat has just come out of the lock and the large Woolwich is about to enter, the butty tied up on the left is probably with one of the large Woolwich motors. Ladybank is in the turn on its way to destination. The pair on the cottage side are probably "holding in" for fuel or the shop.Excellent busy picture, both Woolwich motors retain their panelling and the Fenchurch St address is visible so imho dating the picture to late 1930's

 

No, I don't think there's anything odd about it either.

The southbound pair's butty (the loaded one under the bridge) is making things a bit difficult for 'Ladybank' because the stern end of it will stop the fore-end of 'Ladybank' swinging as it would normally do, so he might need to go forard with a shaft, and he will need to be careful not to catch the blade(s) on the stones that stick out underwater below the copings at the Coventry end of the bridge hole because he's closer to them than would be usual.

The butty that's against the side on the left will certainly belong to the motor that's virtually alongside of it and about to go into the lock, but that loaded motor nearest the camera looks more like a little Woolwich to me. If it is a big boat it's got a hell of load on it, not far out of the guard by the mast, and it's got that rise up to the counter that the little boats had but was absent on the big ones . . . definitely a Woolwich though, from the shape of the rams head.

What a great picture indeed, if only the cut was still like that.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Tony Dunkley

[Ray T]

I doubt that. Engines move boats not people and a bit of bumping and banging would be neither here nor there, which was my first thought when I saw this great picture.

 

Modern "shiny paint below gunwale level, don't you dare touch me" brigade please take note.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

 

Different time, different era.

 

A scene full of atmosphere however.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Ray T

[luctor et emergo]

To clarify, I didn't mean to infer that there was something wrong or fixed with the photo, but rather that it shows a bit of an extrdinairy occasion, like a modern city centre crossroads with the traffic lights on the blink.. ?

I do think that the motor nearest the camera is going to have trouble getting round, certainly without help at the front.

[Tony Dunkley]

 

An efficient stern thruster from the butty though, and there are some convenient strapping posts besides the corner of the bridge - I used on once

 

Richard

 

There used to be some metal brackets( leftovers from rollers that were there at some time presumably) on both sides of the bridge at around shoulder/head height at the end closest to the stop lock, and some boatmen preferred to get round the turn (when loaded, not usually when empty) with a cotton line (80-90 foot) from the motors' T-stud onto those brackets, made off fairly short to start with to get the motors' fore-end under the bridge and then let to run out, but still kept tight, as the motor got further round the turn. The butty was kept up very short, almost on the motors' fenders, and didn't need steering. The advantage of doing it like this if only two handed was that as soon as the motor was pretty well round the turn, the butties' steerer could go and draw off the stop lock if it was against them. One of the Blue Line (ex Barlows) pairs, Jim Collins favoured this method.

[RLWP]

Thanks Tony, that's fascinating

 

Richard

[Tony Dunkley]

To clarify, I didn't mean to infer that there was something wrong or fixed with the photo, but rather that it shows a bit of an extrdinairy occasion, like a modern city centre crossroads with the traffic lights on the blink..

I do think that the motor nearest the camera is going to have trouble getting round, certainly without help at the front.

 

Yes,you're right , he's too far under the bridge without the fore-end swinging enough because of the butty being in the way and his fore-end is likely to be in the bank before he gets round the stern of it, so he may well have to get up forard with a long shaft. Someone commented further back about engines rather than people moving boats about, well, in respect to canal boating, that's just rubbish because butties, loaded and empty frequently had to be bow hauled, in single locks for instance and boats in general often needed the use of a long shaft when getting in or out of side basins (or 'holes') like the Jam factory at Southall.

[RLWP]

There's a lot of satisfaction in moving a boat about with a shaft. I know several boatyards that do it, and they make the job look very elegant

 

Richard

[Ray T]

From A Canal People:

 

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Edited November 12, 2014 by Ray T

[Tony Dunkley]

Ha, I reckon they're jammed solid and have clearly all made a right pig's ear of it. Must have spent lunchtime in the Greyhound and will probably still be there when it opens for the evening.

 

Is that what you really think, or are you just trying to live up to your name ?

[Tam & Di]

 

There used to be some metal brackets( leftovers from rollers that were there at some time presumably) on both sides of the bridge at around shoulder/head height at the end closest to the stop lock, and some boatmen preferred to get round the turn (when loaded, not usually when empty) with a cotton line (80-90 foot) from the motors' T-stud onto those brackets, made off fairly short to start with to get the motors' fore-end under the bridge and then let to run out, but still kept tight, as the motor got further round the turn.

 

I've still got the 90' cotton line we used to use. It doesn't serve any useful purpose with "Friesland" in France though

 

Tam

[magnetman]

From A Canal People:

 

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edit

Nice picture

Edited November 12, 2014 by magnetman

[luctor et emergo]

edit

Nice picture

Indeed, but don't show it to the safety elvin... ?

[furnessvale]

 

Yes,you're right , he's too far under the bridge without the fore-end swinging enough because of the butty being in the way and his fore-end is likely to be in the bank before he gets round the stern of it, so he may well have to get up forard with a long shaft. Someone commented further back about engines rather than people moving boats about, well, in respect to canal boating, that's just rubbish because butties, loaded and empty frequently had to be bow hauled, in single locks for instance and boats in general often needed the use of a long shaft when getting in or out of side basins (or 'holes') like the Jam factory at Southall.

I was, of course referring to boats that have engines. With the best will in the world I doubt even you could make the engine on the butty do the work.

 

However, the practice of using the motor to draw the butty into a single lock is well known and does save hard labour.

 

George ex nb Alton retiired

From A Canal People:

 

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[/url]rope turn

Thanks for those photos which rather prove my point.

 

The shaft is being used on an unpowered butty.

 

The engine is being used on the motor because it is available.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[RLWP]

I like that second photo of Laura Carter strapping the boat around. It would put the bow exactly where it is shown in the original photo

 

Richard

[Dan Gereaux]

Must bear in mind that BW in their wisdom reduced the width quite a bit outside the "Greyhound" . As I have said elsewhere, we must be the only country in Europe that keeps reducing the width of our canals!

I wondered how they got boats round with others moored outside the Greyhound - when & why was the width reduced?

[Athy]

I wondered how they got boats round with others moored outside the Greyhound - when & why was the width reduced?

Perhaps to allow access to motor vehicles?

These days, quite a bit of the space is taken up by tables belonging to the pub.

[archie57]

Reduced in width about 20 years ago for ease of piling - I saw it being done

[Proper Charlie]

 

Is that what you really think, or are you just trying to live up to your name ?

It was an attempt at humour, one that obviously missed the mark.