And another thing. Slowing down.

[Tesla]

 

What we seem to forget here is speeding is not just about rocking boats. Its about the canal and the wild life.

 

The Canal

High speed (breaking wash) causes a disproportionate amount of damage (bank erosion) than slower speeds (no breaking wash). 4 mph is a maximum not a must. On wider canals that's fine, on narrower canals 3 mph or less should be the order of the day.

 

Whether or not your wash breaks is not jus down to the speed you normally do. As you travel along the width varies as does the depth. The narrower/shallower the canal the lower the speed at which your wash will break.

 

You may be travelling at a speed that doesn't break wash if you travel in the centre of the canal but if you meander to the side then your wash will break when it didn't in the centre. This is because by moving closer to the bank you have effectively narrowed the canal on that side and of course the water is shallower closer to the edge.

 

Now there you are driving your boat keeping a good look out forward how can you be expected to see what is going on behind you? Well if you stopped steering your boat with your arse you might position your self in such a way that you can easily look back from time to time to see what is happening with your wash and adjust accordingly (its part of being a good boater).

 

The Wildlife

More especially at this time of year many birds are nesting often at the waters edge. 4 mph can swamp a nest of eggs or drown chicks. You , therefore, are a murderer. Yes I know the canals were here before the wildlife but then the birds were here before you.

 

Not all fish manage to get out of the way of your propeller. I often see fish with a prop gash floating on the water. Some fish are shredded so finely by morons using too much power to move off or stop that the remains never get to float.

 

The Boats

Now when tied up my boat rarely moves (fore & aft) anyone wanting to see how this is done is welcome to stop on their way past and ask. But there are times when rings, bollards, or firm ground are not available. You can argue all you like about mooring on soft ground but at the end of the day some visitor moorings are posted where the towpath is soft (the 14 day moorings at Shipton are along a soft towpath). I don't give a monkeys what you think, or what common sense says, people moor where they feel its nice, where they feel they can enjoy the canal or the local pub or, provided you haven drowned them, the chicks.

 

The canals have changed their use, they are no longer a trade route, but a leisure park. They will never ever return to being a trade route however much the Greenies might want it. People come to the water for the peace and quiet. They come to slow down and chill. If you want to go racing around might I suggest you get a bus or hire a car. If you have to get somewhere in a hurry might I also suggest you get out of bed earlier (lets call it better planning). Whilst you are entitled to be on the water it would be much better if you paid attention to the environment and inhabitants of the canals and stopped abusing yourself with the tiller handle. Who knows you might even start to enjoy it!

Amen[/quottoo

 

Amen from me also. I also prefer to take it slow, I have a push bike if I need to go faster. Complaining about speeding boats need not be a reflection of how you tie up, you can probably tell if a boat is going too fast based on how quickly it slides past the window...

[PhilR]

 

 

There are cormorants on every single canal I've visited and that's quite a few canals.

 

They are extremely shy and don't like human presence so are not often seen other that flying away.

 

I've seen plenty of grey herons but not cormorants ;-)

[mark99]

 

I've seen plenty of grey herons but not cormorants ;-)

 

They are a real headache to inland fishery managers as they strip out the "silver" fish between 4oz and 2lb. They have moved inland <at least partially> due to coastal waters being denuded of fish by overfishing.

 

They stab and wound bigger fish too and slash wound too.

 

I see them everywhere (usually flee-ing). I would say they are more cautious than herons.

 

Cormorant damage

 

http://www.cormorantbusters.co.uk/damage.htm

 

Most cormorants have had their meal and are sitting in trees/wires before most boaters get out of bed.

Edited May 26, 2014 by mark99

[PhilR]

Berni Walking pace is 4 mph you appear to be part of the problem!

 

 

Ah but I can't walk at 4mph having twisted my ankle earlier...

 

Maybe it is a perception issue I have, and the boats I think are going at walking pace are actually moored...

 

I don't think 4 mph is a typical walking pace. The army march at 4 mph. My own observations suggest that the typical walking speed of the average towpath walker is between 3.1 and 3.4 mph. On narrow canals my average cruising speed is usually within the same range so I often find myself having long conversations from the tiller with walkers who are alongside on the towpath. If they are going any distance I frequently invite them aboard.

 

I reckon speed is a perception which is frequently miscalculated by most people. Other factors usually cloud their judgement.... engine sound probably being the main one.

 

 

They are a real headache to inland fishery managers as they strip out the "silver" fish between 4oz and 2lb. They have moved inland <at least partially> due to coastal waters being denuded of fish by overfishing.

 

They stab and wound bigger fish too and slash wound too.

 

I see them everywhere (usually flee-ing). I would say they are more cautious than herons.

 

Cormorant damage

 

http://www.cormorantbusters.co.uk/damage.htm

 

Most cormorants have had their meal and are sitting in trees/wires before most boaters get out of bed.

 

Mark

 

Is this just an issue in the South East? I don't think I have ever seen a cormorant on any of the the North West canals. I have seen plenty on the sea in N Wales. Maybe the fish stocks out at sea up here are adequate for them and they are not tempted inland?

[maty]

I'm moored on a linear mooring ( my choice ) I would say that moor than 50% off boats pass my boat faster than walking speed , they know they are as they won't look you in the eye when I'm outside my boat , really don't understand why someone feels the need to do that. Seems a shame that so many people are in rush ..

[Timleech]

 

 

Mark

 

Is this just an issue in the South East? I don't think I have ever seen a cormorant on any of the the North West canals. I have seen plenty on the sea in N Wales. Maybe the fish stocks out at sea up here are adequate for them and they are not tempted inland?

 

We occasionally have them stopping here (Dutton) for a few hours or a day or two, luckily they don't stay long.

Regulars on the River Weaver, though.

 

Tim

Lots of boats at Crick had the "please pass on tickover" signs on them. But none had the " we'vd moored properly - go as fast as you like!" signs.

 

Now that's just silly.

 

Yes lots of people don't tie up properly, but even those who do tie up properly would soon be complaining if everyone followed that instruction.

 

Tim

[mark99]

Mark

 

Is this just an issue in the South East? I don't think I have ever seen a cormorant on any of the the North West canals. I have seen plenty on the sea in N Wales. Maybe the fish stocks out at sea up here are adequate for them and they are not tempted inland?

 

 

Hi Phil,

 

I saw them in Chester on the canal there.

 

The most I've seen however is London way viz Lea Valley, Thames Valley and Colne Valley. (Roosting in tree's on large reservoir/islands). They often work marina's early morning.

 

They are known as the black death by fisherman.

[Jerra]

 

They are a real headache to inland fishery managers as they strip out the "silver" fish between 4oz and 2lb. They have moved inland <at least partially> due to coastal waters being denuded of fish by overfishing.

 

They stab and wound bigger fish too and slash wound too.

 

I see them everywhere (usually flee-ing). I would say they are more cautious than herons.

 

Cormorant damage

 

http://www.cormorantbusters.co.uk/damage.htm

 

Most cormorants have had their meal and are sitting in trees/wires before most boaters get out of bed.

The GB population has increased by 27% over the last 40 years. In winter 80% of the tetrads (map squares 2km x 2km) have cormorants in them. It is basically only the mountain areas which don't.

[Barry]

I don't think 4 mph is a typical walking pace. The army march at 4 mph. My own observations suggest that the typical walking speed of the average towpath walker is between 3.1 and 3.4 mph.

 

I totally agree. A couple or more years ago I regularly used to walk 8 miles in as fast a time as I could. My best time was 2 hours dead and at that walking pace I was working hard, accelerated breathing rate and heart rate and concentrating to maintain the pace.

 

I agree that most people think they are doing 4mph but are probably closer to 3. People walking in a group and chatting are probably closer to 2

[PhilR]

I'm moored on a linear mooring ( my choice ) I would say that moor than 50% off boats pass my boat faster than walking speed , they know they are as they won't look you in the eye when I'm outside my boat , really don't understand why someone feels the need to do that. Seems a shame that so many people are in rush ..

 

What is your perception of walking speed? Mine is between 3 and 3.5 mph.

 

Every boat is different, as is every bit of canal. It is impossible to quote speeds as a guideline. Hopefully, everyone with a few days experience on the canals should be able to judge when they are travelling too fast - usually it has nothing to do with speed and more to do with common-sense.

[Maffi]

 

 

There are cormorants on every single canal I've visited and that's quite a few canals.

 

They are extremely shy and don't like human presence so are not often seen other that flying away.

Bullsh1t I have seen dozens of cormorants on the Thames who were not in the slightest bit shy, but never yet on this end of the Oxford.

 

What is your perception of walking speed? Mine is between 3 and 3.5 mph.

 

Every boat is different, as is every bit of canal. It is impossible to quote speeds as a guideline. Hopefully, everyone with a few days experience on the canals should be able to judge when they are travelling too fast - usually it has nothing to do with speed and more to do with common-sense.

If you are traveling at 3 mph and your wash is breaking then you are traveling too fast.

[mark99]

Bullsh1t I have seen dozens of cormorants on the Thames who were not in the slightest bit shy, but never yet on this end of the Oxford.

 

 

Well that's a fine, ignorant and dismissive turn of phrase.

 

I don't think I want to discuss anything further with you thanks - you might want to look at those photo's of cormorant damaged fish I posted before you dismiss the possibility. On clear waters (without propellors) the cormorant stab and slash damage to fish can be quite widespread.

Edited May 27, 2014 by mark99

[Ssscrudddy]

Lol, everything I have seen written about Herons says they are pretty tame, but the only ones I have seen (around Northampton) you cant get anywhere near them, they tend to fly away if you just look at them.

[bizzard]

That just shows how little understanding you have of the design of the design of cruisers in general.

 

Which is still no excuse for not tying up sufficiently in the first instance.

 

It's comments like that which make us wonder why we bother slowing down. If we are always going to be perceived as going too quickly no matter how much we slow down why bother at all?

Really NC, then how about you bestowing upon the forum your interpretation of why many smallish cruisers wander about so and how to help the problem, apart from changing the helms person.

[Felshampo]

 

Now that's just silly.

 

Tim

Pot, kettle, black.

[mango]

I would advocate tolerance, but speeding boats can be reported to CRT. On their emergency contact page, they make it clear that this is not an emergency issue:

 

For other non-critical events you can call us between 8am and 6pm, Monday to Friday on 0303 040 4040 or email. If it’s out of hours, please wait until the next day rather than contact the emergency number. Examples include:

• low or high water levels
• reports of damage, vandalism
• reports of fly tipping or animal carcasses
• reports of unlicensed or speeding boats
• customer facility breakdowns e.g. water point, pump-out

 

For the record, I have never reported speeding boats to BW/CRT.

Edited May 27, 2014 by mango

[bizzard]

You might be confusing springs with other things. A spring is usually a second rope, but is normally attached to the same stud as the main mooring rope - it simply goes in the opposite direction (rearward from the bow, or forward from the stern). Therefore it won't come into contact with cabin paintwork, though it might rub the paint on the gunwhale. But paint is only there to protect the metal, and you surely must expect it to get marked or scratched. Safety and security must be more important than spotless appearance!

Ideally especially if your moored say on a waterway that has varying water levels or is tidal, to stop the boat ranging back and forth you need 2 spring lines as long as the boat at least from bow and stern, crossing in the middle and anchored down as near as possible to the edge of the bank, the further in on the bank they're anchored down the less the spring effect, the boat can move and try to pivot around. Breast ropes need to be slackish and regularly checked and adjusted for level of water. On a water course that's water remains level with no rise and fall you can keep the breast ropes a bit tighter. These long spring lines or even shorter spring lines would almost certainly chaff on stern cabin corners of a trad boat and almost certainly on the lower edges of cratch boards and cover, and chaff on taffrail stanchions of a cruiser narrow boat when tied to the usually positioned Tee studs and stern dollies with not fairleads positioned for the purpose which is usually the case.

Edited May 27, 2014 by bizzard

[Felshampo]

I agree that most people think they are doing 4mph but are probably closer to 3. People walking in a group and chatting are probably closer to 2

Naismith's rule, ( used by walkers since 1892! ) has walking speed as 3.1 miles an hour.

[Naughty Cal]

Really NC, then how about you bestowing upon the forum your interpretation of why many smallish cruisers wander about so and how to help the problem, apart from changing the helms person.

Small cruisers will usually have either an outboard engine or an inboard with an out drive. They are also very shallow at the bow and very sensitive to a slight touch of the helm. Hence the wandering around a little. A touch more speed makes them square up.

 

That said you can get some shaft driven cruisers with keels and they will cruise straight as a die. It depends what boat you have as to which steering you get. We have the former but find you do get used too it given enough time.

 

I would advocate tolerance, but speeding boats can be reported to CRT. On their emergency contact page, they make it clear that this is not an emergency issue:

For other non-critical events you can call us between 8am and 6pm, Monday to Friday on 0303 040 4040 or email. If its out of hours, please wait until the next day rather than contact the emergency number. Examples include:

• low or high water levels
• reports of damage, vandalism
• reports of fly tipping or animal carcasses
• reports of unlicensed or speeding boats
• customer facility breakdowns e.g. water point, pump-out

For the record, I have never reported speeding boats to BW/CRT.

Never mind speeding boaters can someone turn the wind down and around please?

 

It's like riding a bucking bronco here in Wells harbour today.

 

Even the fishing boats have stayed in harbour today!

[gazza]

As NC says, its usually a lack of experience at the helm, plenty of oversteering causes em to wander about.

 

I can keep our 16' Mayland on a dead straight course - we have had it for 21 years though....

 

The 27' Elysian is also excellent, we have had that 5 years now. Shaft drive with a good deep keel.

If you want a bit of sport watch the hirers leave bridge boats at Ely. Similar boats to ours, all weaving like drunkards due to lack of experience and over correction.

[Phil Ambrose]

Zig-Zag boats was the name they went by on the Broads, people would turn the wheel and when nothing happened immediately would turn it some more then have to turn back etc etc, what nobody ever tells them is to use small inputs on the wheel and wait to see what happens.

Phil

[gazza]

Always good sport watching them weave their way along the Yare

[Athy]

Always good sport watching them weave their way along the Yare

I think that anyone witnessing our first boat hire adventure on the Canal du Nivernais in a little 23 foot-ish cruiser would have observed similar progress. We did improve as the week went on, never hit a lock gate after the third day.

 

 

 

Well, not hard.

[gazza]

I think that anyone witnessing our first boat hire adventure on the Canal du Nivernais in a little 23 foot-ish cruiser would have observed similar progress. We did improve as the week went on, never hit a lock gate after the third day.Well, not hard.

Like most things in life, practice makes perfect :-)

[Traveller]

Zig-Zag boats was the name they went by on the Broads, people would turn the wheel and when nothing happened immediately would turn it some more then have to turn back etc etc, what nobody ever tells them is to use small inputs on the wheel and wait to see what happens.

Phil

So true, Phil. They also forgot to tell them that with a forward steering position it is the back that moves! Our old Broads cruiser had a few battle scars as a result.

Colin