Who does their own blacking?

[Water Rat.]

My little boat (34ft) is in need of blacking this year. So, who does their own and who pays someone else to do it for them? And - how does it cost out? Do we pay more down towards London? Would it be worth my while coming out a bit further north?

 

Should I do it myself? I did make some enquiries today where I am moored and a do it ones self job looks to be about £400 'ish with them doing a power wash. Also - if I do that - what if it rains for the week I book her out? Can you still put the stuff on in the rain?

 

Would really value advice here. I had it done by a boat yard last time and thought it was not too bad but think they charged a fortune for anodes and other stuff done so a tad reluctant to go there again.

[Mac of Cygnet]

I get mine done every two years. The biggest cost is craning out and in. I don't do it myself simply because even when painting a door I get covered in paint. £400 pound seems a bit steep just for pressure washing, but of course may include carnage. If anodes need replacing, they need replacing, but you should be consulted at the time about this.

 

I spotted the typo before posting, but thought I'd leave it!

 

Edited to say that I've just looked up the bill from November 2013, and for a 27 ft boat, including craning out and in, pressure washing, blacking up to the gunwales, but not the bottom, and supplying and fitting 2 new anodes, came to £488.81. I know this is a fair price because Nigel Stevens who owns Shire Cruisers where I moor and had the work done, is so punctilious that I cannot conceive of him overcharging anyone.

Edited February 18, 2014 by Mac of Cygnet

[nebulae]

Blacking the boat is easy so long as you 1)Dont want to clean off and black the bottom 2)have access to a power washer,preferably an industrial unit and 3) have good weather..The boat realy does need to be dry for the blacking to stick .Even if you do it yourself,you have still got to pay for the docking,so you want it to last. You might need a grinder,wire brush or one of the clever flail devices which are quite effective.The big advantage of doing it yourself is that you tend to look at the boat very closely.If there are any issues you will see them. We have found that the rollers sold to go behind radiators are the best application tools.With the long handle,less of the black stuff gets on you.Application with a roller puts on a thinner coat than a brush,so you probably need 3 coats.

[RLWP]

We did it once. We have paid to have it done every time since

 

You may draw your own conclusions

 

Richard

[Stilllearning]

We do ours every two years. The dry dock here is very reasonable, you can live aboard while you do the blacking. We go in on a Friday morning, they pressure wash it, by at the latest Saturday morning we are putting the first coat on, and by Sunday evening finishing the third, if feeling energetic, otherwise two coats is enough. Use rollers to put on the blacking, except in the tight corners where a cheap 2" brush is needed and in between coats put them in a bucket of water, then just shake and roll them on a dry surface before using for the next coat.Then it's back out on Monday morning. Cost is, as they say, on application, but £400 for a DIY job seems a bit pricey.

Oh, and if you are one of those boaters that collects canal plaques, there's a rare one for going in the dock here.

[dmr]

Its a bit cheaper if you do it yourself, but you will probably want a friend or two to help, but then you have to take them to the pub each night and buy food and beer, plus if you liveaboard you will probably regard the brushes and trays etc as throw away items so this all eats into the savings.

Main advantage of DIY is that you know you have done a good job. If you are going to pay a boatyard then it might be worth going for a shot blast and epoxy job

 

............Dave

[Water Rat.]

I get mine done every two years. The biggest cost is craning out and in. I don't do it myself simply because even when painting a door I get covered in paint. £400 pound seems a bit steep just for pressure washing, but of course may include carnage. If anodes need replacing, they need replacing, but you should be consulted at the time about this.

 

I spotted the typo before posting, but thought I'd leave it!

Pulling her out and putting her on a slip is £222 for the five days plus £65 for pressure washing. The blacking and bits and bobs I estimated at about another £100.

 

Carnage comes for free

[junior]

I bought my boat back in September and had it blacked by the broker as part of the deal. Technically it's not due for another year and a half but if I can afford it i'm going to try and do it myself at the end of the summer.

 

One of the community boats I volunteer on went into dry dock to be blacked back in November. I offered to go and help so I could see what was involved and have a practice on somebody else's boat.

 

The boatyard (Uxbridge) did the power washing and left us to do the painting. It took 2 of us only a few hours to do a full length 70ft boat and I'd like to think we did a very thorough job. It dried over night and we did a second coat the next day.

 

All in all I found it very easy, quite fun, and I hardly got a splash of paint on me. One thing I found was that I got very intimate with the hull and could see exactly what was where and what condition it was in. For this reason as well as the fact it wasn't difficult at all, I will definitely do my own boat next time it needs doing.

[Psycloud]

We did ours this year although we did pay the marina to crane it and jet wash it as we don't have a jet washer - I did then rub over it with a knotwheel on an angle grinder just to be sure no loose stuff was left on. The blacking cost us around £125 for the large tub of Intertuff 16. We got 4 coats out of that on a 64' boat. Took about 2hrs per coat with a radiator roller.

[Mac of Cygnet]

Pulling her out and putting her on a slip is £222 for the five days plus £65 for pressure washing. The blacking and bits and bobs I estimated at about another £100.

 

Carnage comes for free

 

See the edit of my post re costs.

[Mrs Tawny Owl]

The first time we did it was in a covered dry dock in November which meant that after about 3,30 in the afternoon we couldn't see anything!

 

We did pressure wash her then wire brush her off really well, not sure she's been done as thoroughly since.

 

We've had her done at Hilmorton by Grantham bridge boat services a couple of times since then, they've done the best job that we've paid for. They also have a good look at the boat and let you know if they spot any problems.

 

Worried us silly when they thought the bottom was getting a bit thin, but after a hull survey she was fine, just need 4 new shoes. Not sure we'd have spotted that ourselves.

 

I think it was in the region of about £700 last time (but I don't really remember), however we are twice as long as you so a lot more boat to black.

 

Sue

[Chop!]

Here is a link to our blog post, with the prices and what we found worked and what was a waste of money tool and brush etc. wise :-

http://narrowboats-freyja-and-christina.blogspot.co.uk/2012/09/im-guy-with-bitumen-quiff.html

 

Hope this helps, obviously you'd need to drydock it or lift it out.

 

Good luck, let us know how you get on.

[blackrose]

We did it once. We have paid to have it done every time since

 

You may draw your own conclusions

 

Richard

 

You're right Richard, it's a pig of a job if you do it properly, so I don't understand anyone who says it's easy!

 

Painting on the blacking itself is easy, but if you just slap it on over a pressure washed hull without first taking off the old flaking blacking then the new blacking won't last long. Then again, even with good prep and a couple of coats of underwater primer it only lasts 4 years max, so perhaps those who just slap it on over a poorly prepped hull have the right idea?

 

I've done my widebeam twice on my own. Pressure wash, prep with wire wheels on an angle grinder to take of the outer layers of flaking paint and any rust; two coats of Primocon underwater primer; two coats of Rylards Rytex and two coats of Rylards Premium. No wonder I'm knackered by the end of the week!

 

Edit: The only downside about having it done at a yard is that few yards do it properly.

Edited February 18, 2014 by blackrose

[Androo]

I just don't trust boatyards, well the one near us anyway to do the job properly. When our boat was out last year the boatyard were blacking a boat next to us and,

 

the

 

person doing it put the blacking on so thinly and two coats at that. When he'd finished it looked a real poor job and the boat was back in the water on day 3. I like to apply it quite thick regardless of how many

 

tubs I use and, give it 48hrs in between coats.

 

IE: 57' boat 3 coats plus, 2 extra on the waterline = 5 tubs = 25ltrs

 

If you have the time do it yourself and save some money and have the satisfaction knowing the job has been done well after all, boatyards when doing blacking want

 

the boat back in the water asap so they can crack on with the next one.

 

 

It is hard work and very messy especially at the stern when it drips on your face!

Edited February 18, 2014 by Androo

[alan_fincher]

Julie,

 

IMO the main problem is that the closer you are to London, the higher the costs - there are not enough facilities competing to give much chance of low prices.

 

I suspect this is more or less equally true whether you go DIY, or have the job done for you.

 

It may well be the case that if you arrange to have it done for you in one of the areas like Braunston, where there is far more competition, costs are not significantly higher than DIY near London.

 

My caveat would be that I think some that at first may look cheaper may "surcharge" you on length - i.e. they may quote a "per foot" cost, but may well say that anything below (say) 40 or maybe 50 feet is charged as if it were that length.

 

If doing DIY the advantages of picking somewhere with a roof can't really be over-stressed, but you'll not find many options at reasonable cost in the area you have the boat, I believe.

 

No suggestions, and don't even know where I'll be doing my next one.

[alan_fincher]

I like to apply it quite thick regardless of how many tubs I use and, give it 48hrs in between coats.

Great theory, and obviously best practice - no doubt about that. However, allowing for initial hull cleaning, and 48 hours drying off before it goes back, you really need a week out of water to be that thorough.

 

The problem Julie will find down here is that docks or slips are sufficiently in demand that a week out of water will cost a great deal of money, (and most likely just as much for her half length boat, as if she was docking a full length one).

 

The trouble is most slips or docks are single occupancy, and while you are using it, they can't and nor can anybody else, so it is not good business to let it to a DIYer, unless for quite a lot.

 

I suppose it is possible that somewhere that cranes it could allow you out for longer without racking up costs, as they can have a number out at once. There really are not that many such places down here, though, I think.

 

The other possibility is that sometimes in the past if Darren at Cow Roast knows he will be away for a week, and he has not found anyone to rent his slip whilst he isn't there, he will give you a week on there at a very considerably reduced charge - might be worth phoning an enquiry, at least, but it is a bit of a long shot.

[Water Rat.]

Hi Alan. Thanks for your imput. I too feel things are a little pricey down here. If I can find a reasonable option elsewhere I would bring her up. I am still investigating and will update my finds.

[Higgs]

You can't put blacking on over a wet surface. Weather is going to be a matter of luck, but in the summer you will have a better chance. On a hot day you should be able to get two coats on.

 

It should take less than an hour to do 34', if you're not used to it. After jetwash and dry, the blacking will be almost crystaline and can be skimmed with a scraper. You'll be lucky if the jet wash shifts every bit of crud. Normally, I wouldn't use high revolution bits of equiptment, they heat up the blacking and either clog or just push the softened blacking around.

 

I use the scrapper to lower any pit holes, these trap moisture and may not dry out thoroughly before blacking, if not reduced. The scrapper also clears off any filaments of vegetation which have been growing on the hull, below the waterline.

 

You'll need a 2" or 2 and a half inch brush for doing the seams and crevices. The roller should be 7 to 9" emulsion roller and tray. Those little 4" gloss rollers will take you forever. Have a bucket of water to throw the roller and brush into each day.

 

There's no use slapping thick coats on, as curing between coats can be variable and may not be thorough in the corners or seams. 3 good even coats.

 

Have a pair of overalls and a hat, because you're going to end up with some blacking on your head.

[Idunhoe]

I have done my boat myself every two years and like virtually every other job it's all about preparation. It is easier to pressure wash as soon as the boat is out of the water. The next, really messy, task is to wire brush all the loose old blacking off, for this I use an angle grinder fitted with a cup brush. Be warned if you do this properly you will get seriously dirty. Apply the first coat of blacking with a brush making sure that you get into all the corners. When this is dry apply the second (and subsequent coats) with a small roller. You will find that blacking is much easier to apply if it is first warmed, I stand the can in a bowl of hot water, refilled as required, which does the trick. The boat can then go back in the water when the final coat is dry.

Those boatyards offering a 24 hour turnaround (power wash plus blacking) cannot in my humble opinion be seriously offering an even half decent job.

[Higgs]

Those boatyards offering a 24 hour turnaround (power wash plus blacking) cannot in my humble opinion be seriously offering an even half decent job.

 

They can't. I wouldn't put mine in over a weekend and would prefer an out on monday and in the following monday. 5 days should be ok in the summer. If you have really good weather, 3 days in the summer.

[Dovetail]

I do it myself and for me I feel better about the boat afterwards as you have examined every square inch of the hull. The key to me is the first two days bloody hard work and then after that blacking with the best drying time possible and try for 35-48 hours drying before you go back in the water. During the drying time you can relax or as most people do try and do a few extras.

[Neil2]

There are a number of ways of looking at this, as all the replies so far have illustrated.

 

But as a financial exercise, say the yard charges £5 a foot plus slipping, bearing in mind they are going to do it in one day, that's quite a high hourly rate you are being charged for something most people could easily do themselves. It's not a skilled job so it really depends on how you feel about getting dirty/wet.

 

I think the best way to do it it find a yard that will do an in/out lift with a week between. Then there's no rush and you should be able to pick your weather.

 

Personally with the amount of diesel floating about on the canals these days I don't think every 2/3 years is often enough, and if you face the prospect of yearly blacking, having the hull blasted and epoxied/zinc sprayed starts to make sense. Especially if you are having to pay a premium for being in the "deep south".

[blackrose]

Hi Alan. Thanks for your imput. I too feel things are a little pricey down here. If I can find a reasonable option elsewhere I would bring her up. I am still investigating and will update my finds.

 

Middx & Herts Boat services at Winkwell (near Hemel) was the cheapest place I found anywhere near London for my widebeam. 230 quid for the week, but their pressure washer was 80 quid and if you needed a welder for putting your new anodes on it was another rip-off.

[Androo]

Great theory, and obviously best practice - no doubt about that. However, allowing for initial hull cleaning, and 48 hours drying off before it goes back, you really need a week out of water to be that thorough.

 

True. I usually allow 2 weeks for my blacking and, for some reason, my charges last year were £179 cheaper than 3 years previous. I didn't contest it.

 

Being up North does has it's advantages then.

 

An exodus of narrowboats to the North for blacking then. Ohh if only the Ribble Link wasn't in the way

Edited February 18, 2014 by Androo

[FadeToScarlet]

Just a tip: if you want argument winning ammunition to use forever with a significant other, black the boat with them and moan copiously when they drip blacking in your hair, then remind them of this in every disagreement.

 

Less effective a comeback now, but I still use it.....