Grand Union Canal through Birmingham

[Heartland]

A waterway little used these days, is the former Warwick & Birmingham Route into Birmingham, much of which was improved by the Grand Union (1932-1934). A current topic of interest is the future of the GUCCC depot in Sampson Road. In fact has it got a future? Also the boaters facilities there- I understand BW spent money on these, but are they used?

 

Ray Shill

[RLWP]

Yes, we have used the Sampson road facilities several times

 

I'm not sure why you think the GU is little used these days, we are rarely the only boat on that bit when we go

 

Richard

[nicknorman]

It is not used as much as the N Stratford route, but used far more than some chunks of the BCN. It certainly justifies having services, and these ones (I am presuming we are talking about what are known as the "Camp Hill top lock" services are very nice, we used them a couple of weeks ago. There is room for a couple of boats to be moored off the services, although the amount of space varies according to whether BW/CRT work boats are there. I spoke to a chap moored there (no signs, so its 14 days) and he said that as a CCer he spends 14 days there several times a year and has never had any trouble.

 

It is a useful location for safe mooring since the next is really in Brum centre (i wouldnt like to nightstop at Aston). He mentioned there had been plans to put mooring pontoons in the basin, which would seem eminently sensible to me, but for whatever reason this never actually happened.

 

It's a shame that there is no obvious historical info at these sites, I wasn't aware that it was formerly a GUCC depot although it was obviously something!

[RLWP]

The canals in southern Birmingham don't seem to attract the same kind of interest for historians as the BCN

 

Richard

[NB Lola]

We used it week before last, was quiet

[matty40s]

The services has had a 24 hour notice stuck up since you were last there Nick.

I came up Camp Hill out after the Garrison flight last week and have never seen so much rubbish (even in Brentford). The tinselled christmas tree near Hatton top is a relic of a failed weed hatch trip. There were 3 liveaboard boats in the service moorings so I continued to Catherine de Barnes, however, would have stopped had there been space as the flights had been hard work (3 weed hatch trips)

From there on it is almost as though you are not in the city.

It is a good canal out of the cuttings, but in the cuttings, the branches, logs, etc are underwater everywhere and it needs a good clear out. Top pound at Knowle locks was completely empty and took half an hour to fill, apparently this is a regular occurence. The section from Knowle to Hatton Top is a triumph of canal engineering, some of the embankments give amazing views.

[nicknorman]

The services has had a 24 hour notice stuck up since you were last there Nick.

I came up Camp Hill out after the Garrison flight last week and have never seen so much rubbish (even in Brentford). The tinselled christmas tree near Hatton top is a relic of a failed weed hatch trip. There were 3 liveaboard boats in the service moorings so I continued to Catherine de Barnes, however, would have stopped had there been space as the flights had been hard work (3 weed hatch trips)

From there on it is almost as though you are not in the city.

It is a good canal out of the cuttings, but in the cuttings, the branches, logs, etc are underwater everywhere and it needs a good clear out. Top pound at Knowle locks was completely empty and took half an hour to fill, apparently this is a regular occurence. The section from Knowle to Hatton Top is a triumph of canal engineering, some of the embankments give amazing views.

When you say "the services" I presume you mean the bit round the side, not in front of the actual services themselves?

 

Strange that there is now a 24hr sign considering we were told at the Brum CRT meeting that no signage had changed recently and they weren't in the habit of doing it without consultation. However I suppose at least one berth should be 24 hrs to ensure there is a bolt hole for mistimed passages.

Yes, it was worse on the way back in terms of rubbish - I think the strong winds in the intervening week had blown a lot of stuff in, but still not bad until the Camphill flight itself which was very rubbishy for the first couple of locks. We managed to avoid hitting any underwater trees. Just one weed hatch trip at the second lock for us - just lots of plastic bags.

Edited April 21, 2013 by nicknorman

[alan_fincher]

 

Strange that there is now a 24hr sign considering we were told at the Brum CRT meeting that no signage had changed recently and they weren't in the habit of doing it without consultation.

My memory of what CRT said at the Midlands meeting was different.

 

They may have said no recent changes, but said in that area that if they did make them there was no formal process, and were very surprised that in other areas a consultation was felt necessary.

 

As an aside, I personally rather like going in and out of Brum by the GU route, but I think the rest of my crew rather prefer the North Stratford.

[NB Lola]

My memory of what CRT said at the Midlands meeting was different.

 

They may have said no recent changes, but said in that area that if they did make them there was no formal process, and were very surprised that in other areas a consultation was felt necessary.

 

As an aside, I personally rather like going in and out of Brum by the GU route, but I think the rest of my crew rather prefer the North Stratford.

I can understand why. I found the route full of rubbish, and actually, to me, quite boring. Next time I will go via the Stratford. BTW the bottom of knowle needs some cutting back, my shite paintwork took another hit there

[nicknorman]

My memory of what CRT said at the Midlands meeting was different.

 

They may have said no recent changes, but said in that area that if they did make them there was no formal process, and were very surprised that in other areas a consultation was felt necessary.

 

Oh well, I bow to your superior recollective powers (because in truth I can't remember exactly what they said on that point!)

[alan_fincher]

I can understand why. I found the route full of rubbish, and actually, to me, quite boring. Next time I will go via the Stratford. BTW the bottom of knowle needs some cutting back, my shite paintwork took another hit there

I like any excuse to go up (or down) Farmers Bridge for a start.

 

I agree some of that stretch of the GU isn't the most interesting, but then equally I can't say the W&B between Kings Norton and gas Street is really any more fascinating.

 

We have never had much problem with rubbish or prop fouls on the GU either, but enough have complianed of it, I accept it must be a problem some times.

[pearley]

When you say "the services" I presume you mean the bit round the side, not in front of the actual services themselves?

 

Strange that there is now a 24hr sign considering we were told at the Brum CRT meeting that no signage had changed recently and they weren't in the habit of doing it without consultation. However I suppose at least one berth should be 24 hrs to ensure there is a bolt hole for mistimed passages.

 

Waterscape states 24 hour. As it hasn't been updated for some years (it still states Camp Hill as having washing machine and dryer which havn't been there for at least 3 years) I would assume that the original sign was removed by someone.

 

It is one of those locations where breasting up is to be expected.

 

I've never really understood why it is always on the winter mooring list given that one boat will take more than 50% of the available space.

 

Regards

Pete

[matty40s]

 

after coming up through this lot, the services would be quite welcome.

[RLWP]

Is it Christmas?

 

Richard

[Chris Pink]

£2.50? It's £5-6 down here.

 

nice bit of graffiti, the colours blend well with the brickwork and signs behind.

[matty40s]

Is it Christmas?

 

Richard

It is at Hatton Top now!!

 

£2.50? It's £5-6 down here.

I bet you leave with all your car parts still intact down there...

[nicknorman]

£2.50? It's £5-6 down here.

Read it carefully, it says "hand car wash" so you only get your hands washed by a car - ie they drive by through a puddle whilst you hold your hands out. Hence the price.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

The services has had a 24 hour notice stuck up since you were last there Nick.

I came up Camp Hill out after the Garrison flight last week and have never seen so much rubbish (even in Brentford). The tinselled christmas tree near Hatton top is a relic of a failed weed hatch trip. There were 3 liveaboard boats in the service moorings so I continued to Catherine de Barnes, however, would have stopped had there been space as the flights had been hard work (3 weed hatch trips)

From there on it is almost as though you are not in the city.

It is a good canal out of the cuttings, but in the cuttings, the branches, logs, etc are underwater everywhere and it needs a good clear out. Top pound at Knowle locks was completely empty and took half an hour to fill, apparently this is a regular occurence. The section from Knowle to Hatton Top is a triumph of canal engineering, some of the embankments give amazing views.

I've just come through Brentford, and it really is filthy, if I fell in, I'd prefer to take my chances on the K&A open sewer.

I'm on the way up to Brum so thanks for the local knowledge.

[magpie patrick]

The canals in southern Birmingham don't seem to attract the same kind of interest for historians as the BCN

 

Richard

 

Which is a pity. I know the BCN crams historic interest into almost every yard simply because the industrial activity was so intense but the canals leading to it have their fair share as well. In this case the length between Kingswood and Camp Hill contains five wide locks which replaced six narrow ones, themselves of unusual design, and the cuttings and embankments, whilst modified in the 1930's when the locks were widened, are part of the original 18th century concept. Following this Samson Road was the end of the London to Birmingham run (you wouldn't catch the average GUCCCo steerer on the North Stratford) and then five surviving narrow locks from when the canal was built, showing all the architectural details of the now ruined ones further south, but actually in use.

 

I've never had any trouble going through Camp Hill Locks, the graffitti is part of urban sub-culture and isn't necessarily associated with other problems

 

 

Read it carefully, it says "hand car wash" so you only get your hands washed by a car - ie they drive by through a puddle whilst you hold your hands out. Hence the price.

[Little Else]

 

after coming up through this lot, the services would be quite welcome.

Don't dis Chief Wiggum. This always make us smile when doing the Camp Hill locks unlike the lack of water in the last pound.

[Mike Tee]

We went up through there last summer, no problems at all.

Didn't have to go down the weedhatch once (unlike the bit between Gas Street and Wolverhampton where I was tempted to leave it permanently open!)

The whole area was very quiet, hardly any boats, very few people on the towpath - it was pissing down with rain the entire time though. The rain coming off spaghetti junction into the canal could have doubled as Niagara.

This year I'm taking no summer clothes at all so it should be OK.

[Ange]

First time we did Garrison and Camp Hill was a bloody nightmare. The canal ran out of water half way through Garrison and we were grounded on quite a long pound. Dave had to run ahead and let water down for what seemed like loads of locks. The water that was there was sludgy, murky, horrible stuff and the fact we were running on the bottom meant we picked up all the saris, anoraks, knickers and other deitris that the locals chuck into the canal. Various interesting prop clearings were required.

 

I swore never to go that way again.

 

Next time we needed to get to Lapworth the same route became the obvious choice. This time it was a breeze - in fact we had a few laughs with some local "characters" who helped us with the gates.

 

Both times the lack of other boats was noticeable. In fact it was with great excitement and many helloos that we greeted a passing boater.

 

I'd do that route again happily., I still hate Knowle though.

[Heartland]

I suppose, have been down this way a couple of times in recent weeks, I saw no boats moving, hence my original post. However is this area boring? Perhaps not historically. When it is considered the canal passed up the locks to Sampson Road on the way the Gasworks retort house still stands, then there is Sampson Road Wharves and the earlier Birmingham Bedstead factory site. James made cycles nearby and futher on Lanchester made cars, the BSA made guns, and motor bikes and as Tyseley Wharf is approached there were a host of firms like the Bakelite and Rover also had a works nearby.

 

As for being a clean canal, I doubt it, even boatmen of the 1860's complained of rubbish and dead dogs here. However it would be nice if a way could be found to improve this area. Yet all urban waterways have a challenge, with regards to educating those around. Laurence Hogg has often commented on the state of the Walsall Canal, which has similar problems, as well as a similar ethnic mix. Perhaps it is with the local communities that the CRT needs to look at ways for improvement. Clean up campaigns are only as good for a period of time. Those who cause the damage, and dump rubbish come back as the open access canal towpath, whilst ideal for the walker is also fertile ground for the litter lout and illegal dumping squad.

 

It would be useful, however, for the CRT to have a help line, text line or web page for those who notice graffitti, dumped rubbish or damage, as such records might find a way for combat.

 

Ray Shill

[GeoffS]

I went through Garrison and Camp Hill locks single handed last summer and, although I admit I have not yet covered massive amounts of the system, it was certainly the worst part I have seen. The rubbish was pretty constant although it was predominantly floating and I didnt have any trouble with propeller fouling. I am always interested from a historical perspective but I felt uneasy for most of the day but luckily only had one awkward moment at the top lock where I couldn't get the gate open and I had some attention from some locals. Luckily someone from the services came out and helped.

[nicknorman]

I went through Garrison and Camp Hill locks single handed last summer and, although I admit I have not yet covered massive amounts of the system, it was certainly the worst part I have seen. The rubbish was pretty constant although it was predominantly floating and I didnt have any trouble with propeller fouling. I am always interested from a historical perspective but I felt uneasy for most of the day but luckily only had one awkward moment at the top lock where I couldn't get the gate open and I had some attention from some locals. Luckily someone from the services came out and helped.

Camp Hill around the new bit does feel a bit exposed, but of course there are endless cars going past. We have always felt completely safe on the W&BJC (Garrison locks) ( FLW!) If I may, a tip for future ventures on the BCN is to engage with the locals so for example if you had asked them to help you get the gate open, they would probably have regarded it as a challenge and have been very helpful. After all, they are mostly just bored. But if you ignore them and/or show fear or disgust, that gets them going!