Rocinante Posted November 17, 2012 Report Share Posted November 17, 2012 Hi all, We're looking at buying a 1974 Harborough Marine narrowboat. Does anyone have any thoughts on their reputation as a boat builder? She is of course old and we want to make sure she's been built to last. Similarly, the current owner has told us that she was built with 6mm steel and has been surveyed & shows little pitting. 6mm seems quite thin to start with to us (our current boat - Colecraft 2007 - has 10m, 8m, 6m) does anyone have any thoughts on that? Thanks, Caroline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted November 17, 2012 Report Share Posted November 17, 2012 you must be mad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Evans Posted November 17, 2012 Report Share Posted November 17, 2012 There is nothing mad about buying a boat built in 1974 as long as you go into the purchase with your eyes open. Harborough Marine built a large number of boats, principally for hire firms with Anglo-Welsh springing very much too mind. Back in 1974, 6mm baseplates were the norm. If (and that's a big if) the baseplate and hull show little sign of pitting and corrosion that is a testament to the quality of the steel used. Before you commit yourself to buying the boat, you should commission your own hull survey - there is no point in relying on what the seller says - and find out what an independent surveyor says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted November 17, 2012 Report Share Posted November 17, 2012 You might wish to read another thread here from just a few days agao, where similar questions were raised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted November 17, 2012 Report Share Posted November 17, 2012 Caroline, she has lasted from then until now, that's 38 years, which suggests good original build quality. Is her top steel? Many Harboroughs were built with GRP tops which have a reputation of letting in water if not well maintained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koukouvagia Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 There's a fascinating history of Harborough Marine, Springer, Fernie Steel et al. in "The Boatbuilders of Market Harborough" link. Apparently the first Harborough boats were wooden with a steel counters made by nearby Springer Engineering. I wonder if any of these boats still exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 Yes, I have delved into it in the last few days whilst contributing to the "boat builder identification" thread. A good read and some fascinating, previously unseen photos. Through the book I discovered for example that 'Bunyip', a long n/b moored almost in the way beside Cropredy Cricket Club, is a Fernie and was built in 1973 as a hotel boat. As KKV says, there's plenty of info about Harboroughs too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timleech Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 (edited) There's a fascinating history of Harborough Marine, Springer, Fernie Steel et al. in "The Boatbuilders of Market Harborough" link. Apparently the first Harborough boats were wooden with a steel counters made by nearby Springer Engineering. I wonder if any of these boats still exist. I have a fairly distinct memory of seeing a brand new Harborough wooden boat with a wooden counter. Counter 'block' was hollow, built up from vertical strips. My memory has failed me before, though. Bear in mind that boats of that age are likely to have a 'wet bilge' and can suffer significant internal corrosion of the bottom as well as external pitting. It may well still have useful life in it, but you would be buying something which might be getting towards the end of its life. Tim Edited November 18, 2012 by Timleech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 Hi all, We're looking at buying a 1974 Harborough Marine narrowboat. Does anyone have any thoughts on their reputation as a boat builder? She is of course old and we want to make sure she's been built to last. Similarly, the current owner has told us that she was built with 6mm steel and has been surveyed & shows little pitting. 6mm seems quite thin to start with to us (our current boat - Colecraft 2007 - has 10m, 8m, 6m) does anyone have any thoughts on that? Thanks, Caroline The first narrow boat I looked at was a 57ft Harborough Marine with a GRP cabin top asking £20,000. I very quickly went off the idea of a GRP or wooden top, and noticed that, in general, boats without steel tops were worth quite a bit less than with. Apparently, Harborough built quite a few GRP topped boats, so you need to be awar - it's up to you whether you avoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 Apparently, Harborough built quite a few GRP topped boats, so you need to be awar - it's up to you whether you avoid. I think if it is a genuine Harborough, (rather than one of those "cloning" them), and 1974 build, it will almost certainly be GRP topped. happy to be corrected if wrong, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizzard Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 Yes 99% certain this will have a fibreglass top and wet bilge a 1/4'' base plate and probably 3/16'' hull sides 'mine did''. But they do handle beautifully and steer well in astern too though because of their proper shape. I did have to re-plate the uxter and swims on mine. Be vary very careful though as i should imagine that all of the ones that are left now will have had overplating done, so have a thorough hull survey done. It will almost certainly have an air cooled Lister SR2 or 3 in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 But they do handle beautifully and steer well in astern too though because of their proper shape. Curiously that is not my memory of Harborough boats, which I never felt handled well backwards. But perhaps I was just a crap steerer back then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keeping Up Posted November 18, 2012 Report Share Posted November 18, 2012 Mine was at least predictable in reverse. After being cut and lengthened badly so that she was shaped like a banana, she always went the same way. If that was the way you wanted to go in reverse, it was easy; if not, it wasn't even worth trying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Robinson Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 We have a 74' harborough marine boat. We did not a survey done and have paid for overplating to be done. The survey determined that the wet bilge be scrapped so new rear bulkheads had to be inserted. We have fitted a new lister LPW 3 engine and skin cooled it. Ikea provided most of the interior. She is called Foxton and is one of the original boats and we can now proudly take the heritage of harborough marine around the canals, as she once did for ABC boats. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 Welcome to the forum. I hope you have a '74, rather than a 74', boat, otherwise you may have problems going through locks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmr Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 If she really is 74' you wont be taking her very far ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 You may not be mad but deluded. Its a very old very basic hull, wet bilge for sure. Can you live with 2" of water under your feet? Spend on something later and better, this could be a terrible money pit with no hope of selling it on. TD' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: Its a very old very basic hull, wet bilge for sure. No longer, he tells us. Edited July 9, 2020 by Athy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 1 minute ago, Athy said: No longer, he tells us. The damage will have been done, long ago. These hulls seem to rely on lots of engine oil spills in the bilge, they had no separator in the engine area, to oil the base plate and hopefully slow the rust. Had one long ago, good in their day, now just scrap in my opinion. TD' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: The damage will have been done, long ago. These hulls seem to rely on lots of engine oil spills in the bilge, they had no separator in the engine area, to oil the base plate and hopefully slow the rust. Had one long ago, good in their day, now just scrap in my opinion. TD' You're not giving its proud new owner much encouragement! From what Mr. Robinson says, he's obviously had a hull survey, which would have revealed any faults and weaknesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, Athy said: You're not giving its proud new owner much encouragement! From what Mr. Robinson says, he's obviously had a hull survey, which would have revealed any faults and weaknesses. I would not wish to be responsible for encouraging anyone to spend a fortune on boats as old as this when there is little or no chance of recovering the cost or of keeping it afloat without pouring more money into the pit. Sorry if I am too much of a realist but my experience of old boats has made me like this, I can't help it. TD' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 16 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: The damage will have been done, long ago. These hulls seem to rely on lots of engine oil spills in the bilge, they had no separator in the engine area, to oil the base plate and hopefully slow the rust. Had one long ago, good in their day, now just scrap in my opinion. TD' Did you read this : 54 minutes ago, Stephen Robinson said: We have a 74' harborough marine boat. We did not a survey done and have paid for overplating to be done. The survey determined that the wet bilge be scrapped so new rear bulkheads had to be inserted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) Yes. To what extent does overplating add to the value of a boat that is 45+ years old? Alan, would you buy an overplated old boat? TD' Edited July 9, 2020 by Tracy D'arth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: Yes. To what extent does overplating add to the value of a boat that is 45+ years old? Alan, would you buy an overplated old boat? TD' In view of what you said : 25 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: The damage will have been done, long ago. 8 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said: Had one long ago, good in their day, now just scrap in my opinion. I would certainly buy a boat that needed overplating (just as the OP has). If the price reflected the work needed. I would not buy an overplated boat as I would have no idea to what standard the work was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athy Posted July 9, 2020 Report Share Posted July 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said: I would not wish to be responsible for encouraging anyone to spend a fortune on boats as old as this when there is little or no chance of recovering the cost or of keeping it afloat without pouring more money into the pit. I don't think that Mr. Robinson expects to make any financial gain out of the boat. Rather, he's approaching it as an enthusiast, just as people buy and renovate old cars, buses and even railway engines. This seems to me a laudable thing to do. After all, people buy ex-working boats which are far older, aware that they will need to spend money on them over the years. They do it because they like them. The O.P. has bought an ex-working boat, I for one hope that he gets pleasure and satisfaction from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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