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London moorings suspended for Eco Zone use only

 PUBLISHED: MONDAY, 08 MARCH 2021

THE Canal & River Trust is clearing boats from moorings in London that will then be used for Eco Boats moorings only.

These moorings will then have electric charging points for boats to plug into and will be bookable, Keith Gudgin reports.

No boat engines on generators

Once the sites are live, there will be a transition period of two years during which there will be no running of diesel engines or generators permitted on site.

During the trial, there will be a progressive encouragement for boaters mooring here to move from burning solid fuels to using electricity for their heating, hot water and cooking.

The first Eco Zones will be at King's Cross and Angel, either side of the Islington Tunnel on the Regent’s Canal.

Mooring suspensions

There were three phased mooring suspensions and towpath closures planned throughout the installation period, although only two were necessary during this time. The remaining date is to be finalised and will be advertised.

Zone 1: Colbrooke Row to Danbury Street—completed
Zone 2: Treaty Street to York Waycompleted
Zone 3: Caledonian Road to Muriel Streetwork suspended, and a revised date is to be confirmed.

Once open, the visitor moorings can be booked 14 days in advance via the Trust’s website, but boaters will require a  Meter Macs account to access the electricity supply.

Move from solid fuels

During the trial, there will be a progressive encouragement for boaters mooring at the sites to move from burning solid fuels to using electricity for their heating, hot water and cooking.

There is no information concerning the running of diesel heaters, but it is expected these too will be banned at the moorings.

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Edited by Alan de Enfield
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  • Alan de Enfield changed the title to First it was composting toilets, now it is moorings, running engines, diesel heating and solid fuel stoves

but boaters will require a  Meter Macs account to access the electricity supply

 

Meter Macs accounts, up to now, have only been available to those who have a CRT mooring with electric.

 

I've had a lot of correspondence with CRT over the years about all boaters accessing these power points in such places as Boston, Ocker Hill, Cuckoo Wharf, etc which have more hookups than permanent boaters and been told it's not possible.

 

 

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16 minutes ago, pearley said:

but boaters will require a  Meter Macs account to access the electricity supply

 

Meter Macs accounts, up to now, have only been available to those who have a CRT mooring with electric.

 

I've had a lot of correspondence with CRT over the years about all boaters accessing these power points in such places as Boston, Ocker Hill, Cuckoo Wharf, etc which have more hookups than permanent boaters and been told it's not possible.

 

 

Well it's about time there was someone in charge who can make it possible then.

I have been down that section near the tunnel on a windless and grey winters day and it was grim, breathing was most definitely affected just passing through. For boaters moored there and residents above, a few days like that must be horrible.

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No shortage of other pollution sources nearby though. But if this works, there will only be slightly more diesel fumes in the air than at the average non-London mooring with everyone running their engines and gennies simultaneously :) 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

No shortage of other pollution sources nearby though. But if this works, there will only be slightly more diesel fumes in the air than at the average non-London mooring with everyone running their engines and gennies simultaneously :) 

 

 

 

 

my dear chap, it's the thin end of the wedge! - Pipe smoking gentleman |  Meme Generator

 

 

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1 minute ago, peterboat said:

Chuffing hell its happening we are going green whether we like it or not 

So rip that Rayburn out, the diesel heating out and the generator as well. :)

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1 minute ago, Canal321 said:

So rip that Rayburn out, the diesel heating out and the generator as well. :)

No chance of my boat going to London it's to big! Its been nearly 3 months since the Rayburn has been lit along with the bubble stove and the generator is in hibernation! I am decorating at the house until its warmer 

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We have been very late in the UK in providing electricity at temporary moorings. Years of boating in France got us used to pluging in overnight to heat the hot water and use the electric kettle and often it was at no cost outside the major cities. Guess what happened then - loads of live aboard dutch barges and their like came along and plugged in, staying for months, blocking the moorings  and using the sockets for welding resulting in a lot of them burning out.

In London they could have easily put in cables while they are taking out the high voltage lines that were put in in the late seventies.I would be more than happy to use them if they were available.

In terms of London moorings I think this is just the start of the war on continuous cruisers, I noticed the plans for the 'safety zones' on the Lea. Just like everything else - a few can get away with it but you can't really have thousands of boats pumping out diesel  and stove fumes in a confined location.

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13 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Move from solid fuels

During the trial, there will be a progressive encouragement for boaters mooring at the sites to move from burning solid fuels to using electricity for their heating, hot water and cooking.

 

 

Are they providing mains hookup or are they expecting everyone to do all this from their solar panels/batteries? ?

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

Are they providing mains hookup or are they expecting everyone to do all this from their solar panels/batteries? ?

 

13 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

London moorings suspended for Eco Zone use only

 PUBLISHED: MONDAY, 08 MARCH 2021

THE Canal & River Trust is clearing boats from moorings in London that will then be used for Eco Boats moorings only.

These moorings will then have electric charging points for boats to plug into and will be bookable, .....but boaters will require a  Meter Macs account to access the electricity supply.

 

One assumes that as mooring time is limited and the boats must move to other moorings (that do not have a hook-up facility) the boats will need to retain their existing engine, battery charging, heating and lighting methods but just not use them.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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I wonder if the booking process for the eco-moorings will include the ability to open a Meter Macs account ?  Otherwise the usage will be limited ,as I doubt many of the CCers have such an account.

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Just now, Quaffer said:

I wonder if the booking process for the eco-moorings will include the ability to open a Meter Macs account ?  Otherwise the usage will be limited ,as I doubt many of the CCers have such an account.

 

Ah, but that will prove there isn't much demand for moorings in central London ...

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This all sounds fine in theory, I'm not convinced they've thought through the consequences of:

 

"there will be a progressive encouragement for boaters mooring at the sites to move from burning solid fuels to using electricity for their heating, hot water and cooking."

 

Hot water fine, most boats have or can easily add an immersion heater. Cooking not so easy, not only means ripping out gas/diesel cooking facilities and replacing them with electric, but an electric hob and oven draw a *lot* of power, which means the incoming supply is going to have to be a lot chunkier than the conventional 16A -- at least 30A (7kW) is needed as an absolute minimum.

 

Heating is a bigger problem still; unless the boats install heat-pumps (expensive, difficult to find space for) they're going to have to install electric heating, which is also a big rip-up job. And running costs for non-heat-pump-electric heating are horrendous, which is why very few houses use it. And if not heat-pump, another 4kW or so per boat of incoming power is needed. Unlike cooking, this is also needed for many hours per day especially in winter, so this is where the big cost issue is.

 

Which means that to power all-electric boats in winter for hot water/cooking/heating, CaRT are going to have to provide something like a 50A spur per boat. Yes it's unlikely that all boats will need maximum power at the same time just like houses in a street, but still a conventional 16A supply isn't going to come anywhere close. It's very different to providing plug-in shore power to conventional boats which don't use electricity for everything.

 

Maybe they've thought of this, maybe not. But the electricity bills for boaters are going to be horrendous, probably not far off what they are for a small house or flat today.

Edited by IanD
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14 hours ago, pearley said:

but boaters will require a  Meter Macs account to access the electricity supply

 

Meter Macs accounts, up to now, have only been available to those who have a CRT mooring with electric.

 

I've had a lot of correspondence with CRT over the years about all boaters accessing these power points in such places as Boston, Ocker Hill, Cuckoo Wharf, etc which have more hookups than permanent boaters and been told it's not possible.

 

 

This is excellent news! I had a CRT mooring for a while, with a metermacs account.  Gave up the mooring a couple of years ago as I wasn't using it enough.  I've just checked, and my metermacs account is still active!  Lovely Jubbly!

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2 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

This is excellent news! I had a CRT mooring for a while, with a metermacs account.  Gave up the mooring a couple of years ago as I wasn't using it enough.  I've just checked, and my metermacs account is still active!  Lovely Jubbly!

I assume the booking period for these towpath moorings will be for a maximum 14 days,so maybe if it's up and running when you are in London this is another option.I believe there will be no charge at this site.

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This metermacs thing seems a little complicated.

The marina group that we are currently in have 'smart credit cards', you can fill up the card (with £'000s if you want).  you can go to any bollard 'dump' your electric, plug in and just use it.

When you leave the mooring you put your card back in it takes the balance of the leccy and puts it back on your card. Next night, new mooring / marina, put your card in and repeat, when you leave, you reload the card and off you go.

 

If C&RT are putting in new bollards they could use a similar system.

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Just now, Quaffer said:

I assume the booking period for these towpath moorings will be for a maximum 14 days,so maybe if it's up and running when you are in London this is another option.I believe there will be no charge at this site.

This is exactly my thought.  I was planning on Paddington Basin, max stay 1 week, no electric - £84.  14 days in Islington with hook-up would be an excellent alternative.

Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

This metermacs thing seems a little complicated.

The marina group that we are currently in have 'smart credit cards', you can fill up the card (with £'000s if you want).  you can go to any bollard 'dump' your electric, plug in and just use it.

When you leave the mooring you put your card back in it takes the balance of the leccy and puts it back on your card. Next night, new mooring / marina, put your card in and repeat, when you leave, you reload the card and off you go.

 

If C&RT are putting in new bollards they could use a similar system.

If CRT did that, you'd find they'd use different cards in different parts of the country.  And nobody in the offices would be sure which card machines were where.

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5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

This metermacs thing seems a little complicated.

The marina group that we are currently in have 'smart credit cards', you can fill up the card (with £'000s if you want).  you can go to any bollard 'dump' your electric, plug in and just use it.

When you leave the mooring you put your card back in it takes the balance of the leccy and puts it back on your card. Next night, new mooring / marina, put your card in and repeat, when you leave, you reload the card and off you go.

 

If C&RT are putting in new bollards they could use a similar system.

Even ignoring the high bill cost problem, standard 16A bollards can't cope with all-electric (hot water, heating, cooking) boats... ?

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19 minutes ago, IanD said:

Which means that to power all-electric boats in winter for hot water/cooking/heating, CaRT are going to have to provide something like a 50A spur per boat. Yes it's unlikely that all boats will need maximum power at the same time just like houses in a street, but still a conventional 16A supply isn't going to come anywhere close. It's very different to providing plug-in shore power to conventional boats which don't use electricity for everything.

 

Most cruising boats are unlikely to go out much over the peak of winter so 16A should be fine. I managed fine with 16A in France in a very poorly insulated cruiser. If you have a very long boat maybe tap into 16A at each end. I had to switch off the immersion heater when boiling a kettle. Anyway gas seems to be allowed.

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33 minutes ago, Mike Adams said:

Most cruising boats are unlikely to go out much over the peak of winter so 16A should be fine. I managed fine with 16A in France in a very poorly insulated cruiser. If you have a very long boat maybe tap into 16A at each end. I had to switch off the immersion heater when boiling a kettle. Anyway gas seems to be allowed.

If gas is still allowed then boaters will have to switch to that for heating (install a gas boiler) as well as cooking (if they don't already cook with gas, which many do). Though of course if a gas boiler is allowed, why not a diesel heater? I suspect it's the solid fuel smoke and diesel engine noise/fumes that are being objected to.

 

Apart from the cost (gas costs a lot more than solid fuel or diesel, especially in winter) they then have to replace gas bottles far more often than today -- where do these come from? This is also a short-term sticking-plaster which helps with the smoke/fumes/noise problem, but still relies on gas.

 

So it still sounds like non-joined-up-thinking from CaRT. They have similar problems (CO2 emissions, pollution, running costs) to the one the government is facing with domestic heating, and the long-term solution here for most houses is planned to be heat-pumps with the power coming from renewables. There is/will be a strategy to make this happen, possibly including installation subsidies, and heat-pump manufacturers are already rolling out products to meet this potentially huge market (30M houses in the UK?). This helps people get over the installation/cost problem of switching to electricity.

 

If CaRT want the same to happen on the canals -- which is a laudable aim! -- then they also need to work out how to make this feasible and affordable, and as was said in an earlier thread this also means heat-pumps. But who pays for the installation, and where do these small inexpensive water-source heat pumps come from?

 

Maybe this is just a badly-thought out PR stunt to smooth the feathers of people in expensive flats next to canals who complain (justifiably?) about smoke and noise and diesel fumes. Or maybe CaRT have thought all this through, though I don't see any evidence of that...

Edited by IanD
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15 minutes ago, IanD said:

Even ignoring the high bill cost problem, standard 16A bollards can't cope with all-electric (hot water, heating, cooking) boats... ?

This is true.  And I'm sure my boat isn't the only one which has wiring and fuses which can't deal with more than 16 amps anyway.  If I have an electric heater going and forget to turn it off before boiling a kettle, my fuses on the boat trip.

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1 minute ago, doratheexplorer said:

This is true.  And I'm sure my boat isn't the only one which has wiring and fuses which can't deal with more than 16 amps anyway.  If I have an electric heater going and forget to turn it off before boiling a kettle, my fuses on the boat trip.

Now imagine you've got an electric oven and hob... ?

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I think CaRT are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut here...

 

Getting boaters to use electric for everything -- what the press release says -- is going to have huge issues, at least in the short-term (CaRT need a long-term strategy!) and with power provision.

 

But if the problem is smoke from solid fuel stoves and noise/fumes from smoky/noisy diesel generators/engines, this can be solved more easily and cheaply. Diesel or gas stoves and heaters don't cause the problems that they're facing, so why ban them?

 

Yes getting rid of solid fuel stoves and heating would be painful, but for most boaters allowing them to be replaced with diesel drip stoves (Bubble etc) or heaters (Webasto etc) or ranges would be a much less painful than forcing a complete switch to electric, and avoids the 50A bollard problem. Or people can use gas for heating/hot water/cooking, so long as they can solve the bottle supply problem.

 

It's not as good long-term as a proper fix (electric/heat-pumps) but solves the pressing problem, and is a lot easier and cheaper in the short-term. Electric bollards eliminate the need to run noisy/smoky diesel generators/engines.

 

Or maybe this is what CaRT are actually planning -- in which case their press release was *very* badly written...

Edited by IanD
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