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RCD


Mike Todd
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I notice from an article in Towpath Talk that it says that the new RCD rules require the design to be such that a boater get successfully get themselves back on board in the event that they fall into the water.

Does anyone know just what this might mean for a narrowboat, how fit and able does it assume that the boater is, and what solutions are considered to meet the requirement? (assuming, of course, that I have understood the original article correctly?)

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9 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

how fit and able does it assume that the boater is

I do not know, but as there is a description / specification for an 'average person' in the boat stability test section of the RCD there may well be one in the 'ability to get back on board' section.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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There is an ISO specification (amended to be inline with  RCD) which may answer our question.

 

Amendment 2 to ISO 15085:2003 was prepared by Technical Committee ISO/TC 188, Small craft and CEN/BT/WG 69, Small craft.
This second Amendment cancels and replaces the first Amendment (ISO 15085:1/Amd 1:2009) which has been technically revised to meet the European Recreational Craft Directive, 2013/53/EU essential requirement concerning reboarding.
 
Edit to add :
From ISO 15085
 
3.17
reboarding means
rigid or flexible fitting or part of the hull which allows a person to reboard without assistance
Edited by Alan de Enfield
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43 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

3.17
reboarding means
rigid or flexible fitting or part of the hull which allows a person to reboard without assistance

I would love to see any boat builder demonstrate any of the bits of metal welded on meets that requirement. The best I have seen on a barge was a ladder recessed into the hull side so the ladder rungs were flush with the hull but there was space behind it for toes and fingers. I think this is a very difficult one to comply with in a practical sense.

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55 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I would love to see any boat builder demonstrate any of the bits of metal welded on meets that requirement. The best I have seen on a barge was a ladder recessed into the hull side so the ladder rungs were flush with the hull but there was space behind it for toes and fingers. I think this is a very difficult one to comply with in a practical sense.

Lumpy water boats seem to be complying by having a 'pocket' built into the hull, pull off the cap and inside is a 'rope' ladder that can be pulled out and then drops down.

Something like this can be an 'after fit' and at £46 is an inexpensive way of anyone doing a self-fit out being able to comply with the RCD.

Even just as an additional safety feature on your boat. 

Who has tried to climb back into a boat with wet winter clothing on ? (it is not easy, even in just 3 foot of water in a muddy ditch)

 

Helps any crewmember get back on board easily without external help. Suitable for current use (bathing) or in case of Man Over Board. Consists of 3 polypropylene steps and 1 st. steel handle assembled by a highly resistant line, (bright yellow Ø 3 mm polyester). Ladder is stored in a polyamide tube with a grey polypropylene cap, for optimum protection and waterproofness. The Man Over Board removes the cap, pulls the ladder down, and climbs onboard. • Light • Very easy flush mount (like a thru-hull fitting). • Transom or skirt mount (sail and power boats), just above waterline.

 

plastimo-flushmount-safety-ladder-z-599-59947.jpg

 

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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3 minutes ago, cuthound said:

CRT are doing their bit too by not dredging the canals to their full depth. :giggles:

 

Apparently it’s all down to ‘human rights’ and that anyone vertically challenged (can we say Dwarf ?) is being discriminated against, as if the canal is dredged to 1,3 metres, they could not stand with their head above the water, whilst ‘normal folk’ are OK.

Blatant discrimination !!!!

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Is RCD a bit like OCD but for boaters? :)

Apparently it’s all down to ‘human rights’ and that anyone vertically challenged (can we say Dwarf ?) is being discriminated against, as if the canal is dredged to 1,3 metres, they could not stand with their head above the water, whilst ‘normal folk’ are OK.

Blatant discrimination !!!!

'Ere I'm vertically challenged at 5' 4".

Old Yorkshire saying "They don't make diamonds as big as bricks."

Edited by Ray T
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On a a serious note, when I did my offshore survival training at Solihull swimming baths one of the tasks we has to do was to climb into an inflated life raft unaided. I failed totally at this task. The life raft had a similar ladder to the one illustrated. Every time I tried to climb it my legs and body just swung beneath the raft. Also we had full foul weather gear on and an inflated life jacket. I'd like to see a ladder of this type demonstrated on a narrow boat to see if it is possible to climb out using it  - I have my doubts.

plastimo-flushmount-safety-ladder-z-599-59947.jpg

Edited by Ray T
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11 minutes ago, Ray T said:

The life raft had a similar ladder to the one illustrated. Every time I tried to climb it my legs and body just swung beneath the raft

When I was taught to climb a rope ladder it was explained that it is best to climb from the side, one leg to the 'outside' of the ladder, with the other leg on the 'inside..

I would suggest that your experience is not unusual - the life raft is floating on the top of the water whilst a 'boat' (including a narrowboat) will have 2, 3, 4 or more feet below the water and give you something to climb 'against' - on a 'muddy ditch' there will generally only be a few inches / couple of feet of water below the bottom of the boat and you will be virtually climbing up the side of the boat.

 

A few months ago PBO magazine (Practical Boat Owner) undertook a survey, and made comparative tests of many of the available 'emergency ladders' - I will see if I can find it.

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23 minutes ago, Ray T said:

On a a serious note, when I did my offshore survival training at Solihull swimming baths one of the tasks we has to do was to climb into an inflated life raft unaided. I failed totally at this task. The life raft had a similar ladder to the one illustrated. Every time I tried to climb it my legs and body just swung beneath the raft. Also we had full foul weather gear on and an inflated life jacket. I'd like to see a ladder of this type demonstrated on a narrow boat to see if it is possible to climb out using it  - I have my doubts.

 

  Spot on. and any idea that you can put your foot on the water line or in the front deck scuppers and climb on board out of cold water fully clothed is cuckoo land. Ideally you need something ridged below the water level to stand on and a good hand hold  above to pull your self up on. Maybe rungs down each side of the rudder might be a good way to go, maybe 3 each side. 

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7 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

  Spot on. and any idea that you can put your foot on the water line or in the front deck scuppers and climb on board out of cold water fully clothed is cuckoo land. Ideally you need something ridged below the water level to stand on and a good hand hold  above to pull your self up on. Maybe rungs down each side of the rudder might be a good way to go, maybe 3 each side. 

And when the rudder swings and slams your leg against the hull.........

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On Bluemoon we have a step built into the rudder which I feel slightly more confident with as it’s about  foot beneath the surface. Whereas the step fitted to the swim on some boats are just beneath the surface, haven’t go a clue how you’re supposed to get a foot on it.

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On 10/31/2017 at 12:18, ditchcrawler said:

  Spot on. and any idea that you can put your foot on the water line or in the front deck scuppers and climb on board out of cold water fully clothed is cuckoo land. Ideally you need something ridged below the water level to stand on and a good hand hold  above to pull your self up on. Maybe rungs down each side of the rudder might be a good way to go, maybe 3 each side. 

This is why when we are on the rivers we leave our bathing ladder folded down in the water. The rungs reach low enough into the water to make getting out easier and for the vertically challenged like myself the stern drive is an extra step up. It has been used by several boaters over the years who could not get back out onto their own boats.

 

 

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5 hours ago, MartynG said:

A folding ladder at the stern is commonly found on motorboats  that are designed with warmer climates in mind.

Perhaps a similar thing could be fitted on a narrowboat  but to one side of the helm area. 

you've still got to pull it down when you're in the water... and how far down does it need to go to make it easy to use.

It does seem that getting to the bank and crawling "ashore" might be the easiest thing to do on a canal - but obviously that's less practical on a river...

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4 minutes ago, StephenA said:

It does seem that getting to the bank and crawling "ashore" might be the easiest thing to do on a canal

There have been a number of folk who have posted on here, who have fallen in and been unable to extricate themselves from the canal - it seems that the idea of 'walking to the side and crawling up the bank' does not work practice. They have reported that even having someone of the bank hauling them up it is still extremely difficult to get out.

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I have known two people, one young and fit and one neither young or fit and quite large who drowned on the GU, the younger one may have fallen in a lock, we will never know, and the other one fell into shallow but muddy water but could not climb out onto the towpath. Chances of getting out are slim. As for reboarding a boat I reckon that if you are alone you would find it damned hard. We have a steel bunk bed ladder that can be hung over the side, I think it is quite good but I have never tried it.

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