boat, moorings, so much to learn

[ronnietucker]

42 minutes ago, Iain_S said:

That will be (slightly deflated, following pricing review  ) prices for residential moorings. Might be worth talking to Scottish Canals at Applecross Street about a leisure mooring. (Although S.C. seem to be neglecting provision for the leisure market, concentrating instead on the financial returns of residential moorings, preferably occupied by boats which don't move much!) Also, there have been boats for sale at Auchenstarry (near Kilsyth) recently (At one point I think there were about six)

Thanks. I've dropped them an email to see if I can get clarification on leisure prices. If it really was about £100/mth then I'd jump on it.

[ronnietucker]

Gotta give them their due. Scottish Canals got back to me first thing Monday morning with a list of prices. It seems their leisure prices are around £150/year/meter. So this idea is maybe a go-er after all. But then...

In their T&C's I notice:

Quote

You must have in force an insurance policy for the Boat, which covers third-party liabilities for at least two million pounds. It should also cover costs of recovery if your vessel takes on water or sinks. [my emphasis]

 

Insurance for £2m?! Jesus! How much would that cost me per month?  

I get over one hurdle and another one appears!  

[David Mack]

Boat insurance is pretty cheap, and will include the necessary 3rd party cover.

[ronnietucker]

7 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Boat insurance is pretty cheap, and will include the necessary 3rd party cover.

Even for the £2mill they're requiring?

[Alan de Enfield]

17 minutes ago, ronnietucker said:

Insurance for £2m?! Jesus! How much would that cost me per month?

Probably around £100-£150 per year.

I have my boat fully comp (valued at £250,000) and £10 million third party (required by Italian marine authorities) and geographical coverage of all of Europe (Norway down to North Africa and Turkey across to Ireland) and its around £600 per annum

Edited July 10, 2017 by Alan de Enfield

[ronnietucker]

15 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Probably around £100-£150 per year.

I have my boat fully comp (valued at £250,000) and £10 million third party (required by Italian marine authorities) and geographical coverage of all of Europe (Norway down to North Africa and Turkey across to Ireland) and its around £600 per annum

£150/yr (worst case scenario) would still keep me at about £120/mth for moorings, navigation fee, and insurance.

So far so good.

Still more calculations to do on fuel etc.

Actually, I assume you don't need a license to move a boat? I've not seen anything about that in my searches.

Thanks for all the help everyone. You've all been really helpful in hopefully making my boating dream come true!

[ditchcrawler]

38 minutes ago, ronnietucker said:

Gotta give them their due. Scottish Canals got back to me first thing Monday morning with a list of prices. It seems their leisure prices are around £150/year/meter. So this idea is maybe a go-er after all. But then...

In their T&C's I notice:

Insurance for £2m?! Jesus! How much would that cost me per month?  

I get over one hurdle and another one appears!  

£10 - £15 a month

[haggis]

3 minutes ago, ronnietucker said:

£150/yr (worst case scenario) would still keep me at about £120/mth for moorings, navigation fee, and insurance.

So far so good.

Still more calculations to do on fuel etc.

Actually, I assume you don't need a license to move a boat? I've not seen anything about that in my searches.

Thanks for all the help everyone. You've all been really helpful in hopefully making my boating dream come true!

To have a boat on a canal you need to have a licence and to get a licence (in Scotland)  you need a mooring and Bss certificate and insurance 

Haggis 

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, ronnietucker said:

Actually, I assume you don't need a license to move a boat?

YOU don't need a 'driving licence' but the boat DOES need a licence to 'move'.

[ronnietucker]

Yeah. I wouldn't even think about buying a boat that didn't have a year/two (at least) left on it's BSS.

[Alan de Enfield]

44 minutes ago, ronnietucker said:

Yeah. I wouldn't even think about buying a boat that didn't have a year/two (at least) left on it's BSS.

If you want a 'full' BSSC then just insist that that is part of the sale agreement (that's what I did on our last cruiser) - saves 'worrying' for 4 years.

Alternatively - if you are having a survey, most surveyors can do a BSS for you at the same time for 'just a few pennies' more than the price of the survey.

[magictime]

1 hour ago, ronnietucker said:

£150/yr (worst case scenario) would still keep me at about £120/mth for moorings, navigation fee, and insurance.

Did you ever get confirmation on likely mooring costs? I feel responsible for getting your hopes up with my £70-£100 guesstimate and it'd be good to know how far off it was!

[Alan de Enfield]

2 hours ago, ronnietucker said:

Gotta give them their due. Scottish Canals got back to me first thing Monday morning with a list of prices. It seems their leisure prices are around £150/year/meter. So this idea is maybe a go-er after all. But then...

In their T&C's I notice:

Insurance for £2m?! Jesus! How much would that cost me per month?  

I get over one hurdle and another one appears!  

 

10 minutes ago, magictime said:

Did you ever get confirmation on likely mooring costs? I feel responsible for getting your hopes up with my £70-£100 guesstimate and it'd be good to know how far off it was!

Reading previous posts can pay dividends.

[ronnietucker]

20 hours ago, magictime said:

Did you ever get confirmation on likely mooring costs? I feel responsible for getting your hopes up with my £70-£100 guesstimate and it'd be good to know how far off it was!

You were pretty close. They range from about £120-200/year/metre. If I was to get a 7m cruiser then it would probably work out at about £100/mth.

That includes the use of mooring facilities. There's an additional £200/year fee for use of the canals and locks (and things like use of the Falkirk wheel at certain times included in the £200).

Edited July 11, 2017 by ronnietucker
not £200/mth, but £200/yr. Doh!

[magictime]

28 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Reading previous posts can pay dividends.

Oops. I saw the bit about insurance but somehow missed the bit about mooring costs.

[ronnietucker]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

YOU don't need a 'driving licence' but the boat DOES need a licence to 'move'.

Yep. The Scottish Navigation License is the required £198/yr (on top of the mooring fees) for traversing the canals/locks/etc.

[magictime]

1 minute ago, ronnietucker said:

You were pretty close. They range from about £120-200/year/metre. If I was to get a 7m cruiser then it would probably work out at about £100/mth.

That includes the use of mooring facilities. There's an additional £200/mth fee for use of the canals and locks (and things like use of the Falkirk wheel at certain times included in the £200).

£200 a year, surely?

Anyway, good to know £100 a month should cover the mooring. I thought £200-£300 seemed a bit excessive!

[Graham Davis]

3 hours ago, ronnietucker said:

Insurance for £2m?! Jesus! How much would that cost me per month?  

£2m is very reasonable. Just look at how much legal fees are, and also imagine how much a set of lock gates might cost if you were found to have damaged them.

[ronnietucker]

4 minutes ago, magictime said:

£200 a year, surely?

Anyway, good to know £100 a month should cover the mooring. I thought £200-£300 seemed a bit excessive!

Yeah, that's what I put: it's about £120 to £200 per year per metre.

As someone else (maybe yourself) said the £200-300 is probably residential mooring.

Edited July 10, 2017 by ronnietucker

[WotEver]

9 hours ago, ronnietucker said:

Yeah, that's what I put: it's about £120 to £200 per year per metre.

I believe Magic was referring to...

10 hours ago, ronnietucker said:

There's an additional £200/mth fee for use of the canals and locks

That should read "an additional £200/year"

[Matt&Jo]

Ronnie i have a grp pleasure cruiser down in southampton that i have just sold to fund my narrowboat journey. Their is no specific reason why you can not keep her on water all winter but most remove for a number of reasons.

1. Carry out end of season maint. This would include antifoul, hull scraping, grp repairs etc

2. Help to reduce mould build up but dehums can also do this if in the water.

3. Less time in the water means longer life of the transom. The wood inside the grp gets saturated over many years and goes spongy (if your going outboard) so pulling the boat out of the water for 4-5 months can extend the transom life alot!!!

4. Security/peace of mind.....the boat is not left on the water, less chance of things happening like coming loose of the mooring and needs less checking over the winter period as its sat high and dry altho sometimes your their more due to maint......

5. Saves on anodes getting muched or the leg paint of your outboard or inboard. Most marinas down here on the south coast (yes i know its marine salt water moorings) allow x amount of dry storage time within your contract.

[ronnietucker]

9 hours ago, WotEver said:

I believe Magic was referring to...

That should read "an additional £200/year"

Oops! My bad. Have edited that post to correct that.

9 hours ago, Matt&Jo said:

Ronnie i have a grp pleasure cruiser down in southampton that i have just sold to fund my narrowboat journey. Their is no specific reason why you can not keep her on water all winter but most remove for a number of reasons.

1. Carry out end of season maint. This would include antifoul, hull scraping, grp repairs etc

2. Help to reduce mould build up but dehums can also do this if in the water.

3. Less time in the water means longer life of the transom. The wood inside the grp gets saturated over many years and goes spongy (if your going outboard) so pulling the boat out of the water for 4-5 months can extend the transom life alot!!!

4. Security/peace of mind.....the boat is not left on the water, less chance of things happening like coming loose of the mooring and needs less checking over the winter period as its sat high and dry altho sometimes your their more due to maint......

5. Saves on anodes getting muched or the leg paint of your outboard or inboard. Most marinas down here on the south coast (yes i know its marine salt water moorings) allow x amount of dry storage time within your contract.

4/ My thinking of using the Forth & Clyde is that I work quite near it, so finishing work on a Friday and heading up there for the weekend wouldn't be that bad, but that's assuming I can get some sort of heating in the boat.

5/ Unfortunately no land storage with the F&C mooring costs. I checked with them today.

[ronnietucker]

Today's random Forth & Clyde canal fact: if you have a boat that's come from fresh water, you must have it steam cleaned before it will be allowed in the F&C waters. Yes, it will be inspected before it's allowed in the water. If it's found to have any invasive species on it? You're, quite literally, left high and dry.  

And today's random question: roughly how much damage does a boat take in a year?

I know it's a bit of a tough one to define, but I thought I'd ask as I'm not sure what kind of maintenance tasks a boat would need per week/month/year.

I've got my eye on a couple of books on Amazon about boat maintenance. I'd definitely want to have a book/two incase of the inevitable.

[ronnietucker]

Made a rough spreadsheet of costs that spring to mind. Feel free to let me know what I've missed/botched.

https://goo.gl/rSY7iY

Let's hear it for spreadsheets!  

[cuthound]

Gas is £28 per 13kg bottle. Can last from a few days to a few months, depending on useage (lower end assumes gas heating, higher end cooking only).

You have not budgetted for fuel. Diesel is circa £1 per litre for propulsion, petrol at garage prices. Usage depends on how much you use the boat and engine fitted. Assume 1 litre per hour as a start, until actual consumption known.

Engine servicing, £50 - £300, depending on whether you do it yourself of employ "an expert". Every 100 - 250 hours depending on engine.

Annual River Canal Rescue subscription  (optional) but gives pice of mind £150 for bronze cover, particularly if you are not mechanically minded.