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Narrowboat on Tidal Thames This Morning

Tim Lewis

By Tim Lewis
in General Boating

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Wanderer Vagabond Influencer

Wanderer VagabondDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

heres the Notice to Mariners.

 

The chart clearly shows the exclusion zone. The Bouys are the 15mtr zone, nowt to do with shallows but like the trip wire in the Great Escape, the guards open fire if crossed

 

http://www.pla.co.uk/assets/p16-exclusionzones2013readablecharts.pdf

The look like Special Mark buoys but I don't really see the relevance of the 15 metres since the exclusion zone, according to the advice for mariners,is 70 metres out into the riverunsure.png

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Tim Lewis Veteran

Tim Lewis

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

The look like Special Mark buoys but I don't really see the relevance of the 15 metres since the exclusion zone, according to the advice for mariners,is 70 metres out into the riverunsure.png

 

The 15m exclusion zone applies to trip boats, PLA Permanent Notice to Mariners Refers, The Albert Embankment exclusion Zone is for the MI6 Building:

 

EXCLUSION ZONES

 

LAMBETH REACH & ALBERT EMBANKMENT

 

1. LAMBETH REACH

 

An Exclusion Zone is established in the vicinity of the Palace of Westminster.

No person or vessel, shall, except in an emergency, or with the written

permission of the Harbour Master, enter into an area within 70 metres of the

northern bank of the River Thames between Westminster Bridge and 200

metres below Lambeth Bridge, except as provided below.

 

The above restriction shall not apply to licensed passenger vessels

approaching or departing from Westminster Pier. However, these vessels

shall avoid entering into the area described as far as safe navigation permits

and at no time may they approach closer than 15 metres to the Northern river

bank.

 

A row of 9 buoys has been established 15 metres from the Embankment

alongside the Palace of Westminster. Buoy No’s 1, 4 and 8 on the attached

plan will show the following characteristic: F1.Y. 2.5s.

43

 

PERMANENT NOTICE TO MARINERS P18

 

2. ALBERT EMBANKMENT

 

An Exclusion Zone is established in the vicinity of Albert Embankment. The

Zone extends from the upstream side of Vauxhall Bridge to the lower side of

Lacks Dock extending from the Embankment for a distance of 15 metres into

the River.

 

No vessel shall, except in an emergency or with the written permission of a

Harbour Master, navigate within or enter the Exclusion Zone.

Note: This Notice was latterly published as Permanent Notice toMariners P16 of 2011

Edited by Tim Lewis
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Peter X Experienced

Peter X

Posted
Posted

My guess would be that there's an escalating response as you approach; a word in your ear from a police launch at 70m, a rather more forceful word in your ear perhaps involving prosecution at 15m, and drastic action if you try to climb up onto the terrace. If I were them I'd keep the public guessing as to what that action might be; for example the Army never lets on as to whether the guards at Buckingham Palace have loaded weapons.

 

At the MI6 building of course you get to meet James Bond, or 00 some other number if he's out of the office.

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Wanderer Vagabond Influencer

Wanderer VagabondDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

 

The 15m exclusion zone applies to trip boats, PLA Permanent Notice to Mariners Refers, The Albert Embankment exclusion Zone is for the MI6 Building:

 

 

I suppose I should have said that I don't see the relevance of the 15 metre buoyage. If they are putting buoys out it would have made more sense to put them at the 70metre mark so that people knew how far they should keep out. I wouldn't think that the trip boats need any buoyage since, as they probably do the trip on a daily basis, they would know how far out they should be.

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mark99 Veteran II

mark99

Posted
Posted

We were working outside m15 in the road doing roadworks and one of the chaps who we liased with wandered over and casually mention they could hear everything we were saying. I guess they listen to what's going on from inside.

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Thorfast Community Regular

Thorfast

Posted
Posted

A few years ago my daughter worked in the office tower block next to the MI5 building.

When I visited she said 'Ring me on your mobile when you get to our building and I'll come down and meet you'.

Strangely there was no mobile phone signal at all when I arrived outside and tried to phone her.

'Oh, sorry, I forgot', she said when I met her in reception.....they were used to the fact that there is no mobile phone signal at all outside the MI5 building and its close neighbour!

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  • 2 weeks later...
Scholar Gypsy Veteran

Scholar Gypsy

Posted
Posted

Some pictures from yesterday:

 

https://www.flickr.com/gp/timlewis/545e6V

 

Enjoy

 

Tim

 

I did. The manoeuvre involving the two outgoing trip boats, the incoming tug, and the two incoming narrowboats, looks quite challenging. A very good illustration, I suspect, of how important it is to have VHF radio - in this case to know that the trip boats want to pass Green to Green.

 

In return, here's a photo from near Southend earlier today (not taken by me, from https://indigodream.wordpress.com/)

 

img_3148.jpg

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Bee Veteran

Bee

Posted
Posted

 

I did. The manoeuvre involving the two outgoing trip boats, the incoming tug, and the two incoming narrowboats, looks quite challenging. A very good illustration, I suspect, of how important it is to have VHF radio - in this case to know that the trip boats want to pass Green to Green.

 

In return, here's a photo from near Southend earlier today (not taken by me, from https://indigodream.wordpress.com/)

 

img_3148.jpg

Frightened just looking at that

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Keeping Up Veteran II

Keeping UpDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

That was narrow boat Alnwick, owned by Graham, formerly of this forum.

 

I seem to recall they met the unfortunate copper afterwards, and that his colleagues were not letting him forget his little mishap!

Yes apparently his colleagues gave him the nickname "Splash Gordon"

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saltysplash Experienced

saltysplash

Posted
Posted

To revisit on old point, don't both of those narrowboat pass inside the exclusion zone outside of the Houses of parliament? of is the image foreshortened by the zoom?

The image looks like they have used arch No 5 which is outside the 70m zone but it could be the zoom angle, will have to wait for Tim to confirm

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Claude Collaborator

Claude

Posted
Posted (edited)

Personally I'm not interested it putting my narrowboat at the extreme of its design capability. Good luck to those that do.

 

None of these images show narrowboats at the extremes of their design capabilities - they are well within them.

 

Most canal boat owners have no idea of what their boat can handle because they never venture off flat water. While the boat can handle tidal conditions it is often the steerer who can't because they aren't used to it. So it's generally the people on board who limit the boat's capability.

Edited by Claude
  • Greenie 1
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magnetman Veteran II

magnetman

Posted
Posted

What RCD category is the average narrow boat? Cat D maybe or perhaps not even that.

 

Obviously you can take a cat D vessel across the channel in a force 8 and may get away with it but it is basically designed for a certain type of use. Things like windows. Typical narrow boat windows are fairly large and could easily be broken by a large wave from the side. Vessels rated for heavier use will have stronger windows or portholes. Freeboard, rope attachment points etc.

 

We haven't seen the whole of the trip to the Medway - it is possible that some of the conditions did push the narrow boats to their theoretical limit. Provided the ballast is properly secured you will probably tend to stay upright but this does not mean the boat was designed for it.

 

Of course good preparation and competent crew make a difference as well and I agree with the crew being the weak point in a lot of situations.

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mark99 Veteran II

mark99

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

None of these images show narrowboats at the extremes of their design capabilities - they are well within them.

 

Most canal boat owners have no idea of what their boat can handle because they never venture off flat water. While the boat can handle tidal conditions it is often the steerer who can't because they aren't used to it. So it's generally the people on board who limit the boat's capability.

 

Cat D. Waves max 0.5m from passing boats 0.3m from weather.

 

To be honest this showing of pictures of narrow boats slopping about in dodgy conditions is a bit like willy waving.

Edited by mark99
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magnetman Veteran II

magnetman

Posted
Posted

One of the posters on the Thames Forum suggests that you could 'break the back' of a narrow boat by taking it to sea in inappropriate conditions.

 

I somehow doubt that. Swamping is very possible but I am now wondering if a (steel) narrow boat has ever actually been broken up by being subjected to heavy seas :unsure: surely it would sink first

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