Theft from boats, Calcutt area

[MtB]

Yes. I think that the bone of contention was that he set some sort of trap to lure intruders, and then shot at one. I've heard the story from several local people and, as you'd expect, it comes out a bit differently each time.

 

 

That's not something I've heard until now. Certainly explains why he was sitting up in the middle of the night with a loaded shotgun, ready to shoot, which was something that vaguely puzzled me. He seemed to know they would be visiting again.

[Southern Star]

Mr Finch a serial thief who used to break into boats mainly in the Oxford canal area but has been know to travel further afield from time to time

 

Edit

 

More information here

 

http://www.braunstonmarina.co.uk/Portals/0/Images/Finch/Finch%20-%20The%20Remorseful%20Day%20-%20II%20%2020%2011%2003.pdf

Thank you, an interesting if somewhat depressing read.

[blackrose]

Yes. I think that the bone of contention was that he set some sort of trap to lure intruders, and then shot at one. I've heard the story from several local people and, as you'd expect, it comes out a bit differently each time.

 

The documentary I saw about it said that he lay in wait on the stairs with his shotgun - but he didn't lure anyone into his house. He then came down the stairs and startled the two intruders who ran. He gave chase and shot one in the back in the garden. That's what did it for Tony Martin. The guy was running away and he shot him in the back. Excessive use of force.

 

You're allowed to use reasonable force to protect and defend yourself, your family and property, but you're not allowed to kill someone who's running away however angry you feel or frustrated at police inaction you happen to be.

Edited February 6, 2016 by blackrose

[BWM]

I remember a farmer (forgotten his name) tried that a few years back. Unfortunately the courts didn't back up his natural and sensible reaction. I'm a firm believer in the "Darwin System".

Bob

I am sure that the main reason for the custodial sentence was that the shotgun was unlicensed and technically a firearm.

[Athy]

Thank you, an interesting if somewhat depressing read.

Its wordiness is a mite depressing, yes. Many people could have told the story in half as many words. But it does make clear why Finch has always received relatively light sentences - because his thefts have always been petty - note the author's apt comparison with the sums involved in the fraud and narcotics cases which were taking place at Oxford Court at the time.

 

Mr. Finch would now be 75, so it is questionable if he's still maintaining his erstwhilelife style.

[Alan de Enfield]

I am sure that the main reason for the custodial sentence was that the shotgun was unlicensed and technically a firearm.

 

Unfortunately he doesn't seem to learn ' this recently in the 'local newspaper'

 

Tony Martin, from Norfolk, served three years in prison for fatally shooting Fred Barras, 16, at his home in Emneth Hungate, Norfolk, in 1999.

The 71-year-old was initially found guilty of murder but this was reduced to manslaughter on appeal.

He was arrested on Thursday on suspicion of possessing an illegal firearm during a police search of his home, but was released "pending further enquiries".

A Norfolk Police spokesman said on Thursday: "Officers have this evening finished their search of the address and the man, who was arrested on suspicion of possession of an illegal firearm, has been released on police bail until late February 2016."

[ditchcrawler]

Tony Martin. He's from round here. He shot a gypsy who was on his land.

I think he is in trouble again

[Athy]

As suggested in the previous post, yes.

[blackrose]

I am sure that the main reason for the custodial sentence was that the shotgun was unlicensed and technically a firearm.

 

I'm not sure about that. I don't think he would have received a custodial sentence for possession of an unlicenced firearm alone, had he not killed somebody with it! Although the unlicenced firearm was certainly a factor, this (from Wiki), suggests that the jury originally found Martin guilty of murder because of possession of a firearm with intent to cause injury and the use of excessive force.

 

Murder trial[edit]

On 23 August 1999, Martin was charged with the murder of Barras, the attempted murder of Fearon, "wounding with intent to cause injury" to Fearon, and "possessing a firearm with intent to endanger life".^[8] Martin did not hold a valid shotgun certificate (licence), let alone the more restrictive Firearms Certificate he would have needed to possess the Winchester pump-action shotgun that held a maximum of five rounds.

English law permits one person to kill another in self-defence only if the person defending him or herself uses no more than "reasonable force"; it is the responsibility of the jury to determine whether or not an unreasonable amount of force was used.^[12] The jury at the trial were told that they had the option of returning a verdict ofmanslaughter rather than murder, if they thought that Martin "did not intend to kill or cause serious bodily harm".^[13] However, the jurors found Martin guilty of murder by a 10 to 2 majority.^[14]

He was sentenced to life imprisonment, with a recommended minimum term to serve of 9 years, reduced to 8 years by the Lord Chief Justice.

Edited February 6, 2016 by blackrose

[David Schweizer]

More than thirty years ago, I knew a farmer in Derbyshire who shot a thief and was not even charged.

 

Having had quite a few chickens stolen over a period of several weeks, he lay in wait at night with a loaded shotgun, after several evenings the perpetrator arrived, captured a chicken and started to make his way off the farm, the farmer yelled at him to stop, but the thief started running, he received two cartridges of pellets in his backside, but kept running. The thief ended up in a Sheffield hospital where he spent several hours having the pellets individually removed, he survived albeit in some pain for a while, but no more chickens were stolen from that farm.

 

The hospital contacted the Police who interviewed the theif who gave details of the farm. The farmer was arrested, but no charges were ever brought. I rather suspect that they thought the thief got what he deserved and they probably knew that no magistrate in the area, most of whom were farmers, would have found the farmer guilty any way.

Edited February 6, 2016 by David Schweizer

[ditchcrawler]

As suggested in the previous post, yes.

Yes but I replied to your posting before reading the next page. If I read to the end of the thread I wouldn't bother to go back and answer posts.

[Gwydion]

The licensing of the gun is irrelevant to my mind as to whether Martin was guilty of murder or not. He shot the lad in the back, as he was running away. That's murder all day long I'm afraid.

 

HOWEVER, I've had experience of being repeatedly targetted by certain 'travellers' who really were outside of the law (they used to pull into our yard with a 12 year old driving, just to illustrate how the police were too scared to go near them), and I know how utterly inept the police can be where these people are concerned. I've got every sympathy for anyone who takes the law into their own hands after a certain point. It shouldn't be necessary, and wouldn't be necessary if the police weren't such a pathetic shower.

Edited February 6, 2016 by Gwydion

[ditchcrawler]

He should have used No.9 and not BB

[Athy]

 

I'm not sure about that. I don't think he would have received a custodial sentence for possession of an unlicenced firearm alone,

Yes. It happened to someone in this village three years ago. He wasn't even using the shotgun. His wife, with whom he had fallen out, "shopped" him to the police after removing it from its secure locked cabinet while he was out.

 

 

So he told me.

Edited February 6, 2016 by Athy

[Iain_S]

(snip)

HOWEVER, I've had experience of being repeatedly targetted by certain 'travellers' who really were outside of the law (they used to pull into our yard with a 12 year old driving, just to illustrate how the police were too scared to go near them), and I know how utterly inept the police can be where these people are concerned.(snip)

 

Might not be a case of "too scared to go near them": could be "instructed not to approach" by "politically correct" senior officers and/or standing orders! (No excuse for ignoring a 12 year old driver, or other offences, though)

[Starcoaster]

 

I'm not sure about that. I don't think he would have received a custodial sentence for possession of an unlicenced firearm alone, had he not killed somebody with it!

I personally knew (now deceased) a man who recieved a custodial sentence for this exact offence.

[Emerald Fox]

On my boat the maximum penalty for burglary is death by misadventure.

 

Haha! On ours that's the minimum penalty.

[Hawkmoth]

^^^^^^^^^^Love it! Greenie

[MtB]

Yes but I replied to your posting before reading the next page. If I read to the end of the thread I wouldn't bother to go back and answer posts.

 

 

Tricky isn't it? The presence of a 'Reply' box at the bottom of the page viciously misleads one into thinking it's the end of the thread. Then when one replies, it gets appended to the real end of the thread, 400 posts further on when the subject has morphed into something completely different!

[bigray]

A Policeman once told me that if you catch and intruder throw them out of an upstairs window and keep doing it until they stop breathing. Claim they jumped out running away.

 

It may sound harsh but if you are on my property up to no good then it should be the case that you are fair game.

[ditchcrawler]

 

 

Tricky isn't it? The presence of a 'Reply' box at the bottom of the page viciously misleads one into thinking it's the end of the thread. Then when one replies, it gets appended to the real end of the thread, 400 posts further on when the subject has morphed into something completely different!

No I realise its not the end, but if I did go to the end I wouldn't be arssed to come back and answer it, like this is not the end, we will see what else there is ina couple of seconds

[zigspider]

A Policeman once told me that if you catch and intruder throw them out of an upstairs window and keep doing it until they stop breathing. Claim they jumped out running away.

 

It may sound harsh but if you are on my property up to no good then it should be the case that you are fair game.

Not totally sure of the legalities here in Canada, but if I was to find someone in the house, I have various blades and firearms ( legal ) with which to dissuade them and advise them to leave.