Hackney CMers want to have a "CC Licence" and to remain in one place.

[magnetman]

My children are 2 and 4 I have a long term "no home mooring" vessel waiting for them, when can I send them off to moor on the towpath

The going rate for moorings in Hackney would be pretty high nowadays wouldn't it? 8-10K at least? It's an up and coming area etc. Not sure why some people should be allocated cheap moorings leaving hundreds of other reluctant cruisers to be exploited by hipster canal side bar prices. If activism and knowing the right people will get you a cheap floaty home in East London then the river will be a housing estate full of socially skilled middle class kids.

 

Gentrification gone mad

[oarfish]

In other posts it has been stated that we need to encourage a more diverse age range, instead of a load of old farts like me and many others on here.

To achieve that we have to accept that some will have children and these children will need to be educated .

I'm in my 30s (just about). I'm not completely against the idea, but this sort of thing never has the outcomes you would desire. Especially in a cutthroat situation like property ownership in a gentrifying area of London.

Edited December 16, 2014 by oarfish

[magnetman]

I bet a few of the boats (oh you can afford to buy a boat how nice) would end up rented out for profit pretty fast on cheap serviced moorings.

Hackney is grim though to be fair

[ditchcrawler]

Fairly self explanatory.

 

Seven CC boats have problems complying with the CC rules due to schooling so request C&RT let them have a 'community' and remain in one place whilst keeping their CC status.

 

http://www.narrowboatworld.com/index.php/leatest/7573-want-a-boating-families.

 

 

I cant understand why they want CC licences when they also want a permanent mooring. If they get an offside mooring where they can stay all the time they will have a home mooring. Maybe I am missing something.

[magnetman]

"traveller" status. Thats what I think.

[Lady Muck]

The going rate for moorings in Hackney would be pretty high nowadays wouldn't it? 8-10K at least? It's an up and coming area etc. Not sure why some people should be allocated cheap moorings leaving hundreds of other reluctant cruisers to be exploited by hipster canal side bar prices. If activism and knowing the right people will get you a cheap floaty home in East London then the river will be a housing estate full of socially skilled middle class kids.

 

About £3k if you go by the benchmark of the nearest ones

[magnetman]

I do know a bit about this because one of my daughters was given a nursery priority place when we were cc.ing for "social reasons" now we have a mooring the door to school places is closed as we no longer fit the priority criteria.

Typo edit

 

 

£3k for a wide mooring in hackney? Thats good !

 

Is that an up to date price?

Edited December 16, 2014 by magnetman

[Lady Muck]

So much judgement and assumption on this thread! I know some of the boaters - one of them has been cc so long he was pretty much the only boater doing it for a long time - he's been a boater a lot longer than me.

 

Community moorings are not, 'social housing' The cost saving comes from managing them yourself, they aren't expected to be that much cheaper than private ones if at all.

 

What they are planning to do is not a new thing in London, I can think of at least two locations where people have made moorings on the offside in the last 15-20 years. One of them (in Willesden) was discussed on here. One of my friends moors there. And this site is on the offside, too.

 

Jenlyn is correct in his assumption though, CRT said to London boaters - as part of the consulting that has been going on, over two years ago - 'come up with offside space that you think is suitable for moorings and come up with a proposal.' I remember going down the Lee photographing sites for discussion although I never actually got involved any further than that.

 

Whether it all goes t*t's up like other CRT proposals have done remains to be seen. The issue here is not that the boaters can't get this land as a mooring, it sounds as if another group got there with a proposal first.

 

And the thing about wanting to remain on a ccer license. All I can say is, 'eh?' where did this come from? Where did you get that from?

I do know a bit about this because one of my daughters was given a nursery priority place when we were cc.ing for "social reasons" now we have a mooring the door to school places is closed as we no longer fit the priority criteria.
Typo edit


£3k for a wide mooring in hackney? Thats good !

Is that an up to date price?

Yes! £10k is Regents/Limehouse prices - the Lee has always been cheap - people used to come and see our site and turn their noses up. When you have carjackings outside your gates, it tends to put one off, you know.

 

ETA how much longer it remains cheap, I don't know.....

I cant understand why they want CC licences when they also want a permanent mooring. If they get an offside mooring where they can stay all the time they will have a home mooring. Maybe I am missing something.

I think someone is making things up, personally. The article on NBW completely misrepresents what is going on here. 'What a surprise', said no one ever.

Edited December 16, 2014 by Lady Muck

[magnetman]

Sorry haven't seen the map thought it was Hackney from thread title. Realise now its probably Clapton or Stamford Hell area

Clapton is changing fast from murder mile to organic tea kilometer so I reckon £3k is too cheap

[David Mack]

What they are planning to do is not a new thing in London, I can think of at least two locations where people have made moorings on the offside in the last 15-20 years. One of them (in Willesden) was discussed on here. One of my friends moors there. And this site is on the offside, too.

 

I seem to recall that the moorings in Battlebridge Basin started this way in the late 70s, and the CHUG moorings in Kingsland Basin in the 80s.

[Lady Muck]

I bet a few of the boats (oh you can afford to buy a boat how nice) would end up rented out for profit pretty fast on cheap serviced moorings.

 

I seem to recall that the moorings in Battlebridge Basin started this way in the late 70s, and the CHUG moorings in Kingsland Basin in the 80s.

and the moorings that Simon Robbins of NABO had a part in creating in the basin that is now filled in at Kensal Rise. I remember him saying it was cooperatively managed.

Sorry haven't seen the map thought it was Hackney from thread title. Realise now its probably Clapton or Stamford Hell area

Clapton is changing fast from murder mile to organic tea kilometer so I reckon £3k is too cheap

It's lower Clapton, think theres a council rec ground on the offside and the moorings are at the edge of the football pitch. It's still pretty council round there., but yeah, you are probably right. I'm just going on what Springfield marina is charging for the new moorings on Leyton Marsh, they seem to be pegged with the price of ours in Tottenham. And ours have really gone up - like 40% in the 7 years I've been here. That's a much higher percentage increase than property in this area.

Edited December 16, 2014 by Lady Muck

[magnetman]

Ah ok if its an offline 'basin' thats slightly different and these days would be subject to a NAA I imagine ( )

 

Sorry LM didn't see your update. If its onlime I do think CRT need to maximise their revenues in.the current climate

 

Sorry if we've all been getting wrong end of stick about the cc thing. Bee in my bonnet on that subject i'm afraid

[Lady Muck]

It's online, but it's on the offside.

[valrene9600]

The claim that they want to "keep their CC licences" once they have a mooring is most likely complete tosh made up by the author of the article and the OP of this post.

If they have this mooring granted then they would be no different to all the other boaters be they in marinas or official on line moorings. ALL would have a boat license that enabled them to keep a boat on CRT waters.

 

If a landowner sets a price as this council will if this goes through, what difference does it make to other boaters as long as they all pay their boat license and mooring license.

 

Is it any different to the farmer who lets out mooring space along the Grand Union at Ivinghoe for whatever price he chooses as long as CRT get their fees.

 

Sorry but I seem to get feelings of "I wish i had thought of asking the council" being behind a lot of the comments made.

Of course if the council charge a silly low rent then the only losers will be the local ratepayers who will be subsidising the boaters.

But unless we are a local ratepayer it is none of our concern we must just be concerned that CRT collect the fees and our license fees do not subsidise these boaters.

 

Offend or please this is a forum open to all members views and these are mine.

[peterboat]

To me its a win win situation these people will pay to moor the council will get paid and CRT will charge the council. What is the problem none that I can think of

 

Peter

[Loafer]

Crab mentality.

 

'Ere. Wot've you got against the RAF!!

[mayalld]

To me its a win win situation these people will pay to moor the council will get paid and CRT will charge the council. What is the problem none that I can think of

 

Peter

It is a question of whether the not-for-profit operation is being given an unfair discount.

 

Both CRT and the Local Authority have to deal with the on the same terms as they would with a commercial operator.

 

They cannot give them discounts to help them undercut commercial moorings.

[Southern Star]

I've read this entire thread, and explored all of the links provided and I must admit that I still don't understand it. Are these boaters just permanently wanting to stay in the same place? Surely if you should be able to do that in London then you should be able to do it anywhere on the network, and the network would just turn into some type of encampment?

[Noah T]

It is a question of whether the not-for-profit operation is being given an unfair discount.

 

 

I have no idea whether this is a purely academic point, as I don't know what relevant policies Hackney Council etc would have.

 

However, I don't see anything 'unfair' in principle about a not for profit organisation with some social aims getting better terms than a business whose purpose is to make its shareholders or executives even richer than they are already.

[mayalld]

 

I have no idea whether this is a purely academic point, as I don't know what relevant policies Hackney Council etc would have.

 

However, I don't see anything 'unfair' in principle about a not for profit organisation with some social aims getting better terms than a business whose purpose is to make its shareholders or executives even richer than they are already.

Whether the organisation has particular social aims or not, it will be in the business of letting out moorings.

 

It is fair enough for one business to undercut another by cutting out unnecessary costs of staff and reducing its profit margin

 

It is unfair for a public body to reduce the amount that it charges.

 

You may like the idea, but that doesn't make it a legitimate act by that public body

[magnetman]

I've read this entire thread, and explored all of the links provided and I must admit that I still don't understand it. Are these boaters just permanently wanting to stay in the same place? Surely if you should be able to do that in London then you should be able to do it anywhere on the network, and the network would just turn into some type of gyppo encampment?

Not sure you are allowed to say that

[magnetman]

Whether the organisation has particular social aims or not, it will be in the business of letting out moorings.

 

It is fair enough for one business to undercut another by cutting out unnecessary costs of staff and reducing its profit margin

 

It is unfair for a public body to reduce the amount that it charges.

 

You may like the idea, but that doesn't make it a legitimate act by that public body

I think it may be illegal but the problem is what is a 'fair price' for what is in effect just a 72x14ft bit of mud with water on it?

 

A "mooring" involves services etc but could not exist without the bit of mud with water over it.

 

Maybe CRT should auction 'mooring spaces' which have no services or access and see what happens

[Noah T]

It is unfair for a public body to reduce the amount that it charges.

 

You may like the idea, but that doesn't make it a legitimate act by that public body

 

What exactly do you mean? Are you saying that favouring a non-profit scheme is illegal for a public sector body, or that in your opinion it is immoral?

 

Please clarify.

[magnetman]

 

They could at least establish a willingness to pay and maybe a market rate for a certain area. Even better - establish a mooring site (pp and access but no infrastructure) for say 7 boats and take bids from interested parties for the site. Give everyone a fair crack of the whip

 

Or talk to Foxtons about it

[Jerra]

In my opinion it would be poor management for a council to charge less to a non profit making organisation. In this day and age of financial cuts surely it is their responsibility to maximise income from any assets.