Blackstone gear box linkages

[davidg]

Going back to GUCCCo gear wheels, Brinklow Boat Services had some cast off an original last year and there are still some available. Ring Steve Priest at BBS if you're interested.

In conversation with Steve today, he mentioned that Tony Redshaw did have some spot on copies of the bracket for the other end of the clutch rod which houses the bevel gears at one time, cast in bronze as per original. Don't know if Paul still has any of these.

[junior]

Brinklow have just advertised on their FB page that they have some gear wheel sets available.

[Catrin]

It was late. I apologise.

Thank you, I appreciate that.

Was that the same reason why you were so rude to Madcat? Does it mean that you will now apologise to her?

Edited December 8, 2014 by Catrin

[matty40s]

Thank you, I appreciate that.

Was that the same reason why you were so rude to Madcat? Does it mean that you will now apologise to her?

If you do, I will remove my comment

[Timleech]

At last, the long awaited pictures of the gear linkage in Harry - boat of Starman.

 

 

 

 

 

That must produce some interesting stresses in the horizontal rod and its brackets, hence (no doubt) the large 'feet' on the brackets.

 

I notice that the quadrant stops on the gearbox case are missing. Not uncommon, but it does tend to lead to unnecessary wear.

 

Tim

[George94]

Thank you, I appreciate that.

Was that the same reason why you were so rude to Madcat? Does it mean that you will now apologise to her?

 

Most people, when they receive an apology, accept it with good grace and move on. You, on the other hand, have decided to resurrect a settled matter, misrepresent what was said, and take it upon yourself to fight Madcat's battles for her. She is, I believe, perfectly capable of looking after herself.

[madcat]

I'm currently trying to sort out some photos of my set up for general information and as a contribution to the " you show me yours and I'll show you mine " aspect of this thread.

I don't bother with Flikr or Facebook so it's not as easy. I admit my IT skills are minimal.

[RLWP]

I don't bother with Flikr or Facebook so it's not as easy

 

Unless you use a photo hosting service it's impossible

 

Richard

[starman]

 

 

 

I notice that the quadrant stops on the gearbox case are missing. Not uncommon, but it does tend to lead to unnecessary wear.

 

Tim

 

Quadrant stops? Unnecessary wear? Should I be worrying?

[Timleech]

 

Quadrant stops? Unnecessary wear? Should I be worrying?

 

There would originally have been a sort of quadrant on the side of the box, with a central detent for neutral and adjustable stops for ahead & astern. The purpose of these stops is to limit the travel of the lever, and take pressure off the internals once the ahead or astern position has been engaged. It's not unusual to see boxes which have this assembly missing, they do have a tendency to work loose, and which have clearly been like that for years with no obvious ill effect, but they are there for a purpose.

 

Don't lie awake worrying about it, but if you happen upon a spare stop assembly it would be a good idea to fit it.

 

Tim

[Proper Job]

I'm currently trying to sort out some photos of my set up for general information and as a contribution to the " you show me yours and I'll show you mine " aspect of this thread.

I don't bother with Flikr or Facebook so it's not as easy. I admit my IT skills are minimal.

Post them to the CWDF galley and then use the share link

 

That's what I do

[alan_fincher]

Post them to the CWDF galley and then use the share link

 

That's what I do

Problem with CWDF gallery is that the images are then stored as part of CWDF itself, and contribute to charges for diskstorage and increased bandwith.

 

By putting hem on a hosting service like Flickr or Photobucket they don't use forum resources so keep forum costs down and performance potentially better.

 

Madcat has asked me to post some pictures of the gear arrangements in Halsall. What has turned up are large files I need to resize, but in the meantime, I think they show much the same as what has been in previous thread, so I'll repeat those first....

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Timleech]

Although somewhat modified, those pics do show the basis of the quadrant stops.

 

Tim

[alan_fincher]

And here are the ones just received, after I have resize them.....

 

This looks a very neat and well executed solution to me - but of cours starts with the advantage of still haviing all the correct bits at the top that I don't have.

 

[RLWP]

The quadrant stops are in here: http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=68741&p=1365358

 

Richard

[alan_fincher]

Don't forget you promised not to laugh!

 

Here are Flamingo's urrent arrangements.....

 

Gear lever extension is the long cranked red rod from gearbox to roof.

 

Crudely bolted to push/pull rod at top

 

Bottom end

 

In ahead position

 

And in astern - it's notquite resting on those cabls or the bulkhead, but its close!

 

A further current problem is that a day tank has bee added for the diesl boiler. and the rodding is fouling against the side of that



Rods pushed fully forward - it is very difficult to reach under and "find" the end

 

Rough approximation to Neutral - handle already pretty floppy at this point due to unsupported length.

 

And reverse, at which pint it all bows down fairly dramatically....

 

 

Although lever does not come back as far as cabin doors, your elbow certainly does

 

Now can you see why I would prefer the proper arrangements?

[FadeToScarlet]

RLWP has been out and about with the pink paint again, I see.

 

Would it be possible to pivot the existing rod on the floor and add a link to a shorter rod, as an easier temporary fix before putting the proper wheel on?

[MoominPapa]

All the various solutions using a gear wheel that we've seen so far include include some method of converting to rotary movement of the wheel into linear movement applied to the lever on the box. But that lever is attached to a shaft passing through the box which has about 45 degrees of rotation from astern to ahead. I wonder there's milage in designing a linkage the works completely on rotary movement.

 

Maybe a shaft from the steering position to the engine room, then bevel gears through 90 degrees to a stub shaft across the boat with a sprocket on it, and a chain down to a sprocket on the gearbox shaft?

 

MP.

[Proper Job]

All the various solutions using a gear wheel that we've seen so far include include some method of converting to rotary movement of the wheel into linear movement applied to the lever on the box. But that lever is attached to a shaft passing through the box which has about 45 degrees of rotation from astern to ahead. I wonder there's milage in designing a linkage the works completely on rotary movement.

 

Maybe a shaft from the steering position to the engine room, then bevel gears through 90 degrees to a stub shaft across the boat with a sprocket on it, and a chain down to a sprocket on the gearbox shaft?

 

MP.

 

Same as Kelvin do?

[jake_crew]

Maybe a shaft from the steering position to the engine room, then bevel gears through 90 degrees to a stub shaft across the boat with a sprocket on it, and a chain down to a sprocket on the gearbox shaft?

 

MP.

 

 

 

Same as Kelvin do?

What MP describes is exactly the arrangement we had on Jake to hitch up to the handwheel gear change. And Kelvin and Gleniffer were part of the same family.

 

However, I can't imagine the force required to change gear was anything like the 55lbs or more as quoted in post #43. Presumably, there is a marked difference in operation between the Blackstone and Glen. boxes. Perhaps RWLP can comment.

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?app=galleryℑ=7349

Edited December 10, 2014 by jake_crew

[Timleech]

The Gleniffer box and the old Kelvin boxes used cone clutches and a sliding mainshaft, so the forces involved were not massive. In fact, the Bruntons box for which the GU wheel mechanism was intended use a similar system.

That said, it's all a matter of getting the right gearing ratios to get the required forces.

 

Tim

Edited December 10, 2014 by Timleech

[Proper Job]

Having started the topic, I thought I'd better post what we came up with and installed.

 

So, the challenge was to make the push/pull gear change that was not excessive horizontal travel and still being able to apply the correct pressure/ease of operation.

 

Photo 1 is the main horizontal bar coming through from the rear cabin. It also shows the vertical bars with the dog leg in it and the first fixed pivot point

 

#

 

Photo 2 is the top link and 'slide slot' from the horizontal bar to the vertical lever

 

 

Photo 3 shows the series of intermediate levers to ensure correct direction of operation and transferring the 'distance of operational travel'

 

 

The first pivot point is mounted on the white box section welded to the Eng' room side and the cabin/Eng room bulkhead

 

The second fixed pivot point is a plate welded on the cabin/Eng room bulkhead

 

You can just about make out the vertical actuator from the gearbox in the murky darkness

 

Photo 4 shows reverse gear selected and gives you an idea of the distance of travel

 

 

 

It's all working well at the moment

[frangar]

Can I ask how far the travel is at the handle end?

 

Cheers

 

Gareth

[MoominPapa]

Stroke of genius to apply power assistance from a welding set. Must give you one-finger operation

 

MP.

[Rufford]

 

I'm too busy wrestling with unsuitable controls for much steering to get done!

 

Bad workman blames his tools....

 

I was reliably informed yesterday that my mate whom I have banned from steering Rufford is better at steering her than me...

 

You can't see the potential issues with gear rodding that has to be pushed so far forward into the cabin that you can't reach it again when you want to take it out of gear?

 

Or which pulls so far back in reverse you can't have the cabin doors shut?

 

Fair enough - nobody is making you consider altering yours!

 

Make a shorter lever? As a temporary fix?