My boat has sunk in Kingston (1939 ww2 wooden motor cruiser)

[luctor et emergo]

 

I disagree.

 

Once you lift the boat a few millimetres, the water level inside is a few millimetres above outside so the water will begin to flow OUT. This doesn't need a f-ing big crane. Just enough lifting power to lift the weight of a few millimeters of water, plus the residual weight of the boat. A ton maybe. A decent sized barge on each side will have plenty enough lifting power.

 

Once the levels inside and outside equalise, lift it a few more millimetres. Then repeat as often as necessary. A slow job but perfectly feasible without a f-ing big crane.

 

 

MtB

Question.

How far is the boat underwater?

 

How are the two big barges applying the lifting action?

 

 

And am I correct in understanding that this is in the middle of the river?

[Marcuswarry]

The top is sticking out.. There's a picture right at the start of this epic post!!

 

I think we'll use straps and winches to hold. Her steady as she comes up....will see if we can get lift.. But that would be a bonus I feel...

 

Yes in the middle, between an island and the bank... About 9ft deep...

 

Thanks again everyone for all your advice and help!

 

Marcus

P.s. Peter x is right.. Pumps is what we really need! Mx

[Mickj]

Hi I have pumps but live in the midlands

[NigelMoore]

What time are trying this? I have a 240v 1&1/2" pump in Brentford, but couldn't get there & out to you before 5pm at least.

[KJT]

A correction for a Marcus typo is needed here; his phone number is 0787 nine 812 789

Personally I'd be unhappy about putting my phone number on a public forum, especially in a plain form where a spambot can grab it without needing human intelligence.

 

So as I understand it NB Ellisiana is bringing generators along towards the end of Sunday, by which time Marcus may have got his polythene work done, but the resource he seems to be lacking is enough pumps, either electric to run off the generators, or petrol powered. Can anyone hold themselves ready to bring a pump to the party, date to be confirmed but we seem to be looking at either Sunday evening or Monday? If my presence will be helpful, and especially if I have a bit of warning, I could turn up for either of those.

 

Marcus doubts that there's a major hole below the waterline, but the comments made by MtB and Bizzard on that make sense to me, namely that just in case there is, once Fairstar is raised and a quick inspection establishes at what rate water is getting in, there should be a contingency plan to move her to shallow water somewhere, or even out onto shore if that proves necessary.

Thanks for the correction. I think it will be very late in the afternoon or evening by the time we can get on site.

 

Ken

[luctor et emergo]

I see, I didn't see that photo before (crap phone and connection), so the wheel house is above water.

The lifting idea might work, but will take a long time, and how are you going to winch at a minimum of four points? You need to stable platforms either side. Just a mates (narrow)boat along side is a recipe for disaster. As the boat is, I think Carl's way is the better bet, as it only needs a boat alongside to carry the pumps.

[Arthur Brown]

After having lifted a similar timber boat off the bottom of the Trent, lift applied in the form of air bags or strops from pontoons will assist greatly to raise the inside water level to the point where outward flow will happen, then when no further lift can be applied the pumps are needed and any obvious holes or missing caulking need to be patched.

 

Can we find 100 x 25 litre drums? string them under the boat and fill then with air. They can STAY there til the reason for the sinking is found, effectively the boat has buoyancy added underneath.

 

There is little that pumps can do til the Thames doesn't come back in at the same speed as it's being pumped out.

 

Remember that this is a timber boat and the hull is largely held underwater by the metalwork (engine etc) If we can lift the engine then the boat will slowly creep out of the water.

 

Sadly as this is a mid stream job, a successful salvage will probably need three boats for a long time - at least a LONG day, two to hold equipment on site the other to ferry crew and kit from the shore. Given the recent rain I suspect that the river will rise and the flow will increase bringing the advisability of a safety boat should anything or anyone need rescue.

[Tuscan]

I really hope you are successful she looked a lovely boat , I'm still not clear if the boat was insured I am assuming it wasn't as the insurers do not appear to be helping at all.

[Naughty Cal]

I really hope you are successful she looked a lovely boat , I'm still not clear if the boat was insured I am assuming it wasn't as the insurers do not appear to be helping at all.

Third party only perhaps?

[Marcuswarry]

Hello this had been quite a fascinating thread really.... With a fair amount of chin scratching... And trying to decide which bit of advice to follow... Or which thing to try first.... Thanks again for all your amazing contributions!

 

Having steadfastly set out on the raising of the gunwales using polythene membrane... Which should hopefully be largely finished by late afternoon... I think that means some of these other suggestions are less appropriate now.

 

For example, sticking blow up things inside the boat... Will displace water, and provide buoyancy. Having raised the gunwales... The displaced water won't have anywhere to go... Bit of buoyancy might help... Until water level falls, then it's not doing anything... I gather there is also a risk that internal blow up things, could damage the boat... So I've decided to give hat a miss for now.

 

Similarly, anything that raises the boat... Be it a crane... Winches.... External boyancy under the hull... Will also require the water inside the boat, to be displaced as she rises.... But I've extended the gunwales using polythene... So I've blocked the exit! So at the moment, that strategy isn't entirely appropriate either I think?!

 

What I am hoping to do though, is to have a boat either side, and use straps and winches to steady her as she rises... But even then... There's a risk they could damage my new extended polythene gunwales... So I'll need to be rather careful if I do that too...

 

So the main thing... Is pumps. When I'm happy that the gunwales extension is secure... And I've blocked up any other outlets from the hull... I will set a day to go pump mad, through the roof of the wheelhouse... And hopefully she'll rise steadily!

 

When I set that day, I think that would be the best day for all you megastars that have offered to help to come along, ideally bring a pump, and we can see how it goes!

 

I'll make it a pump party?! Whatever that is... And we could test out a few ales at the boaters in afterwards maybe... If all goes well...

 

Mx

Hello this had been quite a fascinating thread really.... With a fair amount of chin scratching... And trying to decide which bit of advice to follow... Or which thing to try first.... Thanks again for all your amazing contributions!

 

Having steadfastly set out on the raising of the gunwales using polythene membrane... Which should hopefully be largely finished by late afternoon... I think that means some of these other suggestions are less appropriate now.

 

For example, sticking blow up things inside the boat... Will displace water, and provide buoyancy. Having raised the gunwales... The displaced water won't have anywhere to go... Bit of buoyancy might help... Until water level falls, then it's not doing anything... I gather there is also a risk that internal blow up things, could damage the boat... So I've decided to give hat a miss for now.

 

Similarly, anything that raises the boat... Be it a crane... Winches.... External boyancy under the hull... Will also require the water inside the boat, to be displaced as she rises.... But I've extended the gunwales using polythene... So I've blocked the exit! So at the moment, that strategy isn't entirely appropriate either I think?!

 

What I am hoping to do though, is to have a boat either side, and use straps and winches to steady her as she rises... But even then... There's a risk they could damage my new extended polythene gunwales... So I'll need to be rather careful if I do that too...

 

So the main thing... Is pumps. When I'm happy that the gunwales extension is secure... And I've blocked up any other outlets from the hull... I will set a day to go pump mad, through the roof of the wheelhouse... And hopefully she'll rise steadily!

 

When I set that day, I think that would be the best day for all you megastars that have offered to help to come along, ideally bring a pump, and we can see how it goes!

 

I'll make it a pump party?! Whatever that is... And we could test out a few ales at the boaters in afterwards maybe... If all goes well...

 

Mx

[RLWP]

Weigh hay and up she rises, Weigh hay and up she rises, Weigh hay and up she rises early in the morning

 

Richard

[luctor et emergo]

What shall we do with the drunken Unkle? What shall we do with the drunken Unkle? What shall we do with the drunken Unkle early in the morning?

[Nightwatch]

Give him a half and sit him in the corner...........etc.

Edited August 3, 2014 by Nightwatch

[Arthur Brown]

One of the important things to think of is how are you going to get the pumps set up to pump water, you will need a pontoon of some sort that cannot flood, you will need a supply of petrol and/or diesel out there mid stream, all the pumps will need delivery hoses to keep the water out of the work boat.

 

Sorry but I think that you are going to need a lot of help in terms of people, and a lot of help in terms of additional buoyancy to help the available pumps,

[Peter X]

One of the important things to think of is how are you going to get the pumps set up to pump water, you will need a pontoon of some sort that cannot flood, you will need a supply of petrol and/or diesel out there mid stream, all the pumps will need delivery hoses to keep the water out of the work boat.

 

Sorry but I think that you are going to need a lot of help in terms of people, and a lot of help in terms of additional buoyancy to help the available pumps,

There does seem to be a need to orchestrate the boats, people, generators and pumps involved.

It's ultimately up to Marcus to plan and set the timetable for this, and understandably he's been concentrating on getting all the polythene in place first, and consequently spending a lot of time out in mid-river incommunicado.

 

However from his latest post it still sounds as if he will complete the polythene today, and Ellisiana will arrive this evening to assist.

So I guess his pumping day might be tomorrow? I can only suggest that anyone who could bring or loan a boat, generator or pump at some point in the next few days should phone Marcus to give him the details of what and when, so that he can set a schedule and post it in the forum. It certainly sounds as if an extra boat or two would not go amiss so that there's room to set up pumps and a galley to produce a constant supply of cups of tea for the workers.

[Arthur Brown]

The operation on the equipment base boat will determine how successful the lift is. When I raised my boat from the Trent, I spent a day in a dry suit and about ten people were on the bank running pumps and compressors and generators, linking 25l drums for buoyancy etc, and every time a hole showed someone cut a patch of ply to cover it

All of that bank work will need to be done from a work platform on a narrow boat or something else.

 

After the boat is up, there remains the need to find somewhere shallow to leave it so that it can't sink again til it's fixed, which is why I suggested leaving lots of 25l drums underneath so that it was supported at it's mooring.

 

If you think that fitting polythene blind in the water will cover all the holes you are mistaken. Just that with enough pumping you may be able to pump out more than runs in.

[KJT]

Hi guys. We have arrived in Kingston but cannot find any trace of the location of Fairstar. Can anyone assist? We are moored just downstream of Ravens Ait on Queens Promenade. Marcus isn't replying to SMS so I assume he is rather pre-occupied at the moment.

 

Cheers

 

Ken

[magnetman]

Further down under Kingston bridges (road and rail) then ten to 15 minutes after rail bridge there is an island called Stevens ait (Eyot). Go to the right of the island past the rowing club the boat is there.

I'd you are on Queens promenade its about half an hour down there in a Nb at normal speed.

 

PS I think there are overnight moorings on Stevens Ait both sides at the upstream end of the island.

[KJT]

Further down under Kingston bridges (road and rail) then ten to 15 minutes after rail bridge there is an island called Stevens ait (Eyot). Go to the right of the island past the rowing club the boat is there.I'd you are on Queens promenade its about half an hour down there in a Nb at normal speed.

Thanks Magnetman. I guess nothing will happen tonight so I will set off in the morning. I'll probably have been in contact with Marcus by then anyway.

 

Cheers

 

Ken

[RLWP]

The clans are gathering, pumps at the ready

 

Richard

[mango]

TV coverage sorted? Press release?

 

Best of luck.

[Guest]

TV coverage sorted? Press release?

 

Best of luck.

 

You tube at least, surely?

[Ange]

Just to say I've been following this thread from the outset with immense pride in the advice and help that the OP has been offered (with one, but only one, very notable exception)

 

I can't offer anything but my best wishes.

[patty-ann]

y tube would be good. I also have followed thread and I am very reassured by all the support offered since its made me more confident about my choice with regards my boat since its been so clearly illustrated that this is a community willing to help out in times of crises. Brilliant all of you and keep the posts coming. There will always be negativity in situations, tis the way of things. Push those aside and your left with positive plans.

[Marcuswarry]

Hello everyone! Here's my little update for you!

 

Nearly finished attaching the polythene... Final push on that in the next couple of hours... Then I'm hoping not to have to swim around in the Thames again... At least for a little while anyway...

 

I've nailed batons all around the boat, and the polythene is quite nearly wrapped up and attached to the battons with blue string... The idea being, that I can raise the gunwales, fairly quickly when I need to.

 

And so, the idea now, is to add some boyancy around the outside of the keel (either inflatable life rafts which I may be able to get from Adec marine... Or large water containers... That I can then gradually fill with air, using a compressor), and have a boat either side, so that we can level her... And maybe she'll even rise a tad.

 

Then, when stable, and level, I can then raise the gunwales... And then shove loads of pumps through the 'sun roof' and pump like mad!

 

Still not sure what day this be, as I now need to source:

 

Inflatables

Compressor

More pumps.

 

And ensure I pick a day that works for the two boats I need either side of her...

 

Arthur brown has kindly out me in touch with Kingston divers... For fixing the inflatables around the keel... They may not be available for a week though....

 

Yesterday, I touched the bottom of the river bed with my feet.... I figure I could probably attach the various inflatables using my snorkel equipment if needed... I'm becoming a bit of a dab hand?!

 

So many friendly canoeists, rowers, walkers & other boaters have passed by and wishes me well on the mission... On too of all your amazing support, it's incredibly heart warming!

 

I'll keep you posted as I progress!

 

If any of you have any of the things listed above that I could borrow, then please let me know. I totally prepared to buy the necessary things if the loaves and fishes method doesn't bare quite enough fruit... Your all amazing!

 

All the best,

 

Marcus