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Licence Fees

Arthur Marshall

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Just now, PD1964 said:

  At least you’ve had experience hiring and been on the canals and it’s really no ones business how you spend your money as long as your happy. Looking at some of the boats it’s obvious that others haven’t done much boating or they’re destined for Marina life. Can’t understand why some would want a boat without a rope centre eye. Useful for controlling your boat in a variety of situations on the Canal, they seam to want an extra solar panel instead or a skylight.🤷‍♂️


I've probably spent getting on for 6 months actually cruising (as opposed to moored) over the years on a wide variety of boats -- including steam and Bolinder powered, and all possible permutations of layout -- and found a lot of things that don't really work, as well as some that do. After deciding to get a boat built I looked at a lot of new build designs and thought "Why on earth did they do that, it makes no sense?" -- or "Where do they put their [fill in item of your choice]?". Mind you, they probably don't need a storage cupboard for musical instruments... 😉


Centre eye, I've asked for a hire boat to have two centre lines fitted before now so one can run to the bow and one to the stern, to avoid the "the line's at the wrong end" problem (SWMBO is terrible at throwing ropes...) with just two of us on board -- and cursed boats where there's some obstruction on the roof (mushroom, TV aerial, skylight...) near to it which makes it really difficult to flip it over from one side to the other. It's as if people don't think about the practical aspects of living on and travelling on a boat, they just go for something that looks good/neat or are tempted by "Ooh, that's clever!" -- do I need to mention a dinette where the dining table is raised and lowered electrically? 😉


Thought hard about skylights, decided against them for various reasons and instead went for enough 15" portholes and glazed side doors to get light in -- roof has a lot (2.1kW) of solar panels (semi-flexible, sealed to roof, walkable on occasionally) but with gaps wide enough to walk across/step onto the roof at the front, middle (centre eye!) and rear, in case I need to use a lock ladder. Plus little things like flip-down footsteps on the cabin and non-slip paint on the locker tops at the stern in case I have to get on or off the roof, which you do have to do *sometimes*...

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1 hour ago, MartynG said:

Maybe a person such as the theoretical example you describe with more than one boat and  a house is careful how they spend  money which might explain  why they have been able to acquire the assets in the first lace and such a person could easily be ''put off'' by unreasonably high increase in license fees.


 The people most careful with money, in my experience, are those without much. We are the ones going to have to quit. If it comes to a choice between the boat and heating the house or helping out my kids, it isn't really hard to make.

What is interesting has been mentioned above, the comparative increase in the number of cruisers. On my mooring, it was originally nearly all narrowboats and now we are hugely outnumbered by cruisers. They still mostly stay put, but they'd be a lot cheaper. When my boat goes, I shall, slightly sadly, join their ranks.

1 hour ago, MartynG said:



Edited by Arthur Marshall
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1 minute ago, Tonka said:

But reading your posts you are very self opiniated and believe that your design is better then every one else's.  Just read your propellor thread. Your front access thread. You even had to start a thread on use of anchor in an emergency to justify to yourself that you have done it right.


Yes I have opinions, and they're (almost...) always backed up by facts. I'm perfectly happy to debate these with people who disagree so long as they also use facts and not insults, and if they're right and I'm wrong I'll admit it and change my mind -- just like I did with the anchor thread, and again you're wrong about why I started it, I wanted to try and sort out the truth of the matter from the fiction (as QI says).


Front access thread -- never said it was the perfect solution, agreed that other people may well want something different, and that side doors can be a problem for emergency access in locks (as the BSS rules state) -- but that the chance of this ever being a problem are extremely small, and I was happy with that, and it's the best solution for me. What do you disagree with?


Propeller thread -- all based on solid marine engineering facts not "common sense" (which often isn't), so what in particular do you disagree with?


I certainly don't believe that my design is "better then every one else's", but I hope that it is for me -- it's not perfect because any narrowboat design is always a compromise and there are plus and minus points for everything, but after a lot of thought (and some useful feedback from other people, which changed the design) it's the best I could come up with for what I wanted. What do you disagree with?


(I changed my mind on big things like parallel vs. series hybrid, and lead-carbon vs. LFP, and having gas vs. not, and the overall boat layout --  so thanks to everyone who helped with that)


Self-opinionated -- well I have strong opinions and will defend them, and in particular I refuse to give in to bullying from people who claim they know better but sometimes don't (and sometimes do...).


I've spent most of my working (and private) life trying to analyse complex problems with no "perfect" solution and come up with better mouse traps, and where I've ended up professionally (with more than 60 patents, as if you care...) suggests I'm quite good at it. I'm not always right, but I've got the nous to spot when I'm not and change my mind, because otherwise I'd have been out of a job years ago -- unlike some other people on CWDF... 😉

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18 hours ago, Lady C said:

Thank you for the figures, Allan.  By divesting BWML, CRT have deliberately reduced boater share of their income.  However, that doesn't stop them constantly telling boaters that they aren't paying their share.

Where does CRT keep telling boaters this? What do you consider to be the boater's fair share?

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15 minutes ago, Orwellian said:

Where does CRT keep telling boaters this? What do you consider to be the boater's fair share?


We also still don't seem to have established what the actual amounts per year are that boaters (meaning all contributions, not just license fees but also mooring fees paid directly to CART, the CART slice of marina mooring fees, payments to CART from hire boat firms...) and the government (on behalf of all non-boaters) are paying today, both per head (for boaters) and as a percentage of CART income.


Until we know this, it's difficult to have any sensible discussion about what "a fair share" for boaters *should* be when it comes to "boaters vs. the rest" priorities...

Edited by IanD
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31 minutes ago, IanD said:

We also still don't seem to have established what the actual amounts per year are that boaters (meaning all contributions, not just license fees but also mooring fees paid directly to CART, the CART slice of marina mooring fees, payments to CART from hire boat firms...)


Not sure what the problem is, I think what you want is quoted in several places in the annual accounts.




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Edited by Alan de Enfield
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With an increase in license fees how does it affect those who moor on other waterways and pass through CRT waters is there a proportional charge and will more boaters move away from having the CRT as base? Can canals under restoration which are not part of the CRT but linked to it benefit? 

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