Is it just us that complains about volunteer lock keepers

[Arthur Marshall]

I like working locks, but sometimes my two slipped disks decide that it's not as much fun as it could be. What I like best is chugging along and enjoying the place, having someone work a lock for me isn't going to ruin my day. You can have a friendly chat with them, and if you ask them politely to stand back they will.

[haggis]

7 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

What I don’t understand is why go boating on the canals if you don’t really like working locks

 

I didn't ever think I would have to ask for help working locks but  a spell of I'll health (including 4 eye operations ) has forced me into it this year.  Hopefully , despite being pretty ancient,  things will improve and I will be able to enjoy all aspects of boating  again. 

As I said though, I have welcomed help but if I didn't want it, a volockie has always just stepped back and even chatted as I worked the lock. 

You must be boating in the wrong places, Nick 😀

[OldGoat]

Gentleme and boaters -

What "we" forget that competant boaters (as in those who inhabit these fora) are in an huge minority.

Volunteers are provided to give service to everyone else. Its the majority of weekend / hire boaters who provide a lot of CRT's income - and therefore need cosseting - and 'managing'.

The occasional boater-who-knows-what-he-is-doing gets mixed up with the majority and thus becomes subject to whatever training the Volos get.

This obviosly upsets  expedrienced members on here  - mebe steeped in 'that's the way to do it, I and my forbears have always done it that way' syndrone age get upset, thus creating a rant on here....

 

You can't pull rank as no-one understands Vexilology (I tried wearing a Blue once  and everyone thought I was from the Antipodes..

 

The easiest solution mebe is to 'pass away on the other side' as harmonously as possible uttering 'pax vobiscum' as you proceed.

 

These things are sent to try us.

(My Management serves a more than adequeate libation before supper which may account for the verbosity of this post).

Mea Culpa.

 

[MtB]

8 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I like working locks, but sometimes my two slipped disks decide that it's not as much fun as it could be. What I like best is chugging along and enjoying the place, having someone work a lock for me isn't going to ruin my day. You can have a friendly chat with them, and if you ask them politely to stand back they will.

 

I don't know how you manage to do this from 200 yards away, when they start getting the lock ready for you on your approach.

 

By the time I get to a volly-dominated lock, it ha been set in my favour and the gate(s) opened. So when I get there, there is not much I can do other than cruise in and ask them to butt out. Trouble is, by the time I've engaged astern and paid attention to stopping before the far gates, the gate I came in will have been swung shut and the paddles the far end wound open all before I've had two seconds to ask them to leave me to it. 

 

And then they sometimes have the temerity to instruct me to "stay on the boat". I NEVER stay on the boat in locks when single handing. That's the last place one needs to be if summat goes wrong.

 

 

 

 

[nicknorman]

1 minute ago, OldGoat said:

Gentleme and boaters -

What "we" forget that competant boaters (as in those who inhabit these fora) are in an huge minority.

Volunteers are provided to give service to everyone else. Its the majority of weekend / hire boaters who provide a lot of CRT's income - and therefore need cosseting - and 'managing'.

The occasional boater-who-knows-what-he-is-doing gets mixed up with the majority and thus becomes subject to whatever training the Volos get.

This obviosly upsets  expedrienced members on here  - mebe steeped in 'that's the way to do it, I and my forbears have always done it that way' syndrone age get upset, thus creating a rant on here....

 

You can't pull rank as no-one understands Vexilology (I tried wearing a Blue once  and everyone thought I was from the Antipodes..

 

The easiest solution mebe is to 'pass away on the other side' as harmonously as possible uttering 'pax vobiscum' as you proceed.

 

These things are sent to try us.

(My Management serves a more than adequeate libation before supper which may account for the verbosity of this post).

Mea Culpa.

 

The thing is that despite your first sentence which might well be true, today on the Claydon flight most of the boats were hire boats, some with occupants not from these shores. And yet there was no stupidity, no incompetence, no pissing around, no infrastructure damage, no water wasted (except by the volockies). Everything was going smoothly and happily. UNTIL…

 

In truth the shenanigans today were not a huge deal, but it did spoil an otherwise pleasant and tranquil lock flight passage. But it shouldn’t be like that.

[Captain Pegg]

4 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

I don't know how you manage to do this from 200 yards away, when they start getting the lock ready for you on your approach.

 

By the time I get to a volly-dominated lock, it ha been set in my favour and the gate(s) opened. So when I get there, there is not much I can do other than cruise in and ask them to butt out. Trouble is, by the time I've engaged astern and paid attention to stopping before the far gates, the gate I came in will have been swung shut and the paddles the far end wound open all before I've had two seconds to ask them to leave me to it. 

 

And then they sometimes have the temerity to instruct me to "stay on the boat". I NEVER stay on the boat in locks when single handing. That's the last place one needs to be if summat goes wrong.

 

 

 

 

 

Volockies are very welcome to set up locks for me as I approach, and before I get there move on to the next lock.

 

But I don't fall for the idea they are providing me with a service. I'd still be there if they were at home with their feet up, and I wouldn't struggle to work the locks myself.

Edited July 6, 2022 by Captain Pegg

[MtB]

4 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

But I don't fall for the idea they are providing me with a service.

 

 

Quite. They do it for their own personal enjoyment, not out of a sense of service to random boaters.

 

If they were doing it to help out boaters they would turn out on flights on freezing cold days in the slashing rain, when I'd actually appreciate some 'help'. 

 

 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

Quite. They do it for their own personal enjoyment, not out of a sense of service to random boaters.

 

If they were doing it to help out boaters they would turn out on flights on freezing cold days in the slashing rain, when I'd actually appreciate some 'help'. 

 

 

 

That would be a bit like your average gas engineer then?

[magnetman]

36 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

We are shortly heading onto the Thames,  not sure if they have real lock keepers or not these days? I don’t have a problem with the Thames locks, multiple boats fit into the locks and someone has to organise it. Although we haven’t been on the Thames for 5 years or so, I don’t recall any problems

 

Plenty of real lock keepers on the Thames. 

 

The incident about the bloke saying narrow boats were 6ft wide was the only thing that I have ever been concerned about in nearly 30 years of traveling the whole length of the River. 

 

Wave when you pass except that my boat is currently hidden away in a stately home garden under a large copper beech which most people never see. 

 

The River is lovely. 

 

 

36 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

We are shortly heading onto the Thames,  not sure if they have real lock keepers or not these days? I don’t have a problem with the Thames locks, multiple boats fit into the locks and someone has to organise it. Although we haven’t been on the Thames for 5 years or so, I don’t recall any problems

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by magnetman
Double post but can't delete the second repeated quote

[Jerra]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

 

What a load of bollux. They do it because they want to play at operating the locks - something I pay handsomely for to do myself but they compete with me for that pleasure, and they pay NOTHING and expect boaters to be grateful. 

 

 

 

 

A number of volunteer lockies have admitted as much to me

[enigmatic]

46 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

What I don’t understand is why go boating on the canals if you don’t really like working locks?

There's quite a bit of canal in between the locks on most canals!

 

But seriously, most people are perfectly capable of enjoying passing through a lock without doing every single bit of the lock operation themself. I quite like doing locks, have no physical issues whatsoever and am rarely ever pushed for time, but I don't think there's ever a time where I've thought "I hope the next lock is turned against me so I get to turn the paddles and wait a bit" or thought it'd be better if I had to open the gates on both sides of the lock. Also, sometimes me passing through the locks slightly quicker than I would doing it all myself is simply more considerate to the crew behind.

 

Most volockies are smart enough to figure out that if I'm climbing up ladders with a windlass they might be more useful setting locks ahead, and after volockies have speeded up passage through one short flight there's the 9 in 10 locks that don't have volockies left over to enjoy in peace.

 

I get helped by boaters with or without asking far more often and of a far more suspect quality. (Only today a guy asked if he could shut a guillotine gate for me but didn't shut it all the way and completely misunderstood my request about paddles)

 

[Arthur Marshall]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

I don't know how you manage to do this from 200 yards away, when they start getting the lock ready for you on your approach.

 

By the time I get to a volly-dominated lock, it ha been set in my favour and the gate(s) opened. So when I get there, there is not much I can do other than cruise in and ask them to butt out. Trouble is, by the time I've engaged astern and paid attention to stopping before the far gates, the gate I came in will have been swung shut and the paddles the far end wound open all before I've had two seconds to ask them to leave me to it. 

 

And then they sometimes have the temerity to instruct me to "stay on the boat". I NEVER stay on the boat in locks when single handing. That's the last place one needs to be if summat goes wrong.

 

 

 

 

That's only going up, though. Going down, which you must do as often, they may open the gates for you but you can then explain nicely that not only would you like to close them, but you'll do the rest yourself. Of course, if another boater is waiting for the lock and walks up to help, you'll have to tell them to butt out too and just wait a bit longer for the lock while you sort it out all by yourself.

[The Bearwood Boster]

We don't tend to have any issues with vollies as P is always there with them whilst I'm in charge of the boat.The ones at Fradley last month were fab(just after 8 in the morning)& waited for my signal before starting.The one time we had a problem was with an over eager bloke on the  Lapworth flight.I yelled at him that my boat wasn't 'settled ' & he then waited for signals at the next locks.P likes help from vollies,but he likes to oversee what's going on.

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

That's only going up, though. Going down, which you must do as often, they may open the gates for you but you can then explain nicely that not only would you like to close them, but you'll do the rest yourself. Of course, if another boater is waiting for the lock and walks up to help, you'll have to tell them to butt out too and just wait a bit longer for the lock while you sort it out all by yourself.

 

 

Would you like them to drive your boat for you too?

 

Or would you tell them to butt out if they tried? 

 

 

[Captain Pegg]

28 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

There's quite a bit of canal in between the locks on most canals!

 

But seriously, most people are perfectly capable of enjoying passing through a lock without doing every single bit of the lock operation themself. I quite like doing locks, have no physical issues whatsoever and am rarely ever pushed for time, but I don't think there's ever a time where I've thought "I hope the next lock is turned against me so I get to turn the paddles and wait a bit" or thought it'd be better if I had to open the gates on both sides of the lock. Also, sometimes me passing through the locks slightly quicker than I would doing it all myself is simply more considerate to the crew behind.

 

Most volockies are smart enough to figure out that if I'm climbing up ladders with a windlass they might be more useful setting locks ahead, and after volockies have speeded up passage through one short flight there's the 9 in 10 locks that don't have volockies left over to enjoy in peace.

 

I get helped by boaters with or without asking far more often and of a far more suspect quality. (Only today a guy asked if he could shut a guillotine gate for me but didn't shut it all the way and completely misunderstood my request about paddles)

 

 

Agreed that no one relishes finding a lock against them and it is always nice when you arrive at a flight to find they are generally in your favour.

 

The best lock keepers know that setting ahead is the most useful thing they can do and I've had a few who observing me single handed have asked me what I would like them to do. 

 

I do also fairly often have to stop people opening paddles randomly, I think I've p*ssed off a couple of people recently by insisting they do not open the offside paddles on the GU Birmingham line locks until I say so, and frankly I'd prefer it if everyone else just left the paddles alone.

 

 

[magnetman]

When I was single handing on the ditches I found that doing it myself was far quicker than involving anyone else. 

 

Not that there is any hurry but one can have too many cooks in the kitchen. 

 

Slightly alarming idea that you would get volunteer helmspersons. 

 

With the terrible dumbing down one sees these days it could catch on! 

 

Hells teeth. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chris John]

2 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Why?

 

As single hander myself I find them a bloody nuisance, interfering with my enjoyment of operating the historic locks.

Oh well that’s you. I’m happy for them to help. They give their  time for free. Something I guess many of the critic’s have never even thought about!

[rgreg]

I've never had a significant issue with any volunteers in my many encounters throughout the network. Pretty much without exception, I've found them friendly and procedurally correct. It's strange how people's experiences vary. 

This was posted by someone on FB tonight and I would agree with their comments on the Curdworth team:

 

We came down Curdworth Locks yesterday and I must congratulate the team of volunteers who both help boaters through the locks, and carry out the maintenance alongside, and between the locks on the flight, plus the basic lock maintenance.
The whole flight is absolutely pristine, grass cut, weeds removed, paddles and gates greased, just a couple of paddles out of order and bagged; resolution of which is not within their remit!
Such a pleasant contrast to some other areas! Shows the advantage of a well motivated team of volunteers. Well done lads and lasses, a real treat to work through your flight!!! 👍👍👍👍

[Captain Pegg]

1 minute ago, magnetman said:

When I was single handing on the ditches I found that doing it myself was far quicker than involving anyone else. 

 

Not that there is any hurry but one can have too many cooks in the kitchen. 

 

Slightly alarming idea that you would get volunteer helmspersons. 

 

With the terrible dumbing down one sees these days it could catch on! 

 

Hells teeth. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I was just thinking that I do a lot of boating to a schedule and whether or not volockies are there basically makes no difference. A good one will speed you up in isolation but I find that when they start trying to marshal the traffic it has the opposite effect.

 

The whole scheme has a bit of a whiff of being aligned to shiny boating.

 

CRT most definitely have volunteer helms but they don't insist on operating other people's boats...

 

Yet

 

 

[PaulJ]

Funnily enough I passed Telemachus at the bottom of Claydon 👍 on my way up.

One of the vollies was new and his first day so I guess forgivable for turning a lock.

The other guy has worked that flight for at least five years and nice chap who Im always pleased to see and have a chat. Opened gates ready for me and if maybe being a bit slow on the paddles  I just tell em to wack em up.

Went ahead and set the next two locks for me.Just saying-that was my experience a few minutes later.

Nice to say Hello to Telemachus anyhow..🙂

[nicknorman]

10 minutes ago, Chris John said:

 I’m happy for them to help. They give their  time for free. Something I guess many of the critic’s have never even thought about!

Well as I said, I want to give my time for free to shag your wife. Or husband, I’m not fussy, or girlfriend. Or boyfriend, or mother, or father… are you still happy?

[Captain Pegg]

2 minutes ago, PaulJ said:

Funnily enough I passed Telemachus at the bottom of Claydon 👍 on my way up.

One of the vollies was new and his first day so I guess forgivable for turning a lock.

The other guy has worked that flight for at least five years and nice chap who Im always pleased to see and have a chat. Opened gates ready for me and if maybe being a bit slow on the paddles  I just tell em to wack em up.

Went ahead and set the next two locks for me.Just saying-that was my experience a few minutes later.

Nice to say Hello to Telemachus anyhow..🙂

 

I encountered a good volockie at Claydon a month or two ago. Quite possibly the same guy. I think he was the only one I encountered on the whole of the Oxford up to Braunston. 

[Captain Pegg]

It would be interesting to know how many people that start their volunteering on the canals because of the 'front of shop' nature of volockies go on to do other things. I know there are some who take a wider interest and get involved in other things as they learn about canals.

 

Of all the things someone could do to help the canals in the voluntary sector it is almost certainly the least useful, so it would be instructive to know if it helps or hinders the sector overall.

 

 

[nicknorman]

7 minutes ago, PaulJ said:

Funnily enough I passed Telemachus at the bottom of Claydon 👍 on my way up.

One of the vollies was new and his first day so I guess forgivable for turning a lock.

The other guy has worked that flight for at least five years and nice chap who Im always pleased to see and have a chat. Opened gates ready for me and if maybe being a bit slow on the paddles  I just tell em to wack em up.

Went ahead and set the next two locks for me.Just saying-that was my experience a few minutes later.

Nice to say Hello to Telemachus anyhow..🙂

Aha so now I have a name to a face… yes nice to say hello to you too. I don’t have a problem with volockies setting ahead … EXCEPT when they turn a lock on an oncoming boater, which reflects badly on us.

 

I’ll just pick up on your point about “worked … for five years …”. What if they have been doing it wrong for 5 years? Time served is not necessarily a marker of competence.

 

[PaulJ]

Just now, Captain Pegg said:

 

I encountered a good volockie at Claydon a month or two ago. Quite possibly the same guy. I think he was the only one I encountered on the whole of the Oxford up to Braunston. 

Top bloke with a bloody good memory too.

Looked quite hurt when I was geeing him up about no one being there a couple of weeks ago 😀

Did see three no less on my way up Napton last time too- well at the bottom anyhow-still every bit helps.