Parking on the Gloucester Sharpness

[doratheexplorer]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I refer you to the 1st sentence in his first post

 

I am thinking about buying a boat and spending a large part of the year on the Gloucester Sharpness as a CC.

Which, and lets be very clear about this, is in no way illegal!

 

1.  Remaining parked in one spot outside a supermarket for a large part of the year, where a 2 hour restriction applies.

2.  Being a continuous cruiser and spending a large part (but not all) of your cruising on a 16 mile canal. 

 

These two scenarios are very different.  However, I would excuse your initial response (post #5) as being intended as helpful.  The problem is that the thread became increasingly diverted on to generally attacking of the OP's intentions using various incorrect assumptions.  Once those assumptions were shown to be false, the honourable thing to do would be been to apologise.  The barest minimum would have been to drop it.  Yet only a few minutes ago you were still insinuating that the OP was proposing to do something illegal.

[alias]

Off topic but might raise a smile. On visiting a local marina shop:

 

Me: Have you got any smokeless coal please?

 

Him: Why on earth would you want coal in this weather!

 

Me: Your coal is usually wet as you store it outside, so I want to put an opened bag under my cratch cover to dry out for use when it gets chilly.

 

Him: Oh I see.

 

Me: So just the one bag please.

 

Him: We haven't got any in stock.

 

[doratheexplorer]

Just now, peter n said:

Off topic but might raise a smile. On visiting a local marina shop:

 

Me: Have you got any smokeless coal please?

 

Him: Why on earth would you want coal in this weather!

 

Me: Your coal is usually wet as you store it outside, so I want to put an opened bag under my cratch cover to dry out for use when it gets chilly.

 

Him: Oh I see.

 

Me: So just the one bag please.

 

Him: We haven't got any in stock.

 

Staffed by a forum member I presume?

[Lewisdb]

13 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I refer you to the 1st sentence in his first post

 

I am thinking about buying a boat and spending a large part of the year on the Gloucester Sharpness as a CC.

Well hopefully when the bloke points out that he didn't know the shop was so close and he's got a friend that lives opposite who's drive he can use you wouldn't spend the next two hours banging on about the local parking regs!

[David Mack]

26 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I refer you to the 1st sentence in his first post.

 

I am thinking about buying a boat and spending a large part of the year on the Gloucester Sharpness as a CC.

 

18 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

Which, and lets be very clear about this, is in no way illegal!

 

One can argue about the precise meaning of "illegal", but as several posters pointed out, any boater planning to spend "a large part of the year" as a CCer on the Gloucester and Sharpness is going to have an uphill struggle to "satisfy the Board" (CRT) that he intends to comply with the requirements of the 1995 Act in relation to boats without a home mooring. And early on in the thread a link was posted to a case where the Ombudsman upheld CRT's actions in a very similar case.

 

It was only later that the OP clarified that he was intending to CC on the G&S  for 3-4 months per year. Again, in my view, difficult to justify as satisfying the CC requirements, but not as difficult as doing so for "a large part of the year".

Edited August 25, 2020 by David Mack

[doratheexplorer]

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

 

 

One can argue about the precise meaning of "illegal", but as several posters pointed out, any boater planning to spend "a large part of the year" as a CCer on the Gloucester and Sharpness is going to have an uphill struggle to "satisfy the Board" (CRT) that he intends to comply with the requirements of the 1995 Act in relation to boats without a home mooring. And early on in the thread a link was posted to a case where the Ombudsman upheld CRT's actions in a very similar case.

 

It was only later that the OP clarified that he was intending to CC on the G&S  for 3-4 months per year. Again, in my view, difficult to justify as satisfying the CC requirements, but not as difficult as doing so for "a large part of the year".

3-4 months is a large part of the year.

[David Mack]

Just now, doratheexplorer said:

3-4 months is a large part of the year.

 

In your opinion. 

But presented, without qualification, in the OP I think most people would read it as being substantially longer - probably more than half the year.

My intention in responding to the OP was to point out that CCing in one area does not comply with the rules, something many (but not all) new CCers struggle to comprehend. And maybe to cause the OP to pause and do a little more research before committing himself, and his money, to a situation which may not work out.

[Murflynn]

7 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

But most importantly, your response would be relevant to the question and would be in the spirit of helpfulness.

so warning someone that their perceived plans are impractical or outside the spirit of the CC rules is unhelpful?

 

what should we do, just say "yes dear, whatever you think ...................    and by the way there is a lovely parking spot on the High Street just off Fretherne Bridge" ?

[doratheexplorer]

9 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

so warning someone that their perceived plans are impractical or outside the spirit of the CC rules is unhelpful?

 

what should we do, just say "yes dear, whatever you think ...................    and by the way there is a lovely parking spot on the High Street just off Fretherne Bridge" ?

Again, nobody is suggesting that, but thanks for the information.  The area around Fretherne Bridge is indeed lovely.

 

Their perceived plans have been clarified and the OP has clearly stated that CRT are happy with them.  Yet forum members are still sniping at him.

[Captain Pegg]

4 hours ago, Murflynn said:

so warning someone that their perceived plans are impractical or outside the spirit of the CC rules is unhelpful?

 

what should we do, just say "yes dear, whatever you think ...................    and by the way there is a lovely parking spot on the High Street just off Fretherne Bridge" ?

That would of course be fine but it’s clear that those posting such comments on this thread have more than enough intelligence to know their style and tone is not particularly likely to be influential. It may not initially have been intended to be aggressive but the thread has deteriorated to that and it takes two sides for that to happen.

 

We should be in no doubt there are many boaters on the network who cruise less than the distance or range available on the G&S during the winter months. They do this by complying with the basic provision of the law during that period and cruising more extensively during the remainder of the year. Whether that is within the ‘spirit’ or the ‘original intention’ of the law is immaterial. As things stand it seems to satisfy the board. What we cannot say is that it will continue to do so.
 

My personal view is that providing boaters move every 14 days and don’t shuffle - in order to avoid long term annoyance to neighbours or gain an advantage over those who have legitimately paid to remain moored in one spot - then it makes very little odds how far they actually move. As a fellow licence holder I can only encounter them in one place at a time after all.

 

Therefore I don’t think it’s particularly fair to bring the spirit of the rules into the discussion regarding one single boater, that’s a subject that should have a broader airing as one boater in isolation isn’t the problem and from their perspective it is understanding what the legal requirement says and how they are going to comply that matters. Some canals are clearly enhanced by having a community of live-aboard boaters and others blighted by it. It’s a question of scale rather than the fault of the individual boater.
 

Answer me one thing if you will please, many of those on this thread who openly disapprove do not have boats on CRT waters and from what I can gather from past postings for some their boating is - or was - not ever predominantly on CRT water. Is there something more to this?

 

JP

Edited August 25, 2020 by Captain Pegg

[Murflynn]

1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

Again, nobody is suggesting that, but thanks for the information.  The area around Fretherne Bridge is indeed lovely.

 

Their perceived plans have been clarified and the OP has clearly stated that CRT are happy with them.  Yet forum members are still sniping at him.

no evidence has been provided AFAIK   ................................  just a statement for which I asked clarification that was never offered to my knowledge.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

no evidence has been provided AFAIK   ................................  just a statement for which I asked clarification that was never offered to my knowledge.

Perhaps because it's got nothing to do with you or any one else on here?

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, Captain Pegg said:

Answer me one thing if you will please, many of those on this thread who openly disapprove do not have boats on CRT waters and from what I can gather from past postings for some their boating is - or was - not ever predominantly on CRT water. Is there something more to this?

I can only speak for myself, We have had boats on BW / C&RT waterways for 30 + years and on & off had sea going boats  for the same time period.

 

SWBMO was 'put off' the sea in around 2004 when on a trip back from Scotland  the waves were breaking over the flybridge and it was 'never again'

 

The Sea-boat was sold and we continued only with the Canal / River boats (changing to a new boat every 2 or 3 years) until October 2019 when we had had enough of the continued C&RT failings, never being able to plan a cruise because 'something' would break or there would not be enough / too much water, ever increasing costs, more and more 'pi$$ takers'.

 

We went 'back to the sea'.

The last 15 years have been pretty much 100% canal & river.

 

Hopefully (Mr Pegg) that answers your question

[LadyG]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I can only speak for myself, We have had boats on BW / C&RT waterways for 30 + years and on & off had sea going boats  for the same time period.

 

SWBMO was 'put off' the sea in around 2004 when on a trip back from Scotland  the waves were breaking over the flybridge and it was 'never again'

 

The Sea-boat was sold and we continued only with the Canal / River boats (changing to a new boat every 2 or 3 years) until October 2019 when we had had enough of the continued C&RT failings, never being able to plan a cruise because 'something' would break or there would not be enough / too much water, ever increasing costs, more and more 'pi$$ takers'.

 

We went 'back to the sea'.

The last 15 years have been pretty much 100% canal & river.

 

Hopefully (Mr Pegg) that answers your question

off topic, and the reason many men say wives don't like it is that a lot of [less than confident] skippers resort to bullying, the wife loses confidence, never stands watch/skips the boat singlehanded, so instead of enjoying strong conditions with full confidence in both boat and skipper, they get worried, I don't blame them .....

I sailed with an experienced ski;;er, I did all deck work, but then he bought a big racing type boat, I could not handle the sails, it was not seaworthy or sea kindly so we motored to Ardentinny and back .....

I bought my own boat. When you are skipper and crew, it's a different ball game.

I

Edited August 25, 2020 by LadyG

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, LadyG said:

off topic, and the reason many men say wives don't like it is that a lot of [less than confident] skippers resort to bullying, the wive loses confidence, never stands watch/skips the boat singlehanded, so instead of enjoying strong conditions with full confidence in both boat and skipper, they get worried, I don't blame them .....

 

You have no idea.

[Murflynn]

3 hours ago, The Happy Nomad said:

Perhaps because it's got nothing to do with you or any one else on here?

presumably Dora is a confidante who knows more than she is saying and therefore doesn't need any evidence. 

[Guest]

Just now, Murflynn said:

presumably Dora is a confidante who knows more than she is saying and therefore doesn't need any evidence. 

Perhaps, who knows? 

 

But either way,  still doesn't make it your business, or mine or anybody elses.

[Captain Pegg]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I can only speak for myself, We have had boats on BW / C&RT waterways for 30 + years and on & off had sea going boats  for the same time period.

 

SWBMO was 'put off' the sea in around 2004 when on a trip back from Scotland  the waves were breaking over the flybridge and it was 'never again'

 

The Sea-boat was sold and we continued only with the Canal / River boats (changing to a new boat every 2 or 3 years) until October 2019 when we had had enough of the continued C&RT failings, never being able to plan a cruise because 'something' would break or there would not be enough / too much water, ever increasing costs, more and more 'pi$$ takers'.

 

We went 'back to the sea'.

The last 15 years have been pretty much 100% canal & river.

 

Hopefully (Mr Pegg) that answers your question

For clarity I was really enquiring as to whether the reasons were boating or social rather than the reason anyone left the canals. The only thing I can draw from the above is that you potentially view the OP as a pisstaker. That can’t really be the case for someone who doesn’t appear to actually yet own a boat. Whatever anyone may have thought - or perhaps been lead to believe by others that they could do - at the outset always has the ability to evolve once they actually get afloat. I suspect it pretty much always does for all but the most foolhardy. That’s one reason healthy challenge on this forum is valid.
 

I can understand boaters in certain places having issues with the numbers of liveaboards without home moorings but what annoyances did you experience in your CRT days, latterly I know you were Trent/Humber region. Were there issues there or anywhere else you could access, and if not what about when you were fully canal enabled?

 

JP

[Captain Pegg]

6 hours ago, David Mack said:

 

In your opinion. 

But presented, without qualification, in the OP I think most people would read it as being substantially longer - probably more than half the year.

My intention in responding to the OP was to point out that CCing in one area does not comply with the rules, something many (but not all) new CCers struggle to comprehend. And maybe to cause the OP to pause and do a little more research before committing himself, and his money, to a situation which may not work out.

That’s fair comment and it may have happened given the clarification. Equally it may always have been the intention.

[Murflynn]

12 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

 The only thing I can draw from the above is that you potentially view the OP as a pisstaker. That can’t really be the case for someone who doesn’t appear to actually yet own a boat. 

but he describes himself as a "genuine CCer" .........................   is it any wonder that some of us think he is a pisstaker?

[doratheexplorer]

17 hours ago, Murflynn said:

no evidence has been provided AFAIK   ................................  just a statement for which I asked clarification that was never offered to my knowledge.

Are you even serious?  Evidence??? This forum now needs member to provide evidence to back up everything they say, even when it's got precisely sod all to do with you, or anyone else here, does it?  The OP says he's checked with CRT and they're happy.  Do you seriously expect the OP to now publish private correspondence between him and CRT just to please you??  What planet are you on?

[LadyG]

15 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You have no idea.

Sorry, I did not aim that at you,it was an aside........, a general observation..... 

Edited August 26, 2020 by LadyG

[doratheexplorer]

14 hours ago, Murflynn said:

presumably Dora is a confidante who knows more than she is saying and therefore doesn't need any evidence. 

Presumably nothing.  I have no idea who the OP is.  Presumably you'll need evidence of that too before you'll be satisfied.

[Flyboy]

6 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

Are you even serious?  Evidence??? This forum now needs member to provide evidence to back up everything they say, even when it's got precisely sod all to do with you, or anyone else here, does it?  The OP says he's checked with CRT and they're happy.  Do you seriously expect the OP to now publish private correspondence between him and CRT just to please you??  What planet are you on?

Perhaps if the OP posts a copy of CRT's permission it would put the matter to bed.

[doratheexplorer]

1 minute ago, LadyG said:

Sorry, I did not aim that at you,it was an aside........, a general observation..... 

Don't apologise for sharing your own experiences and observations. 

 

It's incredibly common on the canals for boating couples to have the man doing all the steering and the woman doing everything else.  When asked why, the common response: "Oh she doesn't like steering, she get's nervous".  Draw your own conclusions...

1 minute ago, Flyboy said:

Perhaps if the OP posts a copy of CRT's permission it would put the matter to bed.