Nightwatch Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 1 hour ago, The Gravy Boater said: I would love to have a yappy dog but as previously stipulated I don't need the worry/responsibility as a solo boater. Maybe I'll be converted at some point... but not yet. Great companions not only to us, but also each other. When the time is right you may make the decision. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gravy Boater Posted June 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 14 minutes ago, Nightwatch said: Great companions not only to us, but also each other. When the time is right you may make the decision. I already know that you're right. I need to get over all the other complexities of being relatively new to the cut before I would be comfortable managing a dog. Once the boat is sorted and I've done my first long trip (Upper Shropshire Union to Northampton) I will have no excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Nightwatch said: Great companions not only to us, but also each other. Or, a pain in the arse, barking all the time and shitting everywhere. The trouble is that these days some people treat their dogs a bit like children and don't want the responsibility of controlling them. So they selfishly and inconsiderately just let their dogs do whatever they want including defecating outside other people's boats and irritating everyone with their incessant barking. Just an alternative opinion. Edited June 25, 2020 by blackrose 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightwatch Posted June 25, 2020 Report Share Posted June 25, 2020 50 minutes ago, blackrose said: Or, a pain in the arse, barking all the time and shitting everywhere. The trouble is that these days some people treat their dogs a bit like children and don't want the responsibility of controlling them. So they selfishly and inconsiderately just let their dogs do whatever they want including defecating outside other people's boats and irritating everyone with their incessant barking. Just an alternative opinion. Is your first sentence aimed at me and the wife? Coz we dont. Nor do we, knowingly treat our dogs as you describe in the following paragraph. Quite an aggressive opinion to have. Tar and brushed comes to mind. You may not like some dog owners, but the majority I know are responsible owners and act accordingly. I was once moored near another boater and he openly admitted emptying his cassette in the hedge. (it all rots away doesn't it) Do all cassette users do the same? I think not!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reg Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 (edited) Here is what I did to cover the emergency exit requirement to have an easily located key. Simply bought some flat plate rare earth magnets and applied them as in the picture and always keep one of the spare keys on it. Simple, cheap and effective. Edited June 26, 2020 by reg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonesBoy Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 We have the same locks as in post #3 they have 1000’s of key patterns and if you have more than one lock you can get them with the same key pattern to open them all. Very strong and easy to fit. When on the boat we just leave the key in the lock + good place to hang my coat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 9 hours ago, reg said: Here is what I did to cover the emergency exit requirement to have an easily located key. Simply bought some flat plate rare earth magnets and applied them as in the picture and always keep one of the spare keys on it. Simple, cheap and effective. Get someone to blindfold you, turn you round a couple of times and see how long it takes you to find the key and then get out of the boat, When you are crawling on the floor under the smoke its a whole new world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keeping Up Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 On 15/06/2020 at 15:50, cuthound said: Most boats are broken into via large side windows, especially if all other doors appear to be well secured... Must saying. ? I believe side hatches are a more popular means of entry, especially those with an opening lid in the roof. They are often very poorly secured, by a couple of bolts that can be snapped easily and quietly, leaving no visible sign that they have been disturbed. That is how Mr Finch got into our boat and many others; I was grateful for his lesson in security. The top lid of ours now has a loop attached inside, to which a length of chain can be hooked (using a bottle-screw). The other end of this chain attaches to loop that is fixed under the gunwale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terryb Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 So you lock yourself in the boat. I don't. So don't see that as an issue. And getting a key cut from a photograph to burgle a boat that moves around the system. Good luck with that. And Jen. There is a mark on the key providing the correct position. Its always vertical anyway, so just one possible wrong choice anyway. How much wine had you, before trying the 4 ways. ? 36 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said: Get someone to blindfold you, turn you round a couple of times and see how long it takes you to find the key and then get out of the boat, When you are crawling on the floor under the smoke its a whole new world Please don't lock your self in the boat. I'm not sure of any good logical reason to do that. Besides if I ever was in that position, I'd simply get out from the other end or either side hatch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Terryb said: Please don't lock your self in the boat. I'm not sure of any good logical reason to do that. Besides if I ever was in that position, I'd simply get out from the other end or either side hatch. Unless they were all locked as well and you have 4 keys round your neck and need to find the right one. Also someone may need to come in to get you out Edited June 26, 2020 by ditchcrawler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bod Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 On 24/06/2020 at 14:45, Terryb said: Iv'e just fitted an Enfield type garage door bolt to my hatch. I have to say, it's the doggies danglers. Especially since now, you cant tell if It is locked or unlocked. Those locks look easy to drill out. Just brass bodies, M8 drill and large screwdriver....door open. Bod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 Best lock on the outside of a door is none at all showing. I never lock my boat unless it is left on its own in an area I am unsure of. Never fasten any exit when on board. With windows its a waste of time, the scroats just kick them in. TD' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reg Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 3 hours ago, ditchcrawler said: Get someone to blindfold you, turn you round a couple of times and see how long it takes you to find the key and then get out of the boat, When you are crawling on the floor under the smoke its a whole new world When I am in the boat the main key set is in the lock all of the time which means it's simple half turn to open the lock. I removed it so that the spare key placement could be shown clearly in the photo. I would suggest that my method is even quicker than using a bolt lock on the door. I have 4 means of exit all of which can be opened very quickly. I am more than happy with my arrangements but I genuinely thank you for your concern. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terryb Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Bod said: Those locks look easy to drill out. Just brass bodies, M8 drill and large screwdriver....door open. Bod. What is it with you people. Someone offers advice with the best intentions. Then some clever know it all hacks the post to pieces. If you have nothing positive to add, go and take the dog for a walk. I'm getting sick to death of all these nayslayers. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bod Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Terryb said: What is it with you people. Someone offers advice with the best intentions. Then some clever know it all hacks the post to pieces. If you have nothing positive to add, go and take the dog for a walk. I'm getting sick to death of all these nayslayers. Terry, do you secure your boat with with cheap locks that are easily overcome, or use good quality locks that will remain secure? The locks in the photos are not the most secure, in these days of cheap battery drills, and are designed to be supplementary locks used in pairs. The "escapability" of these locks being used in a way, that was not designed for, is a very valid question. You may feel the advice was given with best intentions, however the advice did have some short comings. Bod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, Bod said: Terry, do you secure your boat with with cheap locks that are easily overcome, or use good quality locks that will remain secure? The locks in the photos are not the most secure, in these days of cheap battery drills, and are designed to be supplementary locks used in pairs. The "escapability" of these locks being used in a way, that was not designed for, is a very valid question. You may feel the advice was given with best intentions, however the advice did have some short comings. Bod. Locks can only ever be a deterrent. The determined thief will get in - end of!! So it doesn't really matter if they are relatively easy to overcome, or impossible. There will be very few places on the canals where there wont be a rock, or something, nearby, with which to smash a few windows. I agree that serious consideration should be given to getting out when the smoke and/or flames are licking your arse. Unlocked, Thumb Turn, Yale Type, are all fairly easy to operate. Something needing a key which may, or may not, be in the lock or easily to hand, could result in disaster. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reg Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 (edited) So how do you install the yale lock on a sliding hatch? So how do you install a yale lock on a pair of metal doors, the type that meet in the middle? The one thing I'm sure of is that if I wanted to I could find fault with every single security system on every single boat for every single member of this forum. Edited June 26, 2020 by reg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 22 minutes ago, reg said: So how do you install the yale lock on a sliding hatch? So how do you install a yale lock on a pair of metal doors, the type that meet in the middle? Try one of these, available from UK sellers too. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Taylor-Lock-Co-C888-Jimmy-Resistant-Security-Double-Cylinder-Lock-NEW/114271152184? They lock by winding multiple bolts into holes in the keep. TD' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 2 hours ago, reg said: So how do you install the yale lock on a sliding hatch? So how do you install a yale lock on a pair of metal doors, the type that meet in the middle? The one thing I'm sure of is that if I wanted to I could find fault with every single security system on every single boat for every single member of this forum. I was responding specifically to Bob, who was questioning fitting less than the most secure locks. I added some thoughts on lock types, and probably didn’t cover every example of a relatively safe type. It’s possible there may not be one for every situation. Your description isn’t great, but if I’m picturing the right thing, you could probably fit a lock with a thumb turn internally, and a keyhole externally. No idea with a sliding hatch... I like the idea provided above, apart from the need for a key internally. There may be a variation somewhere. I leave mine unlocked when on board. I just recall the fireman who told me how sad it was every time he found someone overcome by smoke at a door with no key, or a set of keys in their hand, that they hadn’t been able to work. It seems sensible to give some serious thought to the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Richard10002 said: I just recall the fireman who told me how sad it was every time he found someone overcome by smoke at a door with no key, or a set of keys in their hand, that they hadn’t been able to work. It seems sensible to give some serious thought to the issue. When you do escape training in a smoked filled units you soon realise that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard10002 Posted June 26, 2020 Report Share Posted June 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said: When you do escape training in a smoked filled units you soon realise that That’s probably where I heard it. Speke Airport in the late 1970’s IIRC. Stayed with me all these years, and I think I subconsciously check for ways out wherever I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 16 hours ago, Richard10002 said: Locks can only ever be a deterrent. The determined thief will get in - end of!! So it doesn't really matter if they are relatively easy to overcome, or impossible. There will be very few places on the canals where there wont be a rock, or something, nearby, with which to smash a few windows. This doesn't make any sense. Of course it matters! The better the deterrent the less likely a thief will want to break in (i.e. the more the thief will be deterred.) Also most thieves don't want to climb in through broken windows and they don't want to make a lot of noise, although if you have bow door windows then on some boats those can be broken and the doors unlocked to gain access. I have all portholes so even if a rock is used to break a (few?) window(s) they still won't get in that way. A determined thief who's well equipped will get in if they want to. However most bot thieves are opportunists and won't have more than a screwdriver to lever off a weak hasp. Professional equipped burglars tend to stick to houses where there are greater pickings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 16 hours ago, Terryb said: What is it with you people. Someone offers advice with the best intentions. Then some clever know it all hacks the post to pieces. If you have nothing positive to add, go and take the dog for a walk. I'm getting sick to death of all these nayslayers. Years ago on a thread about security, in response to me saying that I had all portholes to deter thieves, a certain young forum member countered someone could still break one of my portholes and chuck in a burning rag, idiotically changing the topic from security to wanton vandalism. That member is now the site owner! ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuthound Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 14 hours ago, reg said: So how do you install the yale lock on a sliding hatch? So how do you install a yale lock on a pair of metal doors, the type that meet in the middle? The one thing I'm sure of is that if I wanted to I could find fault with every single security system on every single boat for every single member of this forum. The Yale lock is fitted to the outer leaf of the two doors which meet in the middle. The inner leaf has bolts top and bottom, which hold it closed so that the tongue of the Yale lock chold the outer leaf closed against the inner leaf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reg Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, cuthound said: The Yale lock is fitted to the outer leaf of the two doors which meet in the middle. The inner leaf has bolts top and bottom, which hold it closed so that the tongue of the Yale lock chold the outer leaf closed against the Edited my reply out as it was incorrect. This setup could work for some situations. However It is not ideal when used in conjunction with a sliding hatch. I much prefer my garage door type locks. Edited June 27, 2020 by reg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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